This comes from Kommersant so take it with a pinch of salt:

A contract for 76 su-57 worth up to 170 billion may be signed on MAKS-2019 – newspaper

https://z5h64q92x9.net/proxy_u/ru-en.en/https/www.militarynews.ru/story.asp?rid=1&nid=508325&lang=RU

If correct, would mean each Su-57 would cost ca. 2.2 billion ruble, so quite close to the values we know for Su-35 and Su-30. Putin referred to weapons and ground equipment too, so I am not convinced the info is reliable, hopefully we will know more in the near future.

I remenber Borisov told Su-57 only was slighter superior to Su-35 S, so prices per unit should be not enough different. First units of course will be expensive while production line is not ready but when production line will be normalized and assembling 10-12 units per year, prices should be similar.

[USER=”76365″]RALL[/USER]

we are not talking about a laser but about a wide band radar.

Yes, Rofar it can have a wide band than traditional radars, but do not change what i told. It works like a laser beam.

With this technology you have 2 big problems, if it works on a big frequency (better resolution) wil be big attenuation atmospheric ergo you need very big power, and problem with a laser beam. It is usuless for searching on a long range.:apologetic:

plasma stealth is indeed experimented. How ever, it would be incredibly costly to use it on an aircraft. Could be used to hide antennas for example, and only on a ultra stealth plane/drone.

Yes, same experimental than Rofar. but people need believe will be avalabile in short/medium time. Maybe never will be avalaible, beyond prototypes. Because not all are advantages, it has some big dissadvantages.

The US is not forcing anything on Canada. All we ask is that Canada sticks to the agreement that they not only willingly signed, but are currently benefiting from to the tune of $Billions.

+1

The thing is that Urcelay is navy, so he hasn’t much to say on F-18 substitutes, those responsible for the F-18 substitution have already required 40 more eurofighters and have clearly stated that even when they would like to get F35A they understand that Eurofighter is the best option for Spain now, of course it includes budgetary, political and industrial considerations.
Will Spain get F35s? maybe, of course, it is an interesting platform with some unique capabilities but as we all know there are many things to be considered but in any case, I don’t see F35s coming in the 2020s maybe around 2030s depending on budgets, FCAS development and other political and strategic considerations.
To say that Spain will get that quantity of F35A and that other of F35B is not accurate as even when is true that there’s interest both in the navy and the air force, it’s also true that as of now there are no budgets allocated for F35s and that the air force even requested eurofighters whereas the fixed-wing capability of the navy is both expensive, underused and very questionable from a doctrinal point of view. I would gladly see those F35Bs but I do think that there are plenty of needs ahead of them and I think that those taking the decisions do think the same.

Urcelay told, Navy+EdA did a common study for to buy F-35 together, and they present it to ministery of defence. We dont know if will be a study the all F-35B, maybe 12-14 for Navy and around 30 for EdA, or 12-14 f-35B for Navy and 30 F-35 A for EdA. But this study was presented few time ago. And there are contacts, USA make confirmation about it few days ago.

If you read me well, i did not tell Spain will buy F-35 A surely, i told that maybe will buy F-35A or not. But sure, F-35B will be bought for Navy.

I know some person which have contacts inside, and he told that idea was to buy now 30-40 EF tranche 3 ( for replace the most older F-18´s). And on 2025-2030 to buy F-35b for navy and around 30 F-35A for replace the last F-18´s on the EdA. But of course, this idea can change on future.

Yes, upgraded Typhoons with AESA Radars (Captors) combined with New F-35A’s to replace the Hornets and F-35B’s to replace the Harriers. Then in about twenty years when the Typhoons start to retire. They would be replaced with the NGF’s just coming online…

Also, speaking of the F-35’s. Maybe the US could offer a mix of New and Used F-35’s to aid Spain with the cost. For most of the F-35’s needed are for the Spanish Air Force. These could be new F-35A’s as the price keeps dropping nicely. Yet, instead of new F-35B’s. Which, are much more expensive. Maybe the Spanish Navy could acquire a small number of rebuilt F-35B’s from the USMC. Especially, considering the Navy only needs a very small number!

Just a thought…

Well, the problem was the expensive european programs. For example, Nh90 helicopter is around 60 millione euros per unit. :very_drunk: And it was not militar decition, because militar wanted Blackhawk. Politicians choose the most expensive solution, How many Sh-60 can buy for 1.400 million euros?:eagerness:

And it is not a joke, it is what Spain will pay for 23 units, more than 1400 million euros. And not only this. A400 program same, very expensive…

Spain is the 4th economy in euro zone. The problem is not the money, the problem is to take bad decitions on the programs which will affect on future. And i told, Spain will get around 30-40 new EF tranche 3 nextly and it will be around 20% expensive than F-35.

it does not matter if you build in Spain EF, because material cost and human cost is not free. You need pay it, the only good think is to create quality employnement around this. For this too to enjoy on next generation fighter…

But, will be a mistake only get EF until 2040. It is a big mistake.

F-35B will come to Armada, but i would like 30-35 units F-35 A for EdA, it would be perfect. And of course Spain can buy it, but will be a political decition, and this is the problem.

Look germany, how ridiculous. They decided do not buy F-35, and now is thinking about get more years the very old Tornados wich will have a very very expensive cost because is the only airplane which can bring tactical nuclear weapon, and EF can not. This is a problem when you have ridiculous politicians taken militar decitions. Some german general was fired for telling germany need buy F-35.:stupid:

053 is a modified prototype. IIRC, it is supposed be able to act as a UCAV command ship (for the Sukhoi S-70 “Okhotnik”?). There is one ‘device’ one on top (where the IRST used to be) and in front of the FLG – Link

All 053 photos from RussianPlanes.net – Link

Thank you very much.

The question is simple for any westerners, and the answer seems as simple, but in fact it is not so. You need to look at the issue from the other sides.

Let’s look at original roadmap of PAK-FA program. The program is out of schedule, but was it looks believable from the beginning? Maybe. The developers clearly did not understand all the aspects of developing 5th gen fighter. It looks like their estimation was based on the experience of developing 4th gen fighters in USSR. The PFI program (Su-27) started in 1971. Delivery to the VVS started in 1984, and officially adopted to service only in 1990. The LFI (MiG-29) is roughly the same story. So 13 years of development plus 1-2 years on top as a buffer = thoughts of the PAK-FA planners. It is also possible that the roadmap was created by somebody on highest level. In this case the developers really could only accept it. Back then it was 1000% better deal than what they have had in 90’s. Otherwise the government could easily decide to buy Rafale, for example (like they bought Mistral ships from France). So pointing to initial schedule as an argument to “PAK-FA is done” is just meh. PAK-FA is “only” 18 years in development, compare it to JSF or ATF, none of 5th gen fighter was developed in such a time limit (exception is J-20 but is it really 5th gen fighter by western standarts?). Even this point is enough to understand why we see no batches of 100’s of Su-57.

Also, i can’t remember any jet ordered in such a quantity by VKS(VVS). Biggest one is 60 of SU-35s, if i’m correct. So why would Su-57 be an exception here?

Over 90% of Russian defense companies is state owned. This means a lot. First, the defence lobby in Russia is kinda weak (unlike in the US). Second, the economy here works in a slightly different way. The Russian gov pays for development, then pays for production and pays for the operation in the end. So rushing production here is the best way to lose more later at production and operation stages. Foreign customers are different story, here all works the same way as everywhere. No a surprise that Russia wants to sell the jet to anybody. For Russia the main assset is the ability to produce 5th gen fighter, not the fighters itself. Also, Russia is capitalist country, even with such untypical defense companies. So, money from abroad is profit – the stuff a capitalists is living for, but money from the gov is like to put cash from one pocket to another.

Another story is the production. Russia still hadn’t lost technological capability to create modern military equipment, but it’s hard to say so about production capability. It’s ok to “handmade” a couple of Su-57 in a year, but full scale production line requires a lot of special machinery. FIghter jet is on top of long production line. Production line that Russia is clearly having problem with. All this sanctions made buying all these mashinery abroad much more difficult if not impossible. Just look at MS-21 story – “harmless” passenger jet.

Sorry for the grammar, some of the cases is beyond my capabilities in English.)))

It is ok your grammar. My language is not the English too, so I can understand you well.

Thanks for your answer.