SlowManWouldn’t they be better off with M88 than EJ200? More compact and efficient motor.
Not enough thrust.
Also, if they go bigger internal bay they should go more in line with Sukhoi’s wide engine spacing.
The supercruise and the combat radius requirement(Indonesia’s requirement, not Korea’s) dictate the minimal possible drag, so the frontal area need to be as small as possible. This is why the CWB was dropped and the engineers decided to just stretch the forward fuselage to make room for a weapons bay instead, making the final KFX longer than an F-35.
SlowManThis article says japanese F-35s to be bought in FY2013 may cost 50% more:
That’s due to Japan’s 20% industrial participation in Japan-ordered F-35s.
The F-35 doesn’t have a traditional “offset” program; all prices offered come with zero offset. However, Japan could participate in an optional “industrial participation” program for units to be delivered to Japan by paying extra.
And this 20% industrial participation raises the price by 50%, and the Japanese government decided to do it in order to give work to Japanese fighter jet parts suppliers with no work right now. I am sure no other non-partner F-35 buyer would do it.
SlowManHowever in my oppinion don’t ommited possible CWB as compromise design. What you have put is probable ideal design, but from CRDC side potentially not the realistic design.
Here is what happened.
When they started the KFX, they set the target price of it at 70% of an F-35. Back then, Lockheed Martin was telling that the F-35 would cost $70 million flyaway, so the target flyaway price of KFX was set at $50 million. The CWB scheme was to add internal weapons capability to the resulting small airframe.
But the price of F-35 shot up to $120 million/unit in mass production since, so the target flyaway price of KFX Block 1 too jumped to $70 million; and that $20 million increase in price bought a much bigger airframe large enough to house a full internal weapons bay(Block I will use the space for extra fuel) and enough fuel capacity to enable a 600 nm combat radius.
This is why the sources repeat that the final KFX is a much bigger jet than it was before the $20 million rise in target flyaway price, actually longer than an F-35.
SlowManIf Frenchies or Saudies ended up ordering Mirage 4000, would Rafale program even exist?
Yes, because Mirage 4000 can’t land on carriers.
The Rafale exists today because of the Typhoon’s lack of carrier variant.
SlowManLook at the history of countries (including democracies) with large domestic debts, & how many of them have been successfully reduced.
None that I can think of. The thing with the national debt is that it can never be paid off; only managed, like growing the GDP and lowering the percentage of debt to the GDP.
Check what assets the Japanese state has.
About 100% of GDP. The debt is 240% of GDP, meaning a 140% net debt.
Unlike past debts that went into infrastructures, the new debts go into pensions and local government financial supports and so on so no asset is left, and the problem will get worse as pension receiving retirees explode while tax paying workers decrease.
SlowManCWB, still being considered since it’s more realisrically to developed within the time frame.
CWB was dropped because of a strict drag requirement. Indonesia requires 600 nm combat radius, which means they had to pick the lowest possible drag stealth-shaped configuration to reach that radius, cutting 1% here and there.
SlowManit doesn’t share as much with the SHornet as it does with the F-35.
Believe in what you want, but it has nothing to do with Lockheed; Lockheed Martin vehemently opposes the KFX program.
and unless the KF-X is meant to be a strike oriented jet, the SHornet must not be the baseline design.
There is no baseline design for the KFX. It was inspired by the Hornet series, however.
There isn’t enough space when you consider that the nose gear needs to be stowed in flight in the space between the cockpit and the intake.
That early model doesn’t. The classified final one does because it is as long as a Super Hornet.
But then you said that the internal weapons bay was forward of that, between the cockpit and intake.
And you missed the part where I explained that the one in the picture wasn’t the finalized KFX, and the final one is as long as a Super Hornet.
Meaning a change in the design of the aircraft?
Externally no.
Internally, quite a bit.
I’m saying that because the T-50 was essentially an LM design that KAI worked on and productionised.
T-50 is not designed by Lockheed Martin; it was the Taiwan20(20 Ching Kuo engineers from Taiwan) who led the project, and Lockheed Martin’s role was design validation and the supply of sub-components such as the avionics and FWB system, which are being replaced with local ones with the block starting with T-50I(Indonesia) and onward.
Lockheed Martin doesn’t own the T-50 design, they have a design use right for the US-market projects.
SlowManno wonder Turkey left the project.
WASHINGTON, Sept. 7 (UPI)
While currently purchasing F-35s, Turkey’s defense industry has big plans for the future as, after 2020, it plans to design, develop and produce another fighter to close the JSF’s deficiencies either with indigenous production or via a joint venture, possibly with South Korea.
SlowManthe KF-X seems to be inspired from the F-35
Super Hornet.
Were those 2 semi-recessed missiles hung on the internal weapons bay doors?
The internal weapons bay is located between the intake and the cockpit.
then it may carry 2 AMRAAMs or 2 JDAMs internally.
Four AMRAAMs in 2 x 2 configuration. Bottom ones are door panel mounted, while top ones swing out on swing arms.
It doesn’t look like the KF-X is intended to be an all-out VLO fighter
That’s just Block 1. Block 2 entering service in the late 2020s will be rated full-stealth(Korean standard is something like 0.01m^2 or below).
The reason for this phased capability introduction is to minimize program risks and cost overruns that plagued the F-35.
SlowManThe Greek state owes huge amounts to foreigners, in foreign currencies. The Japanese government owes huge amounts to its own citizens, in its own currency.
And you think Japanese citizen bond holders are less angry at Japanese government than foreign bond holders at the event of debt default?
Whatever happens with Japanese government debt, it won’t resemble Greece in the slightest.
Sure it will.
At certain time, there is going to be no more new Japanese government bond buyers left, and the Japanese government can’t raise enough money to meet its obligations without the bond sales. When that happens Japan must enter a Greek-style austerity to fund itself without selling additional bonds, which means a higher tax, and halving of government spending including the defense budget.
At that time, Japanese government must lay off half the troops and stop buying new weapons.
SlowManthat is the old models C101 and C102, this is the newest one C103.
Two separate and reputable sources confirm single YF-23 style internal weapons bay placed between the cockpit and the intake. The picture is just an early model, the real one was not allowed to be photographed but said to be about the size of a Super Hornet powered by two EJ2X0 engines. Imagine a lower-drag(This is not a naval jet so they don’t need as much low-speed lift) stealth shaped Super Hornet and you will get the picture.
Seems that they are trying to minimize American content in the KFX due to the opposition from the US aerospace industry lobby, namely Lockheed Martin.
At the press conference held in Seoul earlier today, EADS CASA and Boeing reps voiced their willingness to join the KFX program, but Lockheed Martin refuses to.
SlowManWhat is the in service date for this aircraft?
2021 for Block 1(The one with external armament, no radio signal emission control, no LPI mode for the AESA radar, etc).
Unknown for Block 2(Full stealth with an internal weapons bay), but somewhere after 200th Block 1 is produced.
SlowManChina was interested in Su-35 for its engines, because Russia wouldn’t sell 117S engines alone.
What Chinese wanted to do was to pull the engines out of those Su-35s and stick them into J-20.
SlowManConsidering your track record I doubt it.
Keep doubting then.
SlowManHow serious are Japan with this ATD concept?
The Japanese government finance is in a pretty terrible situation at the moment.
The Japanese government is currently operating in a partial default mode, where the central government stopped financial aid payments to local governments due to lack of fund because of the Japan’s version of debt ceiling stand-off between the DPJ and the LDP, with a full default set in November if nothing is done.
With a public debt to GDP ratio of 240%, the Japanese government’s ability to issue new debt is almost spent, and the Japanese government will have to enter a Greece style austerity sooner or later.
And that would hit Japan’s defense spending directly.
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