Icarus,

“Upgrade of 172 Leopard2A4s to the -2A5 level; €603,8 million “

Thats €3.5mn each. Sounds a lot, but I suppose they get a thorough refurbishment at the same time. I wonder how much more a 2A6 upgrade would cost?

Indeed, i was quite positive that they would acquire more Leo2A4s to reach 500+ Leo2s and then modernise them all to Leo2A6HEL level. We will have to wait and see..

How will Greece finance 30 4th gen fighters and 6 Frigates and alot of Land forces deals with 3.5 bn$ since thats the amount that remains from 11bn$ (2006-2011) after the previous project payments Kathemerini says?

If Greece goes for a 4th gen now we can safely assume that JSF deal will be delayed until 2020s.

Hr. Ms. Willem van der Zaan (F 829) still carries the Dutch flag and was recently in Istanbul as a part of a NATO Reaction Force.

for higher resolution images visit ;http://gallery.koroshiya.net/gallery/10-06-2006-NRF-Visit

Turkey edges closer to decision on attack helicopter competition

SSM chief Bayar says Defense Industry Executive Committee to select a winner on June 27 for the $2 billion contract

ANKARA – TDN Defense Desk

Turkish procurement authorities are very close to selecting an international manufacturer for the country’s $2 billion program for the purchase of scores of attack helicopters, with end of June seen as the moment of truth.

Murad Bayar, head of Turkey’s Undersecretariat for the Defense Industry (SSM), said on Wednesday that a final decision on the competition will most likely emerge from the June 27 meeting of the Defense Industry Executive Committee, Turkey’s top panel that oversees critical procurement decisions.

“There is every indication that we could make a decision at the meeting (on June 27),” Bayar said. “The dossier is now almost complete.”

Asked whether the executive committee would need to wait for the annual reshuffle of the military top brass in August, Bayar said, “There is no need for that. … The commanders who will be in charge are also in charge today.” Bayar possibly was referring to Gen. Yasar Buyukanit, current land forces commander, who is slated to take over as chief of general staff at the Supreme Military Council gathering this August.

The contract involves an initial batch of 50 attack helicopters. The contenders are: Franco-German EADS subsidiary Eurocopter, maker of the Tiger; Agusta Westland SpA, Italy, maker of the Mangusta A129; Russia’s Moskovskiy Vertoletnyy Zavod (Moscow Helicopter Plant), maker of the Mi-28 Havoc; Russia’s Kamov, maker of the KA-50/2 Black Shark; and South Africa’s Denel Aviation, maker of the CSH-2 Rooivalk.

Turkey’s plans to buy scores of attack helicopters originally date back to the mid-1990s, but efforts so far have come to nothing.

Turkey’s new attack helicopter program for up to 50 platforms, a deal worth over $2 billion, came after a similar project failed last year. In that now-defunct program, Turkey in 2000 selected Bell for co production of 50 AH-1Z King Cobras. But after four years of talks failed because of disputes on price, technology transfer and licensing problems, Ankara in May 2004 cancelled the whole process and decided to launch a new international tender.

http://www.turkishdailynews.com.tr/article.php?enewsid=45012

Despite the above news, the MoD has said on a news report that there is a chance the selection may not be made in June meeting.. I think if such a delay occurs it will be a political one rather than being technical. They might be willing to wait the EUs (especially French) attitude this autumn..

Q: Since you have recognized the Athens FIR a few moments ago so-called something which has been granted to Greece via the (inaudible) Convention, I wonder, do you recognize the Athens FIR? And number two, what is the relation between DoD and (inaudible)?

A: By using the term so-called, I was using that to give its full name. The FIR is called the flight information region. I didn’t mean to minimize its importance in any way. But our policy towards the FIR is unchanged. We recognize that as a commercial flight zone that does not apply to military flights. U.S. military flights I should say.

http://www.defenselink.mil/transcripts/1997/t12111997_t1211asd.html

However i am not talking about Greek rights or Turkish rights but the incident. Isnt it possible for Greece or for Turkey to proove their points using ground based radar recordings or vrs?

DATE: 24.05.2006
BULLETIN NO : 08

There published/aired diverse news on mass media about the collision and crash of Turkish and Greek F-16 fighters on May 23, 2006. Upon examination of said news it is deemed as necessary to make a press release on the accident based on the true information.

One F-4 accompanied by two F-16 fighters took off from Dalaman Airport at 12:30C on May 23, 2006, for the planned routine training flight in the international airspace over the Mediterranen Sea. Greek authorities dispatched two Greek F-16 fighters to intercept our fighters. Greek F-16s in violation of International Civilian Aviation Organization (ICAO) engagement rules (which provide 1000 feet security zone) harrassed our fighters coming closer to less than provided for security distance. On 12.48C hrs, while our fighters continue their routine mission without any maneouvers a fastly approaching Greek F-16 crashed from behind and below Turkish F-16 without entering any engagements to our aircraft (there was no dogfight). As a result of the collision both aircrafts crashed, and Turkish pilot survived after ejected. The incident took place 33 nm south of Rhodes (Rodos), and 35 nm east of Karpathos (Kerpe) islands (3524N, 2750E) in the international airspace. Our pilot first rescued by a Panama flag vessel, and then by a Turkish search and rescue helicopter and brought to Fethiye State Hospital. The health condition of the pilot is allright and he has returned back to his mission.

Official statement by TuAF
Translation by modus@acig

Btw a Turkish F-4 was indeed in the flight!

If there was a RF-4 i can imagine its mission. You dont need to teach me that. However there is neither evidence or confirmation on that except for the claims of EPA pilots as of yet.

Besides i assume you accept the fact that any military aircraft dont need to inform a civilian FIR center as provided in RAAF document.

Ofcourse unless you blame those guys for being skilled soap opera authors..

National security matters are not for me or for anyone here to decide. Look how USA has invaded Iraq using very little or non existing evidence of WMDs. UNCLOS is not an agreement we have signed so it doesnt provide us anything. As long as its International airspace our fighters will continiue flying there..