CD

Please see my earlier threads where I detailed my thoughts about QE, bank lending and current company balance sheets, with regard to the economy.
And using such matters to put growth into the economy.

I feel a good percentage of the electorate had their say last week……

On borrowing, the current Government is borrowing more than the last presently. The only way you are going to stop that is by getting more people back to work and paying tax.

If you cut, cut and cut again with no stimulus the economy will (as is presently happening ) die slowly.

When I was made redundant I had few choices. I ended up moving south to get work. My mortgage in the north was nearly paid off. I invested in my self, borrowed money (ie on a mortgage) and made the move ie I invested in myself.

This is what the current Government needs to encourage. Investing in people to get them back to work……not cut, cut cut.

There was a great analagy on radio 4 this morning. To paparphrase…. If the patient is the economy and you just keep making cuts the patient will die simply owing slightly less……..

Moggy

If you take the Blair years into account ie the whole Labour period of administration, they reduced waiting times considerably. Built lots of new hospitals (ok, ok PFI is another argument). Employed many more docors and nurses and increased their pay dramatically.

I previously lived in impovorished East Lancashire. Our original hospital was a decrepit Victorian structure in a shocking state and our gp’s surgery was nothing more than a leaking port-a-cabin. Under Labour we got a new hospital and a new surgery. During the Tory boom time in the 1980’s did they spend money on new infastructure? Absolutely not.

If you want me to quote the proof and figures I will do when I get time.

From earlier posts of yours you seem to have some considerable hands on experiance of the NHS, consiquently I am sure you are aware of the NHS improvements in the Labour years as a whole.

Could the money pumped in to the NHS during the labour years been used more efficently. According to doctors and nurses I know, the answer is yes.

You both present sensible and understandable arguments however we are as a country in dire straits. As we are all aware, it is not just our country but most of the western european nations and a few others as well. Japan has been struggling for years.

It is going to be very interesting to see what happens in France and I wait with interest.

However the present PM and cabinet seems to be aloof and detached from working people. A lot of the current cabinet are millionaires. They seem to be interested only in widening the gap between the rich and poor and squeezing most of the people in the middle. Getting those least able to pay for defficit.

For me the NHS remains sacrasanct. Other people have differnt views which I appreciate. My views are based on the fact that the NHS keep me going. They allow me to stay working and pay tax.

If I had to pay for health care then I simply could not afford it and would have spent a life on benifits. I think there are probably millions of people in the same position as me.

I also believe that the British people will vote ultimately against any party that ends free health care at the point of delivery.

As to the argument about putting healthcare in private hands. Simply, private companies are run for one reason and one reason alone…..the profit of the shareholders…..If you want an example, have a look at your gas, water and electric bills and have a look at executive pay in those areas.

Lincoln 7 raises some interesting points. I have both worked and studied in the US and have seen entire families completly destroyed as the result of a serious illness for which they could not obtain insurance or was excluded.

That is not the type of world I want to live in.

Ok, lets have a complete new look at everything but has to be done outside party lines. If such investigations take years, so be it. Lets look at how the rest of Europe pay for health and benifits (ok but not Greece eh?). Get industry, commerce, the likes of Branson and Sugar involved. Elder statesmen such as Paddy Ashdown, Lord Owen, John Major and Tony Blair (like him or not he was very successful and Cameron has in part tried to copy him….even the entire Tory back benchers gave him a standing ovation on leaving office) . And no, not GB for he was no more PM material than I .

Can I make a suggestion……..let me buy you all a beer before the summer is out. Its easier to explain over a pint is’nt it !

Well……..

As elluded to by lots of people on here the NHS has to change. It has to because we are all living longer. That I accept.

However in my humble opinion its the way Cameron and Osborne go about things that just alianates most of the population instantly.

If “a” Government went about a complete, long term, route and branch investigation of the nhs, taking as long as necessary and divorced completly from party politics. Also involving the great and the good from industry and commerce…….Then we might start to get somewhere.

Private companies exist to make a profit for shareholders. Simple fact. This is not compatable with running a health service for the people. It would quickly end up like the utilities.

However, free access at the point of contact for all must remain for me.

If it was approached in such a way and explained to the country in such a way. It might just work.

It might also be worth considering input from outside the UK, how would the Japanese look at? The Scandanavians?

For me it should remain as the country’s number one priority in terms finances.

Peoples health and the protection of those with health problems is the most important thing. If that means pumping more money in I say yes. If that means more tax to pay for this I say yes to that as well.

serious answer……..

If actions such as those elluded to in my post above become widespred. There is no chance what-so-ever of the party responsible being re elected for a considerable length of time.

In my humble opinion the British public vote on two matters really:
AA/ Do I have money in my pocket ?
BB/ The NHS.

It would be so much easier to consider potential positivies if it was’nt for the typical involvement (alledgedly) of Conservative politicians or donors.

It doesnt matter what anyones position, who’s right or who’s wrong. the electorate in the UK will always vote to protect the NHS at all costs.

I found the following “comment” in the Sunday Telegraph comments section.
I cannot personally verify the (alledged)points raised in it.

Interesting conertations for the future of the NHS.

“The govt has handed over Hinchingbrooke hospital to Circle Healthcare, who have promised cutbacks on expenditure.

Two of the major shareholders in Circle Healthcare are donors to the Tory party. Doubtless, we are to assume that this is a coincidence. Similarly, the fact that former Tory Health team member Mark Simmonds MP is also a paid strategic advisor with Circle Healthcare is also I am sure, a complete coincidence.

Part of the agreement with the govt involves Circle Healthcare annually skimming off £2 million profit of any surplus. One assumes that any reduction in expenditure made will be exactly the same as reduction in expenditure made if Hinchingbrooke hospital was still managed by the state. Ie, cutting down on operations, increased waiting lists etc.

Thus, I would really like to know how handing over this
hospital to a private healthcare company (whose CEO is Ali Parsa a former Goldman Sachs executive) who will skim
off annually £2 million pounds in profit, will help either the hospital to reduce its debts or our economy?”

Are these the changes that the NHS need ?