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March 5, 2009 at 10:58 pm in reply to: RN Fighters #2039400

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Same reasons as SeaPhoon, plus it would be further down the list becasue it doesn’t have the virtue of being built by a potential user nation. No British jobs in Sea Gripen, at least some british jobs in SeaPhoon, as well as in JSF.

A TOT deal can always be arranged.. Bae can can always take a bigger part, dont forget that the wings of the gripen is in mayor parts bae built and some other stuff too.

February 8, 2009 at 10:17 am in reply to: IAF – News & Discussion – II #2459895

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The IAF may want a better engine on the Tejas. So it does not matter if its 75KN or 79KN, the main indication to why it needs this is from the IAFs demand that better avionics must be integrated with the MK2 Tejas, which may cause added weight, compensated by the higher thrust engine. Also just being above the required 75KN of thrust does not give enough room for future integration of avionics, weapons etc.

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F404 is atleast upgradible to 90kN and more than that for a such a small fighter would be rediculius.
If the Tejas adds weight and end up in gripen class, than i would really consider a bigger wings etc(different plane).

you saying adding avionics, but future avionics should be lighter if not the capability needs to be ten fold.

February 8, 2009 at 9:43 am in reply to: Japan to consider F/A-22 to replace its F-4s #2459902

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That would be like saying in 1946. “All I could see” is the P-80, Me-262 or Meteor. That they were plenty of alternatives like the P-51H, Bearcat, Sea Fury, Tempest, etc.

Sorry, 5th Generation Type like the F-22 and F-35 are the future. Just as the P-80, Me-262, or Meteor were in 1946…………

Regardless, you are taking the whole point as personal……….Which, with all do respect is hardly the case.

I would say 6 gen are even more the future..:D

February 7, 2009 at 5:43 pm in reply to: IAF – News & Discussion – II #2460160

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Chief says they need 75Kn Engine for LCA and F404 won’t do it but then F404 provides 78KN.

the RM12 derivate make 80,5kN and thats not the end of the line for f404. 95kN or something like that would be.

February 7, 2009 at 5:41 pm in reply to: IAF – News & Discussion – II #2460168

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No bias I think they need an assured and already operational system and leave nothing to chance in the future. I have not doubt about the Gripens capabilities either, how is its AESA programme coming along ?

The Demo AESA is planned for flight test this summer.. and that should be a calculated step to bias the american jets..for the indian part.
this was planed all along, so if there are a real interest, they should evaluate the radars from gripen, rafale, and the mig later on.. otherwise this is a political desision..thats it.

February 7, 2009 at 5:06 pm in reply to: IAF – News & Discussion – II #2460217

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1, ACM and IAF considers AESA important with regard to situational awareness.

2. The Aircraft should meet the capability at the time of evaluation not delivery.

this is a political bais for american jets and maybe french…
But i have no doubt Gripen Demo will show a really good capability..
The demo program made a good progress and will be a capable player.

February 7, 2009 at 11:35 am in reply to: The Aircrafts Prices? #2460455

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I read a Signatory post in mil.photos and according to that SAAB offers more than that. They offer a maximum-life time cost of 30 years which includes everything (fuel, maintenance, training, spare parts etc). And it´s suppose to be 123£ mil/jet and that is half of what the F-35 is presenting. This deal is for Denmark and is basically the same deal presented to the norwegian. The norwegians on the other hand came up with some very strange conclusion that the Gripen would be 10 times as expensive as the F35 or something like that (lol). The difference now is that the Swedish state is guaranteeing that price (over 30 years) and is offering more off-sets (180%). The reason the Swedish state can guarantee that I suppose is the fact that over 10 years of service it has showed that the Gripen is more then 15% cheaper to operate then was predicted, and experiences from the Czheck republic and Hungarians tells the same thing.

Even if the fly away price for a Gripen C is 25 mil dollars SAAB offers to pay the total cost of the systems entire price during 30 years of service.

So 50-60 million USD for Gripen NG isnt “flyaway”..its the hole lifecycle!?

February 6, 2009 at 5:45 pm in reply to: The Aircrafts Prices? #2461019

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Feel free to argue with Janes about the Gripen NG. Janes in turn go ttheir numbers from the Dutch.
http://www.janes.com/news/defence/air/jdi/jdi081106_1_n.shtml

The average unit flyaway cost of the F-35C over the life of the program is 83.1 million dollars. I know that this number does not agree with some people’s view but that number has been the official number for a while now. The Norwegians (I know, either they are lying or those damned Americans are bribing them)believe the number becuae they where told that if a certain number (about 350) of export F-35s are bought that would be the price. Again, sorry of you don’t like it but no one to date with any knowledge of the program has said otherwise.

gripens offers tend to include alot. And the deal with NG deals seems to be “all inclusive”, spareparts for 30 years etc. So its hard to tell about “fly away”. think thats why the “fly away” for SwAF is so low.

February 6, 2009 at 5:36 pm in reply to: The Aircrafts Prices? #2461026

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F?A=18 E?F 82.7 million :-?? 🙁 at this price its chances are slim in MRCA i think.

What was the morocco´s price of f-16?

February 5, 2009 at 8:13 pm in reply to: The Aircrafts Prices? #2462017

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Gripen NG $50 – $60 mil unit price, Janes

F-16 Blk 60, about $55 mil, various sources

Rafale
About $65 million

Eurofighter
$90 – $120 million depending on who you talk to and what the exchange rate is

F-18E/F
$55 million, latest offer to USN

MIG-35
Why would anyone want it?

Dont forget that F-16IN is quite different from Blk 60..

Also, from gripen C of 25m to 50-60M of NG is BIG Jump….

Annyone care to add F-35 prices(real ones, not norwegian ones)

February 4, 2009 at 10:27 pm in reply to: The Aircrafts Prices? #2463245

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that is not maintenance…. that is rearming and refueling.
Maintenance is changing a wing, replacing the engine, etc.

The price for flying gripen C in SwAF is less than 2500USD per hour… Then NG is optimized for even lower. MTBF is 7.6 hours..
A hot engine swap is preformed in 30 min..
its more or less a formula 1 pitstop 😀

February 3, 2009 at 10:03 pm in reply to: Iran completes design phase of stealth aircraft #2463868

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F-22 can live very diffucult moments with this aircarft:))Russia is planning first flight for 2009 and mass production in 2015.But the process in Iran is looking like ultra fast.January 30 is the first flight,mass production will start in March.It means that this aircraft is perfect from the first flight:)

it must be an equal opponent, then!!! 😀

February 3, 2009 at 8:40 pm in reply to: Saab JAS 39 Gripen info #2463918

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Which, would require a redesign of the intakes and the latter would likely have a higher SFC………:(

Really, not needed………..IMO

think they thought of that…

February 3, 2009 at 8:36 pm in reply to: Iran completes design phase of stealth aircraft #2463922

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Seems like its been years we’ve been hearing that now, 5 – 7 years perhaps?

yes it has, but things runing along.. so..
AMRAAM did not hapen over night? and meteors capability is quite the envelope..

February 3, 2009 at 8:22 pm in reply to: Saab JAS 39 Gripen info #2463934

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No, I mean the F404…………with some models making over 20,000 lbs! Don’t re-invent the wheel.

Volvo Aero did look at those options(european alternatives also) but opted for the F414. the step was not big, and the future upgrades alt. where better.. the steps for F414 is to date up to 29000lb.
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