this picture is from strizhi a russian forum
i can see the blocker
http://pilot.strizhi.info/category/aviation/sukhoi/pak-fa
i do not think it is fake
Different angle yes, but you can see directly to the intake and from less distance, so shouldn’t ne at least a bit of the compressor, or radar blocker be visibile, if it would be there? Just looks strange to me!
it is a matter of illumination, i do not think it is a fake, here you have a picture to compare
I’ve some doubts about the accuracy of these comparison charts in that video. 17500 kg empty weight sounds incredibly low for an aircraft of that size, with all the support structure for the weapon bays etc. I have some doubts that the PAK FA is about 2t lighter than the smaller F-22, makes not much sense if you ask me.
I’m also a bit reserved about the range claims, 4300 km range on internal fuel and just 5500 km range with one in flight refuelling. If we remember the claims about older Flankers the range difference was much more significant! For example 3000 km for the Su-30 and 5200 km with one IFR or 4200 km for the Su-27M and 6800 km with one IFR, similar for the Su-34. I would actually expect a range around 3500 km at best on internal fuel as the AL-41F1 is more powerful than the AL-41F1S while likely offering a similar SFC. The Su-35s stated range is 3600 km internal fuel, though one would expect a significantly longer range in comparison to the equally sized and not much lighter Su-27 whose range is given with 3680 km to 4000 km. At the same time the Su-35 has a much larger internal fuel load.Edit:
this is becoming ridiculous with the compressor face. The engine actually needs air to breath! How could this be ensured with the compressor face being hidden. given the relative straight inlet. half the compressor face being visible is not to bad and looks reasonable given the intake design.
here is another stimation by Russian sources
Such personalised, vindictive & juvenile hatred- I love it!!
(Personal insults in quoted posting removed by moderator)
Via Flateric:
Man at least do a translation of what you post, people can translate things after you post, but this is not a Russian language forum but one in english i do not see any wrong quoting russian texts but they must have a Russian translation with them in order to follow forum rules and have respect for those who do not speak russian
This picture was taken in front of the nose, but in the video at 2:36, you can see directly into the air intakes, but no compressor is visible! It looks like the cameraman stands much closer, even besides the cockpit, so is the picture a fake again?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5t6R9faLf8&feature=player_embedded#!
That picture is not from the same video, in the video they have another angle, in my personal opinion it is not fake
Can someone point to sources esp english books that deal with the tactics of soviet airforces
e.g is a post by a member on another forum, is there any truth in it ?
That is a typical biased analysis, the Soviets had MiG-31s that would had helped the MiG-23Ps , a different situation, the Libyans did not use MiG-31 to guide them, and despite they say the Libyans had MiG-23ML in that incident the pictures do not show clearly they were carrying AA-7s.
Iraq is said to have shot down F-14s too
see this video shows a MiG-23MS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jV87-7-4EyY
The MiG-31 radar would had eliminated any shortcoming of the MiG-23 radar, by 1989 they soviets had MiG-29s and Su-27s.
The Soviets analized each aircraft in order to applied tactics, you can see that in the analysis of the MiG-23MLD in combat where they do not recommened a MiG-23MLD pilot to doghfight with F-16s and F-15s.
A very interesting clip here…
http://rutube.ru/tracks/3340831.html?v=f6295d73a736dba8284290888faac6e7
If accurate , imho that explains the quite remarcable flying display from yesterday ,done WITHOUT afterburner …the plane is a bit lighter than thought (17 500kg), and i assume ( i can be wrong offcourse) that the 30610 Kg figure for the “in-flight weight” refers to the aircraft with full internal fuel + internal AAMs…same for the F-22.
It looks like T-50 beats F-22 hands downs at the airframe performance chapter ( including supercruise???),and range, boy that thing has legs or what … (oh ,and offcourse , morale!:D)
i still have my doubts the T-50 will have better stealth, those conventional nozzles and engine nacecelles degrade its stealthiness a great deal
Back to square one again…
well it was kind of obvious, the inlet and engine nacelles are kind of straight and inline, the space used for the weapons bays and lifting pancake did not allow it to really make an S duct.
The Russians returned to the Su-27 concept, the Berkut had an S duct but had a conventional fuselage
So Su-30 is a light fighter nowadays?? Jeebuz I wonder what the heavy fighters’ll look like..
The original text does not mention they are light fighter, that is a mistake done by google translation tools
For Mexico i would like it like this
80 F-35s (very unlikely we might get them we still fly F-5)
20 T-50s (this is totally fantasy i doubt Russian will ever sell it to Mexico at least in the next 15 years)
30 Su-35BM (slightly possible but still unlikely)
20 Su-34 (very unlikely)
Bombers
40 Su-24s (probably old Russian Su-24s very probable but they would be mostly likely Junk)
20 Tu-22M2s (it has some chances but no need for Mexico to buy them)
AWACs
5 An-71 (too sad this is not even in production niether operational)
10 mexican built Bombardier Astors (well at least we build the tail of the Global express in Queretaro)l:D
Transport
10 An-72 (we had some chances)
5 An-225 (here i feel is possible but we have no money to buy them)
20 An-124 (we have no money very unlikely we buy them in large numbers if we ever buy them)
40 C-17s (some chances we buy them if we need them, the number is unlikely)
40 mexican built Bombardier Learjet 85 (we will build the fuselage of the Learjets 85s in Mexico starting from July 2010)
Naval aviation
20 Rafales. (it has some chances as a real option)
20 Su-33KUB (very low odds it ever happen)
helicopters
90 S-76s (it has some chances)
30 Ka-50s (low odds to happen)
10 Mi-26 (we already have them but not in large numbers)
50 mexican built McDonnell Douglas MD500 (we build at least in Mexico the fuselage in Apodaca Nuevo Leon, Mexico):D
but i know it is pure fantasy but perhaps we might get some of the things we build for the FAM, well dreaming does not hurt
Gulfstream Interiores Aéreos S.A. De C.V., a 335,000-square-foot manufacturing facility, is a part of Gulfstream Aerospace Corporation, a wholly-owned subsidiary of General Dynamics. Gulfstream Mexicali supplies components for the Gulfstream G150, G200, G450, G550 and G650 business jets. Some 1,100 team members make up four business units fabricating electrical wire harnesses, sheetmetal details, assemblies, and machined parts. Respect for people, continuous improvement, and exceeding customer expectations are key parts of its vision. The application of lean tools and philosophies started in 2002 when its major focus on world-class manufacturing began.
http://www.reliableplant.com/View/25005/Gulfstream-Mexico-Shingo-Prize
The number of Mexican aerospace companies has tripled to more than 300 in the last six years and it’s not stopping there. The Mexican business magazine Mexico Now is sponsoring a daylong aerospace industry conference — in Philadelphia — June 24 and it’s clearly aimed at OEMs who might be thinking of moving some of their production there. So far dozens of established companies, including Cessna, Bombardier, Hawker Beechcraft and Pratt & Whitney, have built factories in Mexico or are contracting with Mexican companies. “The main objective of this seminar is to obtain detailed and privileged information about the current and future conditions and trends of the aerospace Industry in offshore manufacturing operations,” said conference spokesman Sergio Omel.
The conference runs from 7 a.m. to 6 p.m. at the Hilton Philadelphia City Avenue and will feature speakers from the Mexican aerospace industry as well as representatives from companies that now do business in Mexico who will relate their experiences. The conference also promises to “objectively analyze the present and future business conditions of the aerospace industry in Mexico.”
http://www.avweb.com/avwebbiz/news/MexicoCourtsAmericanAerospace_202653-1.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W6y4nbBPLY
Aircraft bearing and components manufacturer Kaman Aerospace Corporation announced a $5 million investment in Chihuahua City, where it will employ 200 workers in a new plant to be completed this fall.
Kaman will manufacture structural components and do metal component detailing.
Robert Kanaskie, the company’s president, said Kaman felt drawn by Chihuahua City’s infrastructure, workforce skills and the city and state governments’ support.
The company valued as well Chihuahua’s manufacturing base, its industrial sector experience and support from American Industries, a Chihuahuan company providing industrial real estate solutions.
The city government is offering a 100 percent property tax discount and up to 55 percent discounts on construction permits for aerospace companies wanting to set operations here.
For Kaman’s investment, Chihuahua City competed with other leading Mexican cities as Monterrey, Mexicali and Queretaro
http://www.chihuahuanfrontier.com/aerospace/investments/131-kaman.html
It could be argued that Russian’s goals have already been achieved – while they have not stopped China becoming a exporter of military aircraft – the planes that China seems to be planning to export – the FC-1/JF-17 Thunder and a version of the J-10B, are not directly evolved from Russian fighters and the FC-1 certainly brings in money for Russian industry due to the fact they use the Klimov RD-93.
It will be interesting to see if China can sell the FC-1 or the future export version to J-10B to countries who might be considering the Mig-29M or the Mig-35.
I kind of agree with you too, Russia already is trying to stop China from selling the J-11B, about competition between the Russians and China it has already started in terms of J-10 and MiG-29 exports
see
Russia will deliver 20 MiG-29 fighter jets to the Air Force of Myanmar (Burma). The deal is evaluated at nearly $600 million. Burma preferred Russia’s renowned jets to China, although its J-10 and FC-1 fighters are cheaper.
http://english.pravda.ru/world/asia/24-12-2009/111368-mig29-0
A 400 million-euro ($570 mln) contract has been signed for the delivery of Russian MiG-29 fighters for the Myanmar Air Force, a source close to Russia’s arms export monopoly told a business daily on Wednesday.
Vedomosti quoted the source at Rosoboronexport as saying the Russian bid to supply MiG-29 Fulcrum-D carrier-based fighter jets beat China’s offer to sell its latest J-10 and FC-1 fighters
http://en.rian.ru/business/20091223/157331457.html
While I am not disputing that what happened is exactly as you say, and I am aware of some cases of Chinese “IP Piracy” I also am aware of Chinese companies legitimately acquiring licences (i.e. the purchase of a licence for the Rover 75 by SIAC is an example http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rover_Group).
I think it is very telling that the contract has not been published, as if Sukhoi does believe the contract has been materially breached then even it is meant to be confidential there would be no harm in publishing extracted clauses to defend their position.
.
I agree, but ony time will tell about the result if russia achieves its goal or wins the case, they have already notified China and are making new regulations for Russian companies exporting weapons in order to avoid what Russia considers violations of Russian IP rights.
What Russia probably has learnt is to improve the military tech transfers and weapons sales it currently does.
And the result of this will either improve Chinas image or make it worse in terms of its IP protection for non Chinese companies investing in aviation in China.
About publishing the contract, i do not know, Sukhoi has only notified China that China and Shengyang are breaking the license and it has been an interguvernamental question and i do not see any benefit in publishing the contract since the media can not take any decision regarding the issue and it is obvious that an interguvernamental venue has more possibilities of solving it.
The Russians are trying to solve it as a diplomatic question and what the Russian media has reported is what has been allowed to be published.
more links to see how they view the J-11B
http://en.rian.ru/analysis/20080425/105928822.html
http://en.rian.ru/russia/20080221/99765686.html