Vnomadand do you really want the workshare to go to India? where they’ll likely demand that Lockheed cover the costs and expenses of any subpar manufactured product built by HAL?
you best suck up to Canada, and deal with Justin Bieber and Drake
You know HAL isn’t the only company in India right? :rolleyes:
I take it you’ve never heard of the Tatas (TASL), because Lockheed Martin has. That’s how it discharged its offset obligations from the C-130J sale, an aircraft which it now proposes to build locally at the same facility if adequate orders come through. LM’s new acquisition i.e. Sikorsky tied up with TASL years ago and will build the S-70 locally when the IN order comes through.
The Canadian F-35 order will never cross 65 units. Given that state-on-state fighting is apparently not a priority for them, even that figure remains to be seen. In contrast, if LM can get a foot into the Indian fighter market, follow on orders will easily take the tally into three digits over the next 15 years.
VnomadThe F-23 supposedly had better stealth characteristics than the F-22, and it relied on less of an S-duct.
That was the YF-23. If I’m not mistaken the production variant i.e F-23A EMD was supposed to incorporate S-ducts.
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VnomadWell, they ordered 4 more Mi-24M
Over and above the Mi-35s ordered before? Source?
VnomadSo basically the more they work on it the closer they get to the J-31, itself heavily patterned on the F-35…
Looks like it. The T-FX & KFX also seem to be evolving in the same direction. Though seeing as its unlikely to be designed to carry as much internal fuel as the F-35, a higher TWR might be achievable.
VnomadBAE Systems completes Meteor firings for Typhoon P2E upgrade
BAE Systems has successfully completed guided firing trials of the MBDA Meteor beyond-visual-range air-to-air missile (BVRAAM) launched from a Eurofighter Typhoon combat aircraft, IHS Jane’s was told on 14 September.
During the trials, which took place at the UK Ministry of Defence’s (MoD’s) Hebrides range, aircraft IPA6 launched Meteor missiles against real air targets in pre-planned scenarios as part of the wider Typhoon Phase 2 Enhancements (P2E) flight test campaign. According to BAE Systems test pilot Nat Makepeace, the missile separated cleanly and guided successfully towards its target while maintaining a data link with the aircraft.
The flight trials were conducted by BAE Systems with support from QinetiQ, MBDA, and Selex, and form part of a NATO Eurofighter and Tornado Management Agency (NETMA) contract to fully integrate the Meteor missile onto Typhoon by the end of 2016.
This Meteor firing follows earlier ones conducted by IPA1 in December 2014. Those first firings were carried out to test the missile itself, while this latest round of tests was concerned with integrating the weapon onto the latest standard Typhoon and testing the missile’s interaction with the radar.
Speaking to IHS Jane’s in July, BAE Systems said that the Meteor firings were the first phase of a 150-flight trial campaign for the P2E capability enhancement across the international test fleet. In the coming weeks, the single-seat IPA6 aircraft will be joined in the campaign by a twin-seat Typhoon that BAE Systems has loaned back from the MoD (BT017), as well as by aircraft provided by the other Eurofighter consortium nations of Germany, Italy, and Spain.
P2E flights are expected to run through to the end of the year, and will include trials of the MBDA Storm Shadow cruise missile (including firings in the United Kingdom by Italian aircraft), and testing of new additional cockpit interface enhancements and other general P2E development work.
Assuming that the test campaign is successful, the P2E configuration should be ready for fielding before the end of 2017.
VnomadAlso from the article –
“These will be the most advanced Eurofighters yet, and Kuwait will be the first country to have an e-scan Eurofighter,” the source said. “The aircraft will be completely swing role and involve a weapons package.”
Italy, which partners with the UK, Germany and Spain on the Eurofighter program, took the lead in the marketing campaign in Kuwait, which culminated in an agreement Sept. 11, the Italian government said after a meeting in Rome between the prime ministers of Italy and Kuwait.
The source said the deal, which is worth €7 billion to €8 billion (US$7.9 billion to $9 billion), would be finalized by year end, with deliveries starting in 2019.
VnomadDoes it replace anyone’s order?
Nic
A second Italian source said that over 50 percent of the value of the Eurofighter deal in Kuwait would be pocketed by Italy’s Finmeccanica, which is among the European countries building Eurofighter structures but also works on systems for the aircraft through its Selex unit.
The first source said the aircraft would be new-build and not diverted from Italy’s Eurofighter order book. The deal, he added, would involve ground crew training, logistic support, air base infrastructure upgrades and liaison between the Italian and Kuwaiti air forces to offer operational support for electronic systems.
– Link
VnomadI thought it started more than a year ago.
They were still tinkering around with the aircraft even after the SP units went into production, resulting in some friction between ADA and HAL IIRC. The design freeze should smoothen the path somewhat.
VnomadSpeaking of data-links –
The IAF issued a contract for the ODL in 2009 to IAI. Contract was valued at $4.2 million. Rafael offered to do it at no cost, which was apparently grounds for rejecting its bid.
IAI bags contract for IAF’s pilot operational data link project
Free? No Thanks! India Chooses Datalink Development Partner
Which makes an odd sort of sense since a contract isn’t really valid without ‘due consideration’ for both parties. Can’t create a client-vendor relationship without that. They should have quoted a token sum, but that probably didn’t have the PR appeal of ‘we’ll do it for free!’.
In any case, the Navy unlike the AF seems to be sticking with something called the ‘Data Link II’ (wonder what happened to ‘Data Link I’).
Boeing today announced that it received a key communications technology for the Indian Navy’s P-8I long-range maritime reconnaissance and anti-submarine warfare aircraft from Bharat Electronics Limited (BEL) in April, one month ahead of schedule. BEL delivered the Indian-designed Data Link II, a communications system that will enable exchange of tactical data and messages between Indian Navy aircraft, ships and shore establishments. Boeing will install the system during P-8I final assembly at its facility in Renton, Washington. – Link
BEL datalink, IFF systems mandated for Indian naval helicopter – Indian Navy has asked bidders to integrate into their candidate aircraft include the Link II (two) datalink system plus IFF interrogator – Link
Anyone know how compatible the ODL & Data Link II are?
VnomadIt was right under 50% about a year and a half ago IIRC, and went up to ~57% in that time. That was before the local overhaul facility was completed, so it should be creeping north of 60% by now.
I think even a 10% or so increase in availability of a 205-215 sized fleet could lead to some tangible flight hour gains.
The major limitation in terms of pilot training is operating cost per flight hour rather than serviceability (which at 60%+ in peacetime is closing in on the older F-15Cs). An aircraft flying 200 hours annually, spends a little over 2% of its time in the air. As long as the pilot isn’t on holiday and weather isn’t a chronic issue, serviceability isn’t going to hamper pilot training.
VnomadNot true.. Given the recent development in EUR/USD exchange rate, the Rafale is, again, cheaper than the F-35.
Not if the dozen or so articles putting the Rafale offer to India at $8bn+ for 36 jets, are true. EUR 8 bn acc. to the latest report. That’s over $250M each. About the same as what Egypt paid. Qatari are paying nearly $300M each for their batch (they presumably need more hand-holding).
if you compare the price for rafale, with support, training and ToT with a flyaway cost of the F-35 alone, then, yes, you end up paying more for the rafale, especially when the euro is high against the dollar… in apples to apples comparison it doesn’t come close
Just to echo BIO’s point – what ToT? The F-35 looks to be ahead apples-to-apples, not least because all of its export contracts include at least 50% offset value. (Unless you’re referring to the still cheaper Japanese contract incl. limited ToT & local assembly).
All these figures are for this currently fortuitous period for the European defence industry, where the Euro is still very weak against the dollar. And BTW it will eventually strengthen (when the Eurozone finally recovers from the recession).
Vnomadno reason? considering the way LM has handled this from the beginning, there is quite a valid reason to be careful with your expectations about that aircraft and anything related to its availability/spares.. in fact anything coming from LM
Well… they appear to be beating my expectations on acquisition costs vis a vis the Eurocanards. I always expected the Rafale/EF to be roughly at par with the F-35. Most recent contracts/negotiations suggest the latter is a good bit cheaper. So that’s one notch in the belt.
VnomadHe’s saying IF the F-35 mirrors the operational availability of the Norwegian frigate fleet (which faced significant spares issue with the Fridtjof Nansen class) they might have only a third of the F-35s available at any time. Sounds like a throwaway remark for the press, rather than a conclusion arrived after a serious analysis of the costs associated with F-35 operations (no reason, for example, to assume spares supply will be scarce or exorbitantly priced).
Vnomad1. Currently Norway is scheduled to purchase 52 (48 + 4 training) F-35A. This number may be revised downwards, but by how much, nobody knows as of yet. I don’t see us go down to 12! Denmark on the other hand… may have to go below 24 unless they want to gut other parts of their military.
2. 87 million for 12 35A? It’s a bit more than that I would think.
I’ve assumed a operating cost of $40,000/hour (instead of $32K/hr for the USAF). The difference should be more than sufficient to accommodate higher personnel costs and potential cost overruns.
We have not even started operating yet, and are already spending significant amounts on the F-35, every year. And everything seems to be more expensive than what was “estimated”.
Since then it has become clear that we need to add “hundreds of millions” of NOK to the upgrade of the airbase, due to the higher noise levels and a few other things.
These are one-time/non-recurring costs. Not really an indication of the maximum number of F-35s that Norway can afford to operate.
VnomadTURKEY:
Budget: $18 billion
Local prices: 55%
Army: 77,000
Navy: 50,000
Air Force: 60,000
Operating 280 fighters (plus AWACS & MRTT)
SINGAPORE:
Budget: $9.5 billion
Local prices: 68%
Army: 35,000
Navy: ~17,500
Air Force: ~17,500
Operating 150 fighters (plus AWACS & MRTT)
NORWAY:
Budget: $7.2 billion
Local prices: 150% (of USA)
Army: 11,500
Navy: 3,500
Air Force: 3,500
Operating 57 fighter jets (no independent support assets)
Replaced by just 12 F-35As?
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