Whenever a plane manufacturer ‘productionises’ a design, the first 20 or so models usually have small, usually harmless glitches, most often due to issues with outside suppliers.
Things such as the microwave ovens not working properly, warning lights coming on for no reason, in-flight entertainment computer playing up. All drives paying passengers mad of course.
I’m not quite sure what problems VS had, but it would be something along these lines. Usually first customers get big discounts to flight test the early models.
Talking about VS liking 4×4’s, they’ve been talking to Boeing about buying at least 20 777-3ER’s. Airbus are offering 20 346’s. Airbus seem to have the upper hand in this deal according to reports, lets hope VS have forgiven Airbus for the start-up problems on their first batch of 346’s.
With the 7E7 it is interesting to note what effect it will have on the market for the 332 which has been Airbus’ top seller in the past few years. Put it this way, would you buy a 332 when you can now order a 7E7 that is 20% cheaper to fly? Analysts have blamed strong 332 sales on killing the 767 market. So it’s all out war on medium twins at the moment. Airbus have responded to the 7E7 threat by offering a lightweight version of the 332, but details on this seem thin at the moment.
Transport
May 23, 2004
Virgin eyes $1bn Airbus contract
Dominic O’Connell
VIRGIN ATLANTIC is in the final stages of talks with Airbus and Boeing over a $1 billion order for 20 aircraft that it wants to help expand its long-haul operations.
Talks are continuing despite Virgin’s decision, revealed last week by The Sunday Times, to delay deliveries of its new Airbus A380 super-jumbos. Virgin confirmed this week that it would not start flights with the 550-seat aircraft until the end of 2007, rather than in 2006 as had been planned.
The talks with Boeing and Airbus centre on replacing the airline’s nine Airbus A340-300 aircraft, and on providing additional planes to cope with expected growth.
Virgin recently paid about £20m for new runway slots at Heathrow airport, and it plans extra services to the Caribbean, the Far East and Australia.
Virgin yesterday confirmed that it was in negotiations with the rival manufacturers, and said it expected to announce a deal towards the end of the summer. The first deliveries of the 20 new aircraft are not expected until 2006, and will continue over the following four to five years.
The order would be the largest by a British airline for some time, beating Flybe’s £800m contract for Bombardier turboprop planes last year.
In its recent aircraft purchases, Virgin has been an Airbus stalwart, buying the A380 and new versions of the A340. But industry sources said last night that it could this time go for Boeing and buy a stretched version of its large twin-jet, the 777. A Virgin spokesman would not comment on the progress of the talks.
Air France said on Friday that it, too, would delay the delivery of its Airbus A380s, but by just four months.
The company said the hold-up was caused by delays to the construction of a terminal at Charles de Gaulle airport in Paris.
Most airlines don’t let you get off on these flights, it wastes time and costs them money
Passengers have been flying flights of up to twenty four hours for years. Try LHR -SYD on Quantas’s 31-inch pitch or JNB-JFK or Dehli-JFK. Just because the plane lands for fuel once doen’t mean it is a short flight.
In case anyone hasnt noticed, those new A340’s with RR Trent’s have gained a massive 35-40 tons of extra structrual weight compared to the A340 classic. That’s 747 weight territory.
They also cost about 25% more to operate than comparable 777’s. At least they have 4 engines and don’t have ETOPS limitations.
Squirrel’s nuts
Well I bet those squirrels were after in the in-flight nuts. They must have been very important squirrels to have to have to have been transported by air, were they bound for a resturant?
Animals and flying don’t mix. There was an incident a couple of years ago when a SAA 744 en route to London had to put down in Nigeria after the cargo hold fire supressors went off. The reason was a load of pigs in cargo that started farting, producing methane, in heavy turbulence, according to the airline. The fire extinguishers killed the pigs and thus the problem, by the way. Boeing thinks of everything eh.
41 = all planes, wide and small.
Maybe the pilot on that A346 had a bad bedside manner and really managed to freak everyone out, glad it wasnt twin:D
Or maybe the journalist was trying to get a byline.
The SAA A340-600’s are flying to New York, Atlanta and Hong Kong at the moment. Sydney/Perth is expected soon. I’ve no idea how they are rated by pilots. SAA have said in official press releases that they are well pleased with their performance. That’s the official company line anyway. SAA have also been talking about buying more A346’s to replace their 744’s which were recently sold to a lease company. SAA now leases their 744’s as opposed to owning them
As far as the A346 goes, this should of interest:
Engine failiure:
http://www.sundaytimes.co.za/2003/02/16/news/news12.asp
Passenger complaints:
http://www.sundaytimes.co.za/2004/04/18/business/companies/comp08.asp
As far the Emirates A340 experiencing hydraulics failiure: I thought Airbus used FBW with electrical servos which have back-ups on critical control surfaces. Also I doubt the flight computer would be at fault because there are supposed to be four or three seperate computers and if one doesnt agree with the others, it is excluded.
Good point Whiskey Delta
Hand,
The windshear explanation makes sense.
Thunderstorms and the like are quite common at this time of the year at JNB. So it was quite possible the wind could have been blowing one direction at one end of the runway and another direction 4km’s away at the end, like the Minereve ORY example you gave.
A headwind of, say, 20 knots at the begining of the roll and and tailwinds or so of say, 20 knots, at V2 sounds lie a good candidate for retarding the rotate by reducing the take-off speed by as much 40 knots.
The question is: Don’t most airlines specify maximum available thrust in these kinds of weather situations? Certainly Emirates was doing it here.
I’ve taken off from JNB on fully loaded A343’s a number of times and on every occasion the plane rotated right at the end of the 4200m runway – you could see the boundry fence go past the window as the plane lifted. Basically in summer when its hot the CFM engines on an A343 take that long to get it up to speed at 1700m above sea level. In fact on Virgin, before the roll begins, the pilot actually announces that it’s going to be a tight run thing, I think WSIWYG mentioned this as well.
It’s tempting to think there could be a link of some sort here with the incident mentioned. If it was a flight control issue, it would certainly not help that the A343 had very little runway left on the take-off roll when/if that kind of problem took place. I wonder why the crew where not using full power initially as well?
I’ve taken off on Md-11’s, 744’s and A332’s and they certainly don’t run short of runway at hot and high JNB (Especially not the MD-11’s). Usually during high summer the usual JNB A343 operators, Air France and Virgin, switch to 747’s. The A340 has problem with hot and high take-off’s at full load, no doubt about it.
What’s also quite alarming is that the A343 had brake failure when it landed after this as well. I think I mentioned that the last time I was on an A343, also ex JNB, the brakes didnt seem to healthy and were making a loud grinding noise on landing at LHR.
damn, busted:)
But it does have small RR’s, I’m sure of it.
Mr non-plane spotter exposed:D
To slow? They seemed pretty fast when I was sitting in one of them:)
They were also quite new as well.
I think it was those underpowered dinky little CFM engines that battled in the hot conditions. Imagine if the 343 came with the RR Trents on 757. That would be perfect.
On a related subject, as I’m sure everyone knows, SIA unloaded their entire fleet of 20-odd A340-300’s some years ago in exchange for 777’s. Did they think the A343’s were that bad that they had to get rid of all them??
Then there was the Spanish A320 that bounced so hard on landing that the computer decided the pilot was attempting a go around configured the plane for climb resulting in a end of runway overshoot because flaps had been retracted etc!!