The Government did not have the funds to allow industry to make the RAF what it could have been. There is no doubt that there were some incredibly advanced designs that were not only designed but made it to prototype stage- there names stalk the internet today. the problem was money exascerbated by ridiculous requirements,

P.1154: Mach 2 V/STOL fighter
AW.681: V/STOL capable (usually only STOL) tactical transport
TSR-2: Mach-2 STOL theater bomber
Avro-730: Mach-3 Strategic bomber
F.155T: Mach-3 heavy interceptor

Amongst this lunacy two very promising designs did emerge that could potentially have largely filled most of the combat missions required by both the RAF and the RN with a single very exportable type. (yes thats right no strategic bombers).

Hawker P.1121: If you use the search function there is at least one thread here about it.

Vickers Type 581: A swing wing Mach 2 fighter that could be either a strike aircraft or a fighter (conversion in a short period of time was stipulated in the requirement) that was intended to operate from carriers from the outset.

Despite the fact that the prototype P.1121 reached the construction phase (its fuselage still exists somewhere today IIRC) neither type ever flew and the RAF is where it is today.

2nd that.. Sooner or later, one company would have accepted Chinese proposal for cooperation anyway. Denel, Eurocopter or Agusta, no difference here.

The best way to make business for AW would be to help design Z-10 and subsequently sell sh!tloads of A-129s to Taiwan to counter the new-born threat! 😉

Of course the great irony is (and these are not my words) that the result thus far has been that China has developed one of the most effective industrial espionage infrastructures the world has ever known producing an endless supply of usable knowhow and technology that far exceeds what could ever have been obtained taking even the most open of legal roots, and the Chinese can do what they like with it once they have it.

You don’t care of industrial reality and LOGIC ?

The low price of the F-16 comes with high series. Of course, as soon as you’ve got a short one (block 60), look at the result.
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0ICK/is_3_14/ai_68507685
http://www.f-16.net/f-16_users_article22.html

8 billions for 80 planes, without weapons.

Lol, thats becouse the UAE payed for the development of a whole bunch of new systems (engine, radar EW suite, etc) not to mention brand new strengthened airframes!:rolleyes:

I was talking about taking second hand airframes and giving them already developed or cheap to develop systems.:rolleyes:

Seems to me that this is just a matter of technology.

It could be argued that most of what a manned aircraft does is already long distance/remotely handled… guided missiles, smart weapons etc.

What I’m considering, in removal of human in-situ control of events, is surely simply a further step away in terms of remoteness, is it not? Given the fact that you’re saving your own side’s lives, together with other considerable pluses like saving on training/equipment/personnel, there has to be mileage in this.

Well what is now being worked on are basically strike platforms, literally just stealthy bomb trucks, relatively simple compared to a Fighter although I have no doubt that they will appear in the coming decades. Also remember that the level of autonomy will increase aswell. It is not inconceivable that unmanned air vehicles will start making their own decisions in the coming decades.

Just remember “The attack began at 6:18 PM, just as he said it would.”:D

IIRC the F-15K got F-110’s as well, its all quite intriguing, there must be something giving it the sales edge for the new gen eagles?

A tailored F-16 with such technologies wouldn’t be “a lot cheaper” than a Rafale I fear.
About these “some areas”, could you named few of them ?

I stated block 52
For the price, I can’t think of block 60 or an equivalent, unless a huge discount from the US administration.

Can you provide figures to back it up? I dont care what you stated, you are not the one making the deal.

ZJ809 BH 29 sdn is parked out on the ramp at Luxembourg this afternoon and I understand that this and another one came out here on Friday.

Why and what are they doing here?

Pillaging mostly.:D