More like a further stealthified B-1 variant.

Preferably supersonic.

Must be some Swedish-outlandish idea of “5th” generation there..

You seem to be ignoring the whole point. That the record of the Mig-29 in Combat Conditions and/or Military Exercises. Has hardly been successful…..

As for the Super Hornet vs the Mig-29K or 35 or whatever. I doubt the majority of the Experts. Would choose the latter if given a choice….IMO

BTW While not a fact by a long shot. It’s been rumored that the Mig-35 will not win the MMRCA and was at or near the bottom of list. Plus, the Mig-29K is to be replaced by a New Naval Fighter. With one of the contenders being the Super Hornet. Clearly, in the case of India. Sure sound like as a operator of both early and late models(i.e. A/K)of the Mig-29. That they are looking at other types.

Hardly a winning endorsement!:(

The MiG has a bad ‘combat’ record for obvious reasons.

The “military exercise” record is the other way around for the most part, especially depending on how you interpret what pilots said. WVR performance for older MiGs in those exercises, since that’s all they had, was quite heavily praised.

And you can keep your ‘doubt’ about the ‘expert choice’ where the sun don’t shine – what experts are we even talking about here? :rolleyes:

And about the MMRCA, then that’s no surprise anyway. The Typhoon has a more ‘generational’ jump on most of the fighters there, giving it attractive performance figures. The teens have no chance in that case either.

First, the Mig-29K doesn’t have the Mig-35 Avionics. Second, nor do I believe that would give it the edge even if it did.

The MiG-29K could be upgraded to MiG-35 avionics fairly easily I suspect.

And the only thing the F-18E would have over it in weapons is more smart bomb sizes. Nothing else.

It would lack any quality anti-radiation and anti-ship weapons as compared to the MiG.

Why is the Su-27SM’s cockpit “better” than that of the Su-30MKI? Judging the MMI from a stand still photograph is layman’s science and that’s it. And I meant the HUD radar display as such which is not as flexible and may in fact subtract from the pilots attention and may simply clutter the display. Just take a look at the videos posted. Some jamming and the entire HUD area is green, great for situational awareness.

And we certainly know enough about the N-001 per se to realise that this radar is dated in uncompetitive today. The N-011M is factually a newer and more advanced design. Believing that the N-001 is even remotely comparable is naive at best… We don’t know enough is a lame excuse in this case! Common sense and reasoning is almost enough here!

No see, we don’t know much at all. The Su-30MKx radars are not what the Su-27SM received. I did recall a rumor of several ‘special’ modes for the domestic version – perhaps haavarla would know the details.

Again, if the AWG-9/APG-71 could have roughly BARS like A2A performance, 20 years earlier, then you guys are seriously just blind to the possibility that the N001VP for domestic use could have very good performance.

We actually do. It is the same old N001 with a bypass channel for R-77 and few new A-G modes. It is much less useful and flexible than even the earliest BARS, let alone the one in installed in the MKI Mk3 with Indian Hydebarad processors.

Really.. we do? Must see official data (that must claim this was installed on the 2004+ Su-27SMs delivered to the RuAF). Please show us!

Found this chart in Take-off magazine (good source, isn’t it)

Basically it says that the Radar on the Su-27SM has inferior performance in the typical basic parameters of a radar, compared to the Bars.

http://www.take-off.ru/pdf/08-09_2007.pdf

Export =/= domestic.

next, dionis is going to claim that the N001 in th Su-27SM is capable of being modified with an AESA antenna.

perhaps the reason for some, who are dearly hanging into the sole quote of a Russian general and ignoring all the other facts and realities, lies a deeper bias in the logic. The Su-30MKI for them, represents a period of shame, when the once mighty Soviet Union that exported monkey models, was broke, and more willing to sell some (especially tactical) aircraft that were superior to the version at home (and in some cases, not even afforded by the home country).. all in order to make money and save themselves. Thus India and China operating superior Flanker models than those in Russia during the 90s and most of the 2000’s. Russia would build many promising testbeds, but could never afford to adopt it for its own air force.

Like wise, Knaapo and Iapo could only survive the 90s because of Indian, Malaysian, Algerian, Vietnamese, and Chinese orders. because the Russian AF wasn’t buying much of anything at those times. Its the reason why Sukhoi could continue R&D for Pak-fa (which got its much needed financial boost yesterday from India).

To add further to the insult for them.. was the fact that both India and China, when possible, would prefer to install foreign/domestic parts in their flankers.

This also applies to Fulcrums too, the SMT and K being better than what Russia fields at home. The SMT being an export to Algeria, and only fielded by the Russian AF simply because Algeria refused to accept it and opted for the MKA.

like wise, we’ll probably see foreign countries like Algeria be the first to adopt the Yak-130 into service before the RuAF and maybe even the Su-35 with Venezuela.

The RuAF refused to upgrade the Fulcrum period anyway. So it’s a gray area.

The MKI is hardly a period of shame, as the MKI didn’t exist until maybe 6 years ago – roughly the time that Su-27SM jets came into existence. The Indians flew around their Su-30K’s for a LONG time.

The Yak-130 has already been delivered to the RuAF in some very small number, so what are you on about?

With the Su-35, if anyone gets it a year early you can consider it a show of good faith – cause the RuAF will get far more than any export customer can afford.

(This is exactly what I meant about bad, evil, drunk, crap,etc Russia). How lame can you be man?

Oh any funny note on that claim for AESA antenna .. they did have the PESA option with ‘Pero’ 😉

It’s a completely different aircraft. Not as different as F/A-18C and F/A-18E but with more modifications than between JAS39C and Gripen NG. The airframe construction of the K is based on MiG-29M while SMT is only upgrade of basic 9.12/9.13 Fulcrums. Although identical in appearance, not even external shape is the same (sharp LERX, overwing louvres, canopy shape, spine shape, enlarged wings, different tails, brake shield construction etc.)

Generally, the M airframe is much more advanced than SMT’s, saving almost 2 tons weight, IIRC.

I just can’t see how a Cassegrain style antenna could possibly be superior to a phased array design. Su-27SM is nothing but an interim solution and is hardly more capable than Su-30MKK/MK2.

I am sure the Su-27SM radar is not “superior” to the Su-30MKI radar, but if they are even remotely comparable in A2A performance then there’s plenty of reason to believe the RuAF colonel in his interview. I’d mostly rate them on lock-on range and the ability to hit 4 targets with ARH missiles. Then there’s the rest of the avionics to consider.

Still haven’t answered my question – How did the IAF get the R-77 before the RuAF?
There isn’t one item of avionics or equipment on the SM which you can prove is superior to that on the MKI, except of course, the engines.

I don’t know the exact deal with the R-77, they could have EASILY got it years and years ago.

Just how great is the baseline R-77 compared to a R-27RE/TE combo? If the upgraded N-001V or whatever can guide even 2 of the R-27ERs, that’s capability enough. All of these garbage “8 target at once” brochures are like the old Intel vs AMD CPU clock speed wars – a bunch of non-sense.

lol okay, so because we are q uestioning the SM’s superiority over the MKI.. we are Russophobic. perhaps you did not realize, the Su-30MKI is predominantly.. a Russian aircraft!!

No, merely that anything to do with the Russian Federation itself = Russia is wrong, bad, behind, evil, drunk, etc. :rolleyes:

I never claimed the Su-27SM as superior to the MKI. If I used those exact words then I take it back. I do think, however, that based on what was said in the interviews, that they are highly comparable in overall capability, i.e: nearly no difference.