No I’m just pointing at that Greece is making the best use of existing weapons. A-7E with laser guided weapons require off board designation, so it makes sense to use older weapons to train and work with.

I’m not talking down to you, I’m trying to discuss the topic. 😉

The F-16E/F has HARM, Harpoon, AIM-120B. It was seen with GBU-31 JDAM during August 2009 Red Flag. AIM-120C7 are due in 2011. The APG-80 is pretty handy – due to its AESA the single seat F-16E can terrain follow and use either SAR mode or guide AMRAAM at the same time. The two-seat F-16F can do all three at the same time – the aircraft is automatically terrain following, the pilot is engaging enemy fighters, the WSO is using the SAR mode to designate for weapons in all weathers.

Mirage 2000-9 RDY-7 radar can either terrain follow or engage targets with Mica. The Damocles also has the Nahar nav FLIR in any case.

Both types can use terrain comparison (TERCOM guidance). Both types have HMD. They also both equipped with Link UAE 2 (LU 2) and can link 8 aircraft at once. This was recently made compatible with Link 16.

Mirage 2000-9 has one capability the F-16E/F does not have – 600 Black Shaheen (SCALP EG) cruise missiles…..

UAE has rcently completed its ground C&C infrastructure:
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2005/12/16/203632/uae-air-force-lays-out-advanced-warfighting-plans.html

Next step is the delayed AEW deal. The two ex-Swedish Erieye are due to arrive ~November 2010. Supposedly these lack the onboard controllers – they feed the radar data to aircraft and ground stations. This will give UAE some experience with AEW – the definite system would be Wedgetail, E-2D (if cleared for export – with additional fuel in wings) or Saab 2000/Eireye.

Rafale would be further out – the UAE needs AEW and possibly rumoured ASTOR before replacing the Mirage 2000-9. It will take a while to sort out the requirements, sign a contract and have Dassault, etc develop and test the required changes (they’d need GATR radios and LU 2 for example). Advantage here is the Mirage 2000-9 weapons (Mica, Black Shaheen, Damocles) could be reused.

AFDS went operational on A-7E in 2001, followed by the A-7H in 2002.

They use many conventional weapons – Mk 82, Mk 83, Mk 84, M117, Rockeye, CBU-55, BLU-1, BLU-27 bombs, LA-3, LAU-68 rocket pods and GBU-16 Paveway II (designated by offboard).

A-7E use AAR-45 nav FLIR pod and buddy refuelling stores.

A-7E (A-7H had nuclear wiring removed) used US B61-5 nuclear bombs from service entry in 1993 till 2001/2002. It was the last Greek aircraft with a nuclear tasking.

Problem with using the A-7E as a lead in to the F-16 its the old-fashioned cockpit.

So the single-seaters have no mission and have been phased out?

You’ll excuse me if I’m a bit confused here…

The single seat A-7E remain in service (I’m uncertain on the two seat status). From 2003 on new pilots were posted to A-7 squadrons for their first tour (~3 years), then heading off the F-16. In wartime they still be used as attack aircraft. At least 20 A-7H remain in storage with restore to flight in 30 days.

The A-7H was removed from the air defense role on 31 July 1992….

Mirage 2000EG are only flown by experienced pilots (might have changed from 2010).

F-4 pilots fly as WSO for 3 years before moving to the front seat.

As for the Exocet, unless A-7’s carried Harpoons, I don’t think they can match that specific capability although I read recently they used the land-attack variant of the Harpoon missile known as the AGM-84E SLAM during the 1991 Gulf War, which was and still remains in later variants a very capable missile. I don’t have confirmation of their use from Corsair’s in ’91 though…just something I read in passing.

They carried laser guided bombs, Shrike, HARM and Walleye including the AWW-9 datalink pods. In 1991 the SLAM were fired from F/A-18C and guided by A-7E using the AWW-9 pods.

It could outfly some fighters – rated at 7G and 140°/second roll rate. It had a bag of range. Outside of the F-111 and before the Tornado was introduced into service, Greece considered the A-7H the best attack fighter in Europe.

A-7D/E/H had HUD (first US aircraft so equipped) with digital computer (was most accurate bomber in Vietnam-era), had all weather avionics and a roller map.

LANA navigation FLIR pod allowed night flying (FLIR image was superimposed on the HUD).

Greece had RWR, decoys and internal jammer fitted ~1981 to its A-7H.

Dug around and found the article – Australian Aviation March 2010. Written by Andrew McLaughlin with Air Vice Marshal John Harvey (Program Manager New Air Combat Capability). Get along to your local library in Australia and read the article, best written thing I’ve read on the RAAF JSF status.

“Block 3 will be the version the RAAF will declare IOC with in about 2018 after it completes OT, but that software load is note currently slated to come with a maritime strike weapon which is a key requirement for the RAAF. In the interim, fast jet maritime strike options for the ADF include allocating the task solely to the 24 Super Hornets which will be armed with AGM-154C-1 JSOW C; risking a capability gap until a naval strike missile becomes available on JSF; or the possibility of Australia paying to bring forward a naval strike capability earlier. At the moment we are looking at whether its Block 4 or Block 5 the maritime strike missile will come in. But maritime strike is a whole spectrum of capabilities. The F-35A aircraft itself at Block 3 will be capable of conducting maritime strike – it’s got the systems and teh sensors and the modes to be able to do it, but the only weapon it will have at that time for a moving ship is a laser guided bomb. But the US Navy F-35C variant will have JSOW C1 at Block 3, all the mission systems will be done, but in the core JSF program the JSOW won’t yet have the clearances done off the F-35A. Now if we (RAAF) wanted to, we could choose to do the JSOW clearances off the F-35A ourselves. The weapon bay is the same and the mission systems are the same; the only difference is the wing (and the aerodynamic effects on the weapon at release).”
Page 45-46

It goes on to say SDB II (Block 4) will have quite a good maritime strike capability, and long term the RAAF is looking at the Norwegian JSM.

UAI handles the software, but doesn’t get around doing carriage/vibration, release and separation trials.

JSF isn’t mix and match – you can’t select the wings from the F-35C and the fuselage from the F-35A (someone on this very board mentioned this as an option a while back), certain weapons are version specific. The article also mentions JSF Block upgrades should be every two years and will cost around US$1 billion each. Australia is 3% stakeholder in the JSF and would pay 3% of all costs ($30 million per Block). Thats a bargain compared with previous upgrade costs. If any JSF customer wants a unique weapon or capability they either convince partner countries to place it in the Block or pay all the costs themselves – Israel wants 600 USG drop tanks vice the 426 USG ones, along with Python 5 and SPICE. They have moved these to follow-on buys due to time and money. They have already stated the weapons would require aircraft hardware modifications.

Only with the two seat F-16D/F versions. Avionics displaced by the second seat are moved to the spine.

Thanks Pete, I knew a second batch was imminent but wasn’t sure when it was due to arrive. As for the C7’s well as mentioned the Data Buses have been retrofitted on the older hornets to allow them to carry the weapon so stocks will soon be arriving as we did order them- this will carry over to the F-35’s I imagine.

Legacy Hornets received AMRAAM from December 2001 (3 Sqn was first). ASRAAM followed in August 2004 (all squadrons equipped by Sep 04).

I’m fairly sure these were AIM-120C. AIM-120C5 might have been ordered/delivered from 2005.

AIM-120C5 are used on the F/A-18F.

Now we did locally assemble a bulk of our Hornets here at Avalon, but they aren’t upgraded to C/D standard at all, they are a different sub-class being called the AM/BM class, similar to the EF-18’s in Spain and the CF-18’s in Canada. All the Classic Hornets of the A and B model needed an upgrade by mid 90’s and this was what they came up with.

Supposedly the local assembly added 20% to the cost.

As mentioned above, the first 14 (the initial order) are to go to 3Sqdn based at RAAF Williamtown NSW (aka- Fighter Town Australia). Subsequent orders and aircraft will move to the other squadrons (76, 77 and 78) over time and when the aircraft become available. However 2OCU will be stood down due to the F-35 not having a dual seat trainer- 2OCU may become a dedicated simulator squadron and train the pilots at Williamtown, but no aircraft will be assigned. Aircraft will rotate periodically with ARDU over in South Australia with at least 2 based at RAAF Edinburgh at any one time.

Note sure on this – the initial 72 is said to be for three squadrons by 2021. Currently the Hornets are under 3 OCU, 3, 77 at Williamtown and 75 at Tindal. Each squadron might have 17 aircraft (12 available, 4 maintenance, 1 depot) = 51. Even with 2 at ARDU, leaves 19 attrition reserve.

2 OCU going makes sense – RAAF has been standing up numerous non-flying squadron number plates lately.

Then its either keep the F/A-18F with 1 Sqn (operational) an 6 Sqn (training). The break down here is supposed to be 18 operational with 1 Sqn and 6 training/maintenance with 6 Sqn. If the remaining 28 F-35A are purchased, I’d expect 6 Sqn to go.

So it looks like 1, 3, 75, 77 Sqns?

BTW, 76 Sqn flies the Hawk LIFT.
Edit: 2 Squadron is Wedgetail. 3 Sqn is Hornet OCU.

Just as a side note, I was searching for info on the RAAF Hornet upgrades when I found that the Diggerhistory site made reference to Thailand having the Hornets as well, Ummmmmmm, when did that happen?

Thailand ordered 8 F/A-18D – these were cancelled as part of the ‘Asian flu’ in 1998.