wow digging up a 3yr old thread which has no meaning and nothings actually happened about deploying them…. some people really must be bored.

Aussie Digger, not just night flying and flying in bad weather is the issue (there is a thing called brown out which chopper pilots must learn to deal with as well).

I’m aware of that. My previous point was sarcastic. The Tigers are nowhere near ready for deployment anywhere outside Australian peacetime training environments (even then with caveats).

Clearly they were a much better buy than the AH-64D it was chosen in favour of…

I meant taking into account that Largs Bay is actually operational/seaworthy. 😉

We haven’t got it yet though… Toobroken and Kanimbla will be back at sea before we do…

We’ve still got to take it for a test drive, refit it and conduct some RAN specific modifications before we can start using it…

With the UK seemingly walking away from any aspirations it may once have had to maintain a globally relevant military, I’m not sure what “closer ties” would mean at a practical level.

We still exercise quite frequently with RAF E-3D aircraft attending Australian Pitch Black exercises in recent years and of course in Five Power Defence Agreement exercises in South East Asia.

UK and Australia maintain a long running exercise known (in Australia) as Exercise Long Look, where Commissioned offcers and (largely) NCO’s do an exchange posting in the other’s military for 2 years or more (hence the name) and recently our 2 Defence Ministers have made a formal arrangement for a more regular AUKMIN meeting to emulate our existing AUSMIN meetings with the US.

Australia also undertakes Exercise Northern Trident every couple of years, when one of our frigates will undertake a round the world trip, doing plenty of port visists and exercises with local forces, but the focus of the trip is exercising in the Northern Hemisphere, mostly with the RN.

I’d suggest that with plenty of commonality between our forces especially in airlift (C-17, C-130J-30) and in future aerial refuelling with the A330 MRTT/KC-30A, that plenty of opportunities to work closer and learn fom each other will remain.

Seems a pity that the Fincastle ASW exercise will probably fade away, without a UK entrant for some years. How interesting will it be flogging the Kiwis, year in year out?

Actually not that bad… 😀

Out of interest, here was the ADF’s exercise schedule in 2006. Quite interesting just how much Australia and the UK still train together, admittedly not always soley with each other. Still, no fewer than 14 exercises planned that year…

http://www.defence.gov.au/budget/05-06/dar/web_only_section/03_exercise.html

Regards,

AD

Just to clarify, The Australian claims that Australia has been successful in its bid for Largs Bay.

I should think ‘yes’ to both.

So does Australia’s Defence Minister…

Minister for Defence Stephen Smith and Minister for Defence Materiel Jason Clare today announced that Australia has been successful in its bid to acquire the United Kingdom’s Bay Class amphibious ship Largs Bay.

The Government has previously announced that it had asked Defence to develop new and comprehensive options to ensure transition to Australia’s Canberra Class amphibious Landing Helicopter Dock ships, which become operational from 2014, including the lease or purchase of a Bay Class Ship from the UK Government.

Today, the Government is confirming that Australia has been successful in its bid to acquire a Bay Class ship, Largs Bay.

Largs Bay is a Landing Ship Dock (LSD) which was commissioned into service in 2006. It became surplus to United Kingdom (UK) requirements as a result of the UK Government’s 2010 Defence Strategic Review.

The ship weighs 16,000 tonnes. It is 176 metres long and 26 metres wide. Its flight deck has room for two large helicopters and can also carry around 150 light trucks and 350 troops. Its cargo capacity is the equivalent of the Royal Australian Navy’s entire amphibious fleet.

Largs Bay is a proven capability having provided humanitarian relief as part of the international response to the Haiti earthquake in 2010.

Largs Bay will help ensure that the Royal Australian Navy has the amphibious capability it needs for operation and humanitarian support in our region in the period leading up to the arrival of the Landing Helicopter Dock Ships.

The ship has been acquired for £65 million (approximately $100 million).

Teekay Shipping Australia has thoroughly inspected the ship and found that: “The ship presents very well, and from a technical point of view, there are no major defects.”

Before the acquisition is finalised, Defence and the Royal Australian Navy will conduct sea trials to confirm the material state of the ship.

The ship is expected to arrive by the end of the year in time for it to be operational in early 2012.

The Government will announce further details of the transition plan for Australia’s amphibious ship capability to provide this essential capability until arrival of the Canberra Class in due course.

http://www.minister.defence.gov.au/Claretpl.cfm?CurrentId=11664

The UK has been saying for quite a while now (at a military level) that it wants to get closer ties to Australia again. Is this the first step?

any source? Never heared anything like it..

I believe he’s talking about the overall package price, not individual aircraft price and as the Super Hornet package price includes a large weapon, sensor and support package, but it is unclear if the other proposals do or whether these would be an additional cost, the prices are hardly worth being used to ‘prove any sort of point’.

Unless it is an apples to apples contest with similar overall packages, quoting a price is futile.

I am surprised at that Hornet + 4 Sidewinder setup. I figured with an Australian bird it would carry an ASRAAM. Also it looks to be loaded for Anti-shipping duty which makes the number of Sidewinders odd too.

The RAAF only uses ASRAAM on her legacy Hornets. They use AIM-9X on the new Super Hornets.

That photo was from Avalon airshow, where the RAAF Super Hornets were appearing for the first time and basically showing off all their kit. That aircraft was a static display only. The RAAF Super Hornet display aircraft flew their show clean, apart from a single centreline drop tank.

RAAF ordered her Super Hornets almost completely off the shelf to get it in-service as quickly as possible and as risk free as possible, whereas the ASRAAM was selected after a detailed evaluation by RAAF between ASRAAM, AIM-9X and Python IV.

It must also be considered that ASRAAM was chosen at a time when RAAF’s frontline BVR weapon was still the AIM-7 Sparrow and AIM-120A was still being integrated onto the Hornets, ie: ASRAAM’s “BVR” capability was factored into the equation when choosing the weapon, to bolster RAAF’s limited overall capability in this area…

If RAAF were choosing a new WVR weapon today, I think it unlikely they would have opted for the ASRAAM (not that they are unhappy with it by any means)…

Aviation Week – Australia Formally Approves Extra C-17 Buy

Jolly good.

I hope NZ does go in for a C-17 or two at some point and that we end up with a joint strategic airlift force.

Me too, though the current 5th C-17A is not being funded by NZ in any way. It (as will RFA Largs Bay, if acquired by RAN) is being funded from the fund that will be “under-spent” this financial year.

Basically ADF for one reason or another cannot spend all of it’s allocated capability acquisition funding in this financial year, to the tune of more than AUD$500m and instead of doing what they are normally forced to do and return this money to Government, Government appears to have approved this money to be spent on addressing relatively urgent capability gaps that ADF can manage to spend it on.

Quite a unique position for Australia. Normally this money is handed back to Government for a “promised” reallocation in future years when the money can then be spent. Promised as usual, doesn’t mean “certain” when it comes to future Government priorities.

Aren’t the F-16s quite ripe for replacement already? They are ancient F-15A Block 15 OCU, as far as I know.

I don’t see the chances for other aircraft that slim but in the end it will come down to budget constraints. The Indonesian MoD has already shown interest in other designs, some years ago they wanted ex-French Mirage 2000Cs refurbed and upgraded to 2000-5 standard, with Magic II and MICA. That is where Dassault jumoped in and tried to push Rafale thru, which in return turned out to be too costly. But it looks as if they were not much fixed on maintaining the F-16 lineage.

BTW, TNI-AU has formally also asked for quotes for J-10, JF-17 and JAS39C as replacement for F-5E/F.

Their F-16’s are old, but they will be getting Falcon Star (or some sort of equivalent) and MLU updates to bring them up to a refurbished Block 52/+ status. I believe the TNI-AU is intending to acquire a force of approximately 36x F-16 Block 52+ fighters (10x existing fighters, plus 24 second hand fighters, donated by the US) to operate alongside it’s intended near term force of 16x SU-27/30 MKi fighters.

They are also planning on acquiring a force of 16x Super Tucanos to replace their ancient OV-10 Broncos.

They have a lot of plans to update the aircraft of TNI-AU, but the perennial problem in Indonesia is a lack of funding. Their SU-27/30 Flanker fleet was completely unarmed for more than 5 years after it entered service, because they couldn’t afford to purchase the weapons for them..

With their dire need for airlift, (as an example Australia is gifting them $5m worth of spare parts and logistical support to get a half a squadron of C-130H’s back in the air to help support their own people, instead of using our Hercules to do it all…) as well as modern training structures etc, I can’t honestly believe that Indonesia is serious about the Eurofighter, unless they’ve had a change of mind about the F-16’s, but it would be a strange decision if it is an addition to the F-16’s, more Flankers, more Super Tucanos, more C-130/S-235/295 etc…

Almost like someone’s personal wishlist, than a serious project…