WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by SerbPVO
Slovenia is a small country, but their defense industry is certainly not “small”. After all, they inherited a lot of Yugoslavia’s defense factories .
that’s true, but wasn’t the former Yugoslavian defense industry all integrated with each other through out the different former Yugoslav states? I heard that after the break up..it was difficult to fully assemble parts since some components were made in one country, while the other essential part was now made in another.
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by Arthur
The only trip to Turkmenistan i know of was in 2000, in which little was seen except some 80 stored MiG-23s, and about a regiment’s worth of Su-15s also in storage. Nothing operational, although it has to be said that this particulair trip was more a general recon for Central Asia rather than a full-scale log mission 🙂
That’s very impressive Arthur, I’m surprised you got in! Did you see the golden statues of their leader? 😀 ever since he saw Saddam Hussein getting toppled, it seems that he’s been increasing in paranoia..thus the arms build up.. not only that but he seems to be using his army to do alot of menial work.. like construction of gov’t houses, traffic cops, and now as nurses 😮
Once on the news, I saw two Turkmen MiG-29s flying, so it would seem that they’re definitely using those.
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by GarryB
Yes, of course Paranoia… Lituania has bent over backwards to ensure that it remains viable as an enclave… never playing around with overflight rights for the Russians to access their territory, or threatening the Russians with being shot down if they don’t have the right papers. In the past that wasn’t a problem because Lituanias AF consisted of jet trainers. What happens when it has F-16s?From whom can you guess? I bet it isn’t Iranian F-14s.
BTW it is amusing that you think some will give up their national identity for economic growth. A bit like economic ethnic cleansing…
I don’t know why you seem so angry about this.. Lithuania and the Baltic states have traditionally not been very pro-Russian.. besides, Lithuania doesn’t deserve to have the right to defend their own skies?
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by GarryB
Sounds like the first step is stealing the Kaliningrad perhaps?Use NATO planes to limit and then stop traffic between Kaliningrad and Russia and then ask them if they want to join the EU?
that’s a bit of paranoia.. Given that Kaliningrad has not been one of the regions that have grown economically, it probably only gives the inhabitants more incentive to want to join
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by GarryB
If ancient aircraft like Hueys and Cobras can be mentioned why not Mi-28Ns plus the new model Mi-24s with the Mi-28s rotors, new engines, wings and avionics and other systems. It would be about the closest helo listed so far that is 50 cal resistant already and you can fit about 6 troopers in it so you should be able to squeese 7 smaller asian soldiers in there no problem.The Ka-60 is too light to carry 7-8 troops and be armoured to stop 50 cal rounds.
Another option would be a Ka-50 or Ka-52 and a variant of the Ka-29 assault helo. It can carry 16 troops yet is very small and compact being a naval helo. Neither have tail rotors which is of course a bonus from safety and hover ceiling perspectives.
That’s some stereotypical thinking.. Koreans belong to the northern Mongoloid race and are generally taller and bigger than those that are southern mongoloid.
furthermore.. the Russians gave a pretty good offer before and got refused.. I doubt the S.Koreans will seriously consider it unless it’s for aggressor use or civilian.
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by Arthur
Well, i don’t think the Dhruv or Mi-28 make a lot of sense, since it clearly is about a combined order for utility plus combat helos. Stupid me didn’t think about it, but Aurel’s definately got a point. Bell could indeed be an interesting candidate by dusting off it’s B412 and Cobra rigs, and offer the AH-1W/UH-1Z combo. This combination makes just as much sense as the ECxxx (don’t know the current Eurocopter designations, sorry – but i mean the Dauphin-one)/Tigre combo, or A/W with their A109 (or 119)/A129 combo.
The A-109/A-129 looks to be the “lightest” combo of the three you mentioned..
Personally I would really like to see some foreign export orders for the Mangusta.
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by Hyperwarp
Well, what about the ECM capabalities of the two aircrafts?What else? On a lighter note:
The J-10 is supposed to have 3 MFDs while the M1 has 2.On a lighter, lighter note:
I think the J-10 looks sexier!
The M2 version has 5 (2 in the front and 3 in the back), not to mention that the MiG’s MFDs are much larger than the supposed J-10 one (I’m basing this from a line drawing of the proposed cockpit..so it’s all on assumption for the J-10).
but definitely, I’m wondering about the ECM and ground attack capabilities of the two since it’s all up in the air
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by Arthur
They have got recce birds as well, including a batch of freshly refurbished ones from the Ukraine.Here is one of those at Zaporizhzha, a MiG-25RBSh. That airbase (it’s a combined civil/military/industry airfield) has one of the larger Ukrainian ARZs, where maintenance used to be done on the MiG-25 and engines. Nowadays i think it’s Ukraine’s largest fighter depot and one of the storage sites, with mainly MiG-25s there. When i was at Zaporizhzhe in 1997, there were almost 50 MiG-25s stored there (including a few Lybians), and two or three Su-27s. If you realise that the airbase also housed an Il-76 regiment back then (gone now, as they used to be parked in the revetments in the background of the pic), and that on the other side of the city you can find a former DOSAAF airfield with some 200-250 Yak-52s, L29s, An-2s and the like, you know i particularly enjoyed myself that day 🙂
thanks arthur..that pretty much answers all my questions on the Algerian AF.
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by GarryB
Armed aircraft for use against mobile small ground targets are not much use without a good set of eyes. The Mig-25 has a very good set of eyes (in the recon versions).
which leads to another question, do they have the recce version? the picture of the MiG-25 above clearly looks like it’s the interceptor version.
WACHENR0DERgreat pics, has there been any interests in the MiG-29M2? I recalled that it was beign strongly marketed in Malaysia and I think it was Peru..
Furthermore, I recalled Tom Cooper of ACIG stating that the build/surface quality looks much improved.. how can one tell? it looks the same glossy surface as past MiG-29s to me.
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by GarryB
Countries like Saudi Arabia had quite flash aircraft and still do, why shouldn’t Algeria be allowed to buy new aircraft?Both the SMT upgrades and M2 versions are fully multirole and rather more importantly are cheaper to operate and maintain… why wouldn’t they want them?
The first SMT demo model flew from Moscow to Farnborough and landed with over 1,000lbs of fuel… they are not short range Mig-29As with derated engines like the Germans used.
Because Algeria is not Saudi Arabia. Given their past history with rebels, you figure ground attack aircraft are more of a priority. To be quite honest..i was wondering why they need the MiG-25, not the 29.
WACHENR0DERthat’s some pretty serious weapons they have there, so who does Algeria consider their main threats? Rebels in the south and those based in Mali? Libya? Morrocco?:confused:
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by Srbin
20 Mig-29SMTs +30 upgradeed J-22 Oraos cannot be that expensive to maintain. Mig-21s cannot fly till 2010 orr 2015 its too much for their airframe, their service life has run out, remember when Serbia sent their Mig-21s to be upgraded in Israel, they were rejected because they were too old and didn’t have much life in them.Other than what I’ve said above lease some Gripens till 2010-2015 till something new comes around or if we buy them but I don’t think we could lease Gripens yet.
Lets say MAKO project does go ahead, you have to look if we will ever get all the weapons with it including ASRAAM or whatever comes with it(BVR weaps), how much will it cost and what capabilities could it give us, if it cannot fullfill any of those then forget it. And I doubt the Europeans or Americans would give us the AMRAAM or the Meteor or for even that matter sell us the Rafales or Typhoons.
Anyways I think the plan was to use something as a stopgap measure now until 2010-2015 till something new arrives. The main plan is to establish a high tech air defense system for Serbia. What SAMs it will buy in the future is unknown, maybe European maybe Russian, we’ve got to see.
if you Doubt the american will give you such weapons, then obviously you will not be able to go for the Gripen either since it uses the AMRAAM, an American engine, etc.
But you brought up a good point on how old those MiG-21s are..
I strongly doubt Mako will go anywhere, especially since Germany seems uninterested, and further funds from the UAE is non existant..
the MiG-29 or FC-1 is probably better since it’s rather cheap and good enough.. Serbia’s more pressing need is ground support types.. where Mi-35s, better transport helicopters, etc would be better.. and perhaps upgrading the army’s SAM fleet too.
WACHENR0DERhow bout in terms of maintenance and operating costs?
surely the swing wings of the Flogger gives some maintenance issues, etc.. while the F-4 has 2 engines that needs to be looked at..etc.
WACHENR0DEROriginally posted by SerbPVO
Why not?Serbia & Montenegro has a bigger population than both Greece & Israel and is 4 times larger than Israel and about equal to Greece(with its islands).
The economy has detiorated in the last decade or so…but S&M has huge potentials to become one of the richest countries in Europe.
Lets not forget – while Greece and Israel have barely developed their own aircraft industry, and have to buy their A/C from US, Serbia (Yugoslavia) in the late 80’s was planning development of its own 4th/5th generation fighter jets.
That capability is still there.
By that logic, Nigeria should have an airforce that’s 20x bigger than Israel.
There are reasons why Israel and Greece have a large airforce..
Israel has historically had to deal with the combined might of their neighbors who tend to modernize their airforce while Greece is in NATO, part of the southern flank, and generally has it’s own “cold war” with Turkey.
most problems faced by Yugoslavia are nothing of that scale and more to do with guerillas, etc.. which is why you need better ground support aircraft such as helicopters, etc.
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