Pat MurphyI’m not sure if it’s the same Spitfire, all I do know is that is was taken a few days after September 17, 1941. I have been in contact with a relative of Whalen who has the log book and no serial numbers are recorded in the log book, just individual airplane codes. Whalen went on to fly Hurricanes in Ceylone and Burma and was killed in 1944. I guess we will never know the serial of the Spit he flew with those markings. Thanks to all that offered help.
Pat MurphyThe date of the picture is not certain, it would appear it was taken after September 1941. The caption I have tells of a sortie on September 17 and a few days later this picture was taken. That picture came of the web and I do not have the original, wish I did.
Pat MurphyThis is the picture[ATTACH=CONFIG]224449[/ATTACH]
Pat MurphyP/O Whalen’s Mk V Spitfire
Thanks to those that have provided information, I too discoverd -that serial number was never issued to any Spitfire, I have a picture of that Spitfire, however the serial number is not clear enought to read so I guess I’ll keep looking and wondering. Someday the mystery may get cleared up.
Pat MurphyWing Commander James Francis ‘Stocky’ Edwards
W/C Stocky Edwards DFC& Bar, DFM, CD and 2 Bars MiD and Order of Canada
Stocky flew over 400 sorties during his 3 tours, He joined the RCAF In Oct 1940. During his service he flew with 94 Sqn RAF, 260 Sqn RAF, 417 Sqn RCAF, 92 Sqn RAF, 274 Sqn RAF and as Wing Commander lead 127 Wing at the end of the Second World War. His autobiography ‘Kittyhawk Pilot’ was written in collaboration with Michael Lavigne as was the limited edition book
Kittyhawks over the Sands’ both books mention in part some of the events the day Sgt. Copping went missing. Stocky retired from the Canadian Air Force in 1972
For furher information on those events, the book written by RAF veteran Jack Sheppard DFC ‘Some of our Victories’ who served with 260 Sqn tells a compelling story of attempting to get Copping to turn around, he was not successful. Ron Cundy RAAF DFC, DFM, MID also a former 260 member also mentions the story in his autobiography ‘A Gremlin On my Shoulder.
If this recently found Kittyhawk is the Kittyhawk that Sgt. Copping flew into the desert on June 28, 1942 then let us hope that we can solve a 70 year old mystery and put all speculation to bed.
During the recent CBC TV interview Stocky Edawrds said he has thought of those events for 70 years and has wondered what happened, I’m sure many former 260 Sqn pilots and ground crews had the same thoughts. Right now my thoughts are with Coppings family.
Pat MurphyWing Commander James Francis ‘Stocky’ Edwards
W/C Stocky Edwards DFC& Bar, DFM, CD and 2 Bars MiD and Order of Canada
Stocky flew over 400 sorties during his 3 tours, He joined the RCAF In Oct 1940. During his service he flew with 94 Sqn RAF, 260 Sqn RAF, 417 Sqn RCAF, 92 Sqn RAF, 274 Sqn RAF and as Wing Commander lead 127 Wing at the end of the Second World War. His autobiography ‘Kittyhawk Pilot’ was written in collaboration with Michael Lavigne as was the limited edition book
Kittyhawks over the Sands’ both books mention in part some of the events the day Sgt. Copping went missing. Stocky retired from the Canadian Air Force in 1972
For furher information on those events, the book written by RAF veteran Jack Sheppard DFC ‘Some of our Victories’ who served with 260 Sqn tells a compelling story of attempting to get Copping to turn around, he was not successful. Ron Cundy RAAF DFC, DFM, MID also a former 260 member also mentions the story in his autobiography ‘A Gremlin On my Shoulder.
If this recently found Kittyhawk is the Kittyhawk that Sgt. Copping flew into the desert on June 28, 1942 then let us hope that we can solve a 70 year old mystery and put all speculation to bed.
During the recent CBC TV interview Stocky Edawrds said he has thought of those events for 70 years and has wondered what happened, I’m sure many former 260 Sqn pilots and ground crews had the same thoughts. Right now my thoughts are with Coppings family.
Pat MurphyCBC Interview
I would think that a TV interview from a former 260 Sqn pilot who flew with Copping and was an eye witness to the events that lead up to Sgt Coppings last flight would be on topic. I’m pleased that link was posted.
Pat MurphyCBC Interview
I would think that a TV interview from a former 260 Sqn pilot who flew with Copping and was an eye witness to the events that lead up to Sgt Coppings last flight would be on topic. I’m pleased that link was posted.
Pat MurphyDesert P-40 260 Sqn
This is an amazing story, it has been suggested that it might be one of Stocky Edwards Kittyhawks, I called him last night and he assures me he never crash landed a P-40 in the desert and was very amused by all the speculation it might be one of his aircraft. When the real facts are eventually determined I’m sure the story will be a good one and I shall pass the details on to Stocky Edwards.
Pat MurphyWe are proud of what we did, very proud
As facts are hard to come by from the museum, we have no idea if the Y2-K Spitfire will stay in Comox for a day or for a year, with 50,000 people or so donating to it for 71/2 years you can bet that many of these supporters will want to see where the money went, not one cent was ever donated on the basis that the Y2-K Spitfire would fly agian out of a Quebec based museum. The key phrase in raising money for that length of time was. The Y2-K Spitfire will Fly Again..I guess the lawyers that put the deal together discovered that our slogan did not specify it would fly again in Comox.
The museum will have to live with it’s verdict to off load the Spitfire for years to come, I know our team of hard working volunteers will never be satisfied with the silence that is coming out of the museum over this unfortunate set of circumstances. I guess when it all biols down the Government can do whatever the hell it wants inspite of the ethics involved.
When you donate to a museum do so with caution. Make sure you understand what the museums real motivation is and is it genuine.
Pat Murphy
Former Y2-K Spitfire Volunteer.
Pat MurphyThe Y2-K Spitfire is gone!!
It’s true, after 71/2 years of fund raising under the promise of “Of The Y2-K Spitfire would Fly Again” it has been sold or given away the former volunteers have no idea if the Spitfire was sold or donated to Vintage Wings of Canada and apparently the information is so sensitive that we might never find out. The volunteers work diligently for over 7 years raising funds to keep the Spitfire restoration alive, the last 4 years were very productive, donations and visitations were up each year, over 50,000 people attended the hangar and 95% of these visitors made donations to the project, all wanting to see the Spitfire completed to honour the veterans of the Second World War especially 442 Squadron the home base of the current 442 Squadron well known for it’s search and rescure work along the B.C Coast.
The volunteers were never notified of the change in dirctection they were never consulted in anyway, the museum just annoiunced one day that the Spitfire was sold. The hard work that was completed by the volunteers was refered to as a “bake sale” after raising well over $350,000 from a cross section of visitors, veteran, students, and veterans families. I would suggest that if any one of these donators had any idea that the Spitfire would not be completed and flown in the Comox Valley very few dollars would have been donated to the project. How does a museum justify taking funds for
over 71/2 years then suddenly pull the pin. Oddly enough the representative from the museum that orchastrated the deal is now on salary from Vintage Wing as project manager.
I would suggest to all volunteers that are working on similar projects with museums to get it in writing before you solicite funds from the unsuspecting public for funds that the museum you volunteer for have a firm commitment to live up to the goal of doing what they say they will . How can a museum suddenly change direction with respect to a project this important and simply sell it or give it away. We were told that the Y2-K Spitfire was first placed on the open market for sale, I challange this statement, where was it listed and at what price, I see no evidence that it was ever listed.
It was the considered opinion of the volunteers it had a value of $600,00 to $700,000 and if it were sold that monry should be returned to the people that donated to it and the $250,000 grant that came from the federal Government to start the project up should be refunded to the Government.
The Y2-K Spitfire will fly again in Eastern Canada not Comox as was promoted from the start up. Were happy for those that get to see it and Vintage Wings will do a good job with our airplane but those that worked on her and raised the money will always be dissapointed at the move and having our work characterized as a Bake Sale.
Pat Murphy
Former Y2-K Spitfire Volunteer
Pat MurphyDon’t forget to see the Y2-K Spitfire
Don’t Forget the Y2-K Spitfire Project located at the Comox Air Force Museum if you get to Vancouver Island, now in it’s 8th year of restoration the Y2-K Spitfire is available for tours on Saturday’s from 10-3 pm. Visit the website for more information http://www.y2kspitfire.com.
Vancouver Island is a great place to spend a few days and once you’ve seen the Spitfire restoration take a 40 minute drive to view the fabulous Martin Mars water bombers on Sprout Lake at Port Alberni.
Pat Murphy443 Squadron Spitfire
According to “RCAF Squarons and Aircraft” that 443 Squadron Spitfire serial number MK607 was coded 2I-S. this reference book has no pictures of that particular Spitfire but it seems to me that it would be standard markings for that period, I have a picture of a 443 Squdron Spitfire from that time period coded 2I-X serial MJ799 and it seems the same as any Spitfire from September 1944
The Squadron Commander of 443 S/L Art Sager passed away last Saturday at the age of 90 so I no longer have access to his log book for any further reference. Cheers
PJM
Pat MurphyMarkings for Mk VIII Spitfire
Seems to me that F/L James “EDDIE ” Edwards a Canadian that served in the RAF and RCAF would be a good candidate for this honour. Eddie was born in Nokomis Sask. Canada and joined the RCAF in 1940. Eddie Edwards flew Kittyhawks in North Africa with 260 and 94 Squadrons and Spitfires with 417 Squadron in Sicily and Italy. He moved on to 92 Squadron where he flew Mk VIII Spitfires as a flight commander. Eddie Edwards was much respected by his Squadron mates including the ground crews that lettered some “special markings” on his Spitfire JF 502. Eddie was sent home to Canada after 2 opperational tours. He was sent back to England to fly Tempest’s as the Leader of 274 Squadron then promoted to Wing Commander and took over 127 Wing RCAF After the war Eddie (now with the nick-name “Stocky Edwards”) remained in the RCAF flew Vampires and later Commanded a Squadron of Sabre jets. Stocky Edwards lives on Vancouver Island and is still active in aviation. He is a frequent visitor to the Y2-K Spitfire project. Wing Commander Stocky Edwards DFC *Bar, DFM, Order of Canada should be considered for this honour
Pat MurphyCanadian Kittyhawk Pilot
Thats easy -one Kittyhawk pilots stands out. James Francis (Stocky) Edwards DFC & BAR, DFM and Order of Canada, 260 Sqn RAF born in Nokomis Sask. Completed 470 combat sorties and claimed 13 kills flying Kittyhawks during WW II. Finished the war as a Wing Commander of a Canadian Spitfire Wing. Stocky is still involved in aviation and spends many hours each month talking to people at the Y2-K Spitfire restoration project
http://www.y2kspitfire.com
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