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paulmcmillan

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  • in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785815
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    All

    Malcolm Fillmore of Air Britain says amongst others

    “This was interesting since I hadn’t had that accident previously listed.”

    “I think there can be almost no doubt that the Avro 504 in question was 504N G-ADGB.  This is despite the wholly erroneous (and linked) information published on Aviation Safety Network “

    “Zenith only ever had two Avro 504N’s G-ADGB and G-ADGC.  G-ADGC was never overhauled and eventually ended up with John Coxon of Southern Motor Co at Croydon (later Gatwick) in 1937.  G-ADGB was known to have been operating from Camber Sands and its registration was cancelled in June 1936 as wfu.  It is also shown as having been ‘sold’ in First quarter 1936 in the ICANS Registers.  Since its CofA was never renewed after first being issued 19 June 1935, it was probably sold for spares/scrap and from a lack of any further published information, one can reasonably assume that after the accident, Zenith Airways simply packed up – possibly as a result of adverse publicity or that the owner of Zenith (who appears to have been a passenger in the accident) thought better of the project.”

    “G-ADGB was one of four Avro 504Ns acquired ex RAF by Aviation Commerce Limited at Croydon; two (G-ADGB/C) were sold on to LJ Braddock & partners (seemingly founders of Zenith Airways) and two (G-ADGM/N) were initially retained although G-ADGM was registered to Aircraft & Autos Ltd (a company owned by John Coxon) a few days after its CofA was issued in July 1935 (it was later probably operated by Chilworth Flying Club on joyflights). “

    “Aviation Safety Network also state therein that G-ADGC was never registered to Zenith.  But it was – CofR no.5949 was issued to Zenith Airways Ltd of Camber Sands on 6 June 1935”.

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785954
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    Almost their – Can see 18 gallon tank

    Avro aircraft since 1908 – Page 105

    Avro 504K Mk.II In 1924 the Hamble works produced a hybrid trainer known as the Avro 504K Mk.II 
    and consisting of a flat sided 504K fuselage married to 504N – type undercarriage and mainplanes. 
    The reasons underlying the creation of this strange variant were twofound, firstly to enable
    air forces of the smaller nations to modernise their 504K trainers using Avro-built
    conversion kits,or alternatively to provide low price 504N equivalents powered by
    cheap surplus 100 hp Gnome Monosoupape rotaries. While there is no record of 
    conversion taking place overseas, a very similar machine, named the vro Anahuac, was built under licence in the Mexican Air Force workshops at Balbuena, serials round and about 53. 

    The Avro 504K Mk.II was shelved but in 1935 four ex-RAF Avro 504N airframes, long stored at Croydon, were brought out and converted into joyriding three-seaters with 130 hp Clerget engines. They were
    therefore equivalent to the Avro 504K Mk II of 11 years previously differing from 
    the prototype only in the type of engine, rounded sides, untapered ailerons, absence of 
    wingtip skids and fuel tankage. The 1935 machines had one 18 gallon tank under 
    the port upper wing root in the manner of the Mongoose- …

     … They were registered G-ADGB, ‘GC, ‘GM and ‘GN but work on G- ADGC was not completed.

    The other three endured one season’s joyriding at Camber Sands, Sussex, with Zenith Airways, although ‘GM and ‘GN were nominally owned by Aircraft and Autos Ltd and Aviation Commerce Ltd of Croydon respectively. None flew after 1935 …

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785960
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    As  J8758, Avro 504N, had ground accident Duxford 7 Oct,1928, it is possible that it would have been able to be converted with a flat fuselage – Shame that newspaper photos is not lighter – So a serial can be read

     

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785964
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    The plane which ditched was Moth G-EBVK

     

    Paul

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785967
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    XXXX Deleted

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785970
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    Thames Incident 10th Dec 1934

    G-EBV?

     

    Based on photo

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785973
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    Published: Monday 07 September 1936
    Newspaper: The Scotsman

    NARROW ESCAPES RECALLED Mr Tonge had served in the R.A.F. He was unmarried, and lived in West. Avenue, Wallington. Some years ago he ran out of petrol while over London, and put his machine safely in the Thames opposite the Houses of Parliament, then stepped off the sinking machine to a barge. Last year he was Flying at Camber  Sands, and engine trouble developed. For a moment or two it looked as if he would land on the crowded beach. but with great presence of mind he swerved the machine, and landed at the edge of the shore. A few months a Tonge had another narrow escape. from the North Country with two passengers, he ran into heavy mist, and to avoid hitting a hillside, put the machine into a tree. He suffered head injuries, but his passengers were unhurt. It is probable that engine trouble developed this time, as Mr Tonge, in such circumstances. favoured lending in a tree to break impact with the ground. 
     

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785976
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    PS

    His name definitely

    Bartholomew’ Furse Tonge (aged 27 or 28), of Wallington, Surrey

     

    His Obit appears in Dundee Evening Telegraph and Post Page 5 Monday 07 September 1936

     

    Says younger son of Mr and Mrs Thomas Tonge of Dundee 

     

    Scotlands People has

     

    TONGE

    BARTHOLOMEW FUR

    M

    1907

    282/4 1396

    St Andrew (Dundee)

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785983
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    I suppose it could be

    Avro 504K Mk.II 

    G-ADGC J9689, registered 23.4.35 to L. J. Braddock and partners, Croydon; Zenith Airways Ltd., Camber Sands, Sussex 6.35; registration cancelled 1.36 
     

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785985
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    So looks like without doubt based on the Braddock  link

     

    British civil aircraft, 1919-1972, Volume 1

    Avro 504K Mk.II
    G-ADGB J8758, 19.6.35 L J. Braddock and partners, Croydon, Zenith Airways Ltd,  Camber Sands, Sussex 6.35; registration cancelled 6.36 

    in reply to: Avro 504 forced landing Camber Sands 1935 #785988
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    Gloucester Citizen – Friday 23 August 1935 page 7

    No Date, but as this daily paper suggest Thursday 22 August 1935

    Says pilot was Sgt- Pilot Bart Tonge, RAF Reserve and landed heavily on beach. The passengers included Mr J L Braddock (owner of machine) and a woman

    This is Bartholomew Furze Tonge RAF #700252

     

    in reply to: Hawker Tempest II MW763/G-TEMT #787328
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    Mustang51 Photo sent Paul

    in reply to: Hawker Tempest II MW763/G-TEMT #787330
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    Mustang51 just tied to post image here no dice can you send me an email address 

    in reply to: Hawker Tempest II MW763/G-TEMT #787331
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    Mustang51
     

    Air Britain for MV763 says 183/54 then sold 25.5.48 for RIAF the book says HA554? But I have sometime changed it to HA586

    i updated Mw764 HA554

    BTW a number of “Near” Tempests including MW755 and MW772 to MW774 are marked 183/54 and ME768 is Marked 183/247

     

    paul 

    in reply to: Hawker Tempest II MW763/G-TEMT #787484
    paulmcmillan
    Participant

    Mustang51

    I think (looking at ORB’s online) you will not find serials of Tempests in 183 ORB (I never looked in detail at 54 Sqn – but based on the compiler of 183 Sqn records moving on to compiling the 54 Sqn records – I would not be too hopeful). My gut feeling is that the info is ONLY on the aircraft movement card @Hendon

    I will assume it will say MW763 -> 183 Sqn (and a date) the ‘internal transfer’ to 54 Sqn in Nov 1945 MAY NOT Be recorded as a separate item (thus “no 54 Sqn service”) – Its next record may be to 20 MU Oct 1946

    If someone has the Air Britain serials book for MW763 I would be interested to see what it says, as this will be a edited version of what is based on Movement Card

    Mason may have just gone through Air Britain serials book and just listed all 183 Sqn Tempests, or he may have looked at the original Movement cards and generated his list from these

    Paul

     

Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 2,142 total)