phrozenflameCost overruns on Indian indigenous Su-30
Defence notes
Cost overruns on indigenous Su-30
by Girja Shankar Kaura
The licensed production of multi-role Sukhoi-30MKI fighters in the country is running into huge cost overruns, and some of them in the latest batch of imports are flying without some advanced, critical, airborne systems. The report of the Comptroller and Auditor General (CAG) placed in Parliament, while pointing this out, has noted that the indigenous manufacture of the Russian frontline fighters is actually working out to be more expensive than its import.
Three critical airborne systems of the fighters — electronic warfare system, reconnaissance system and the direction finding, modular radar — have not been integrated with the latest batch of aircraft delivered by the Russians, under the November 1996 contract, the report said.
Rapping the Government for huge cost escalation risks in the project, the CAG said the total cost of 140 aircraft projected by the Defence ministry in 2000 was Rs 22,122.78 crores at the 2000 price level, while in a detailed project report prepared by Hindustan Aeronautics Limited in July 2005, the amount shown was Rs 39,224.9 crores, almost a hundred per cent increase.
http://www.tribuneindia.com/2006/20060524/edit.htm#8
—
Unit price ~ $60m…
That sounds realistic. 🙂
phrozenflamePak-China aircraft successfully completed test flight
Updated at 1145 PST
ISLAMABAD: (By Mazhar Tufail) Prototype IV of the JF-17 Thunder aircraft successfully completed its first operational test flight at Chengdu in China.
Air Marshall Tanveer Mehmood Ahmed witnessed the test flight of the fighter jet jointly produced by Pakistan and China.
http://www.thenews.com.pk/updates.asp#1702
🙂
phrozenflamePAF Sabre
http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?t=57274
Associated Press of Pakistan (APP):
Pak-China joint venture: JF-17 Thunder operational test flight on Wednesday
Chengdu, (China), May 9 (APP): A prototype fighter aircraft JF-17 Thunder (PT-4) a joint venture of Pakistan and China is scheduled to take off from People’s Liberation Army Air Force airbase here Wednesday.
It will be a maiden operational test flight, enabling the two countries to formally start its production. Chief of the Air Staff Air Chief Marshal Tanvir Mehmood Ahmed who has arrived here along with members of his delegation will witness the operation.
In the beginning, the aircraft equipped with advanced electronics and weapon systems will be manufactured at Chengdu Aircraft Industry Corporation (CAC) in China’s Sichuan province. Later, Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC), Kamra will start production of the aircraft in June 2007, said an official of Pakistan Air Force while talking to APP.
He said, the first formal test flight of the fighter aircraft will be a historic event and will go a long way in developing Pakistan’s indigenous capability to meet the requirements of the armed forces and achieving the goal of self-reliance.
Earlier prototypes PT-1, PT-2 and PT-3 have focused on operational flight capabilities, the PT-4 prototype is expected to test the aircraft’s avionics and weapons integration.
Incorporating advanced design and state-of-the-art technology, the aircraft will envisage comprehensive combat capability of a third generation fighter.According to experts, with advanced design and manufacturing technology, the export-oriented fighter plane is small, low in cost and suitable for modern warfare and the demands of military fighters.
The development program for the new-generation fighter aircraft was officially launched in 1999, led by the CAIC-I, China’s leading manufacturer in the aerospace industry.
The PAF’s sources further said that they were expecting the delivery of its first multi-role combat aircraft in early 2007. The Air Force plans to induct more than 100 JF-17 Thunder aircraft to replace a fleet of ageing Mirage fighters F-7 and A-5.
It may be mentioned here that President Pervez Musharraf during his State visit to China last February visited Chengdu Aircraft factory to inspect design and research institutes of the facility and its avionics laboratory. He also witnessed the assembly line of the fighter aircraft and inspected two prototypes at the Flight Test Station.
DATE:08/05/06
SOURCE:Flight InternationalBy Graham Warwick in London
Changes to China’s Chengdu FC-1 lightweight fighter are clearly visible in recently released photographs (pictured below) of the redesigned fourth prototype’s first flight on 28 April. Joint Strike Fighter (JSF)-style “diverterless” engine inlets lead the design revisions.
In addition to redesigned intakes, the fourth prototype has larger wing leading-edge root extensions, longer ventral strakes either side of the aft fuselage, and a taller, less swept fin. The design changes were made after problems surfaced during testing of the first three prototypes. The FC-1 first flew in August 2003.
The redesigned inlets closely resemble those of the Lockheed Martin F-35 JSF. In place of the conventional ramp of the original two-dimensional intake, the new design features a “hump” to aerodynamically divert turbulent boundary-layer airflow away from the engine inlet. Lockheed has said its design is more stealthy than conventional inlets.
Announcing the fourth prototype’s 16min first flight from Wenjiang airport in Chengdu, capital of southwest China’s Sichuan Province, Chinese news agency Xinhua said the Xiaolong 04 fighter aircraft has improved electronics and weapon systems. The fighter is powered by a Klimov RD-93 afterburning turbofan – the engine used in the RSK MiG Russian MiG-29.
Pakistan plans to buy up to 150 FC-1s, which it will operate as the JF-17 Thunder. Islamabad has ordered an initial 16 fighters, assembly of which will be split between Chengdu Aircraft and Pakistan Aeronautical Complex. These are to be followed by up to 134 locally assembled aircraft.
phrozenflameurm..Dieno..you meant the other way round…?
😉
lets start picking out external differences apart from vertical stabilizer top, DSI, extended LERX and rounder nose…
phrozenflameMark down May 10!
It seems that the “official” flight for the JF-17 is two weeks from now and not on the 28th yesterday. Very similiar to the “first” flight of 01 in August 2003 (official flight was in September of that year.)
So…do we expect to see FC-1 do all those rolls again..like in the ‘first’ official flight of 01 :diablo:
phrozenflameImproved mode of China-developed fighter succeeds in test flight:An improved mode of China-developed new-generation fighter plane, the Xiaolong/FC-1 PT-04 fighter, succeeded in its first flight on Friday in Southwest China’s Sichuan Province.
The 16-minute trial flight of the Xiaolong/FC-1 PT-04 fighter, the first of its series that has been equipped with advanced aviation electronics and weapon system, proved a great success, according to the experts.
The success of the flight marks a significant improvement in the innovation capabilities of China’s aviation industry and makes possible mass production of the plane, said the experts.
The Xiaolong series are a multipurpose light fighter plane developed by the China Aviation Industry Corporation I, the Chengdu Aircraft Group Corp. and China Aero Technology Import and Export Corporation.
That is a great news, you made my day 😀 😀 😀
phrozenflameI livefew KM away from Chaklala Airbase, Saw C-130s.
Saw alot of Chinooks after Quake. Helicopters almost 24/7. Now not much.
Saw F-18s when I was in Kuwait.
phrozenflameok I wouldnt call them a million-strong army….but…S. Korea has alot to loose.
phrozenflameAnyone enlighten me with this LCA with canards….
phrozenflameIndia cuts back on exercises
After three years of frequently conducting joint manoeuvres with foreign air forces, especially the US and France, the Indian Air Force (IAF) will now limit …
14-Apr-2006
Indian base in Tajikistan to be operational in 2006
India’s first international military base is expected to become operational by the end of 2006 in Dushanbe, Tajikistan, as part of New Delhi’s thrust into …
14-Apr-2006
phrozenflameAny updates on the dispute Russia alone was claiming regarding the engines re-exports..
phrozenflameis it me or the nost seems more flatter…
phrozenflameoff topic but can someone validate that? any links?
And how did the FC-1’s range and speed increase so dramatically? 1,200 to 1800 and mach 1.6 to 1.8
Not that I doubt it but just want to see the reasoning / logic
Some of the factors are…Weight reduced by 200kilos, more feul capacity by 200 kilos in prototype 4.
phrozenflameGot this from Pakdef forums.
Ok, should have posted it few days ago when it first came. A long article in chinese about FC-1 chinese avionics posted on Sinodefenceforum.com and graciously translated by Tphuang.
chinese article: (posted by kyli)
http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/sho…6&postcount=121translation:
http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/sho…3&postcount=131“let me try to translate the article from the top.
this was hard work!Hope this works well.
JF-17 is currently China’s only advanced fighter
developed in open. Many people use it to understand
China’s fighter development direction. The DSI
change that started in June of 2004 caused many
surprises, so did the Leading edge extension in
September. Since 2006, JF-17 has been viewed even
more when President Musharraf visited. CCTV showed
brand new JF-17 04 with a previously unseen modern
glass cockpit. This cockpit represent ourcountry’s
avionics level has reached world class. JF-17
showed 1 HUD and 2 MFD in the cockpit in previous
displays. There were analog controls in the middle.
The look was similar to F-16a/b. In 2004, zhuhai
airshow showed a cockpit with 1 HUD and 3 MFDs. All
the analog meters on the cockpit got replaced by
digital control. Cockpit underwent a total digital
information redesign. However, the model does not
give people the good feeling that a real thing
would.
Everyone knows that JF-17 is a China/Pakistan
combined venture. JF-17’s main aim is to equip PAF.
In south Asian crisis, Pakistan receive American
embargo. It not only failed to receive 79 F-16s it
order, but also could not get spare parts to F-16.
As a result, it had to order 80 F-7PG and some
squadrons even got F-16s replaced by F-7PG. This is
rarely seen in military aviation. JF-17’s
development is extremely urgent. Pakistan believes
that JF-17’s capability and price should be lower
than F-16C/D, but capability should be higher than
F-16A/B. Due to the anti-terrorism planning, PAF’s
importance got changed. America not only agreed to
sell F-16, but also some advanced F-16s that it
could not get before. Due to this pressure, JF-17’s
requirement got increased. It needs to be more
advanced than F-16, that’s why you see the whole
change in 04.
The new cockpit’s electronic system showed JF-17’s
modified capability. The new cockpit is very
compact and functional position is positioned well
and shows very mature system. 1 HUD is the main
fighter display. This HUD has 24 degree in sight.
It can add infrared signal? and supply flying,
navigation, liftoff and landing info, it can also
display target details and shooting detail. It can
also communicate, navigate using the GUI There is a
camera located above the HUD. It records HUD and
external sights. HUD is the most important
instrument in flight. Integrated informational
level is dependent on this. Russia added some nice
looking displays for su-30, but their display
information is simple and information is spread.
So, it did not really integrate the information.
The JF-17 HUD uses a lot of digital processing and
information integration information. For example,
radar information, fight command info. HUD’s
controller has the ability to change display.
Controller can also control all of the plane’s
dipslay. 3 MFDs are below the HUD. It is multi-
colour LCD display. The dimension of the MFD is
20.3cmx30.6cm (note: this works out to be 8 x 12
inch, but a more realistic estimation is 6.25×8.25).
The area is 4 times the previous area. The display
brightness and contrast can be automatically
adjusted. It also allows handle control. Each MFD
displays important function. Display info can be
changed. The control on the side acts as parameter
design. Very often, left side shows weapon
situation and numbers. Right side displays radar
and combat info. The center shows some less
important info, because it requires the pilot to
lower his/her head. Like navigational info and map
and so so. All the MFD can change to other info
like radar, cockpit camera? and infrared picture and
such. cockpit also allows night navigation and
pilots can use night goggles to fly.
04 uses a hotas controller? pilot can keep hands on
controller and still control the fighter’s sensor
mode, weapon and display. This greatly reduces a
pilots movement and makes operation much easier.
The controller does not affect the position in
combat? Basically, allows pilots to keep the hand
on the controller in combat. The earlier western
4th generation fighters like F-16A/B only had
limited functions on the controller. JF-17 hotas
uses advanced western design like F-16C/d, F-18C/D
and Mirage2K5’s newest model for design. Also, the
system has different controls dependent on the hand
size, length and finger size and length of the user.
Basically, uses customizable controller. Allows a
lot of activities done with limited energy.
04 uses all digital integrated electronic display.
all computers/electronics uses 2 STD-MTL-1553B
databus combined, curren info shared repository and
shared data repository. According to demand, it
also divides into weapons w/commands, radar, EW,
communication, electronic control, payload control,
FBW and so on. This avionics system’s core lies in 2
advanced weapons controlling computer. these two
computers do something… Each computer controls 1
double thick 1553B databus? This computer uses new
structure system. It uses main controller rights to
receive and process each system’s info. At the same
time, receive pilot’s command. Uses command to
control other systems. It’s current world’s most
advanced input computer and main line integration
web. Very few new fighters has this kind of complex
and high speed system like typhoon, rafale and F-16
E/F. This system uses battle flight software
package to exercise control and allows using
development of more detailed software package to
improve fighter capability and work load. Weapon
controlling computer directly connects to MFD’s
structure. It uses information from each system to
display on the 1 HUD and 3MFDs. Radar system is
another important part of JF-17. It’s also a major
commercial battle area. Pakistan used a lot of
Grifo radar in the past on F-7s. JF-17 also was
about to use this. Italy also pitted Grifo-S2000
(should be S7) in competition. China also provided
a radar for customers. Domestic radar has good
support for China’s weapon systems and missiles.
The current multimode PD radar has BVR capability,
WVR capability and attack land and sea mode and
other modes. Also has look down and shoot down
capability even under disruptive environments below.
You can Track 10 targets from 40 scanned targets
and handle 2 concurrent BVR engagement. The range
vs 3 m^2 targets is larger than 75KM and look down
is larger than 45 KM. It is larger than 135 KM vs
sea targets.
04’s GPS navigation system replaced the traditional navigation system, greatly improved precision and reduced preparation time. Talks about GPs capability after this and how American military controls it. It also has other wireless navigation but not as precise as GPS.
JF-17’s EW suite is very complex. It combines radar warning receiver and missile proximity receiver to form surveillence system and combined with ECM work. JF-17 uses uses something to diagnose RWR. It can receive a lot of information like fighter radar, missile seeker, A2S guidance radar and provides within 1.5 degree news. RAR has about 100+ radar info repository. It uses measured info to compare. detect the threatening origin and correct (radar type or fighter type?) and warning level. This repository can improve to 300. It can allow reprogramming, receive wartime newly discovered radar signal. 04’s improved tail (backside” contains a missile proximity receiver. There will probably be two more put on the fighter for 360 degree coverage. It uses infrared and purple dual band imagine device. It has a purple red window? It can sense missile’s rocket engine spoke from 20 KM in. It can correctly predict missile’s location, trail and such. It can even estimate engagement time. It can be expanded to a fighter/missile recognition system. It can also provide some infrared imaging, communicate with RWR and hopefully can develop passive signal detection technology.
04’s EW suite also has a ECM pod. It and the ECM on the tail provide joint work. ECM current uses traidtional infrared something? modern missile’s countermeasure to this is getting stronger each day. To let this simple and cheap ECM achieve high efficiency shows system’s level, RWR, MPR and such. This system is only equipped by rafale and F-22. F-18E/F and F-16E/F needs upgrade to have this. 04 should also have ECM inside of fighter. It uses modern ECM technology and uses precise tracking system. Can achieve the affect of large ECM machine with small equipment. This ECM is most modern active guided AAM. It can also counter gither radar lock and scan. It’s mainly for PAF’s enemy IAF’s R-77 missiles.
To acommodate modern web of combat. 04 is equipped with 2 ECM vs radar tower and something else. It can receive datalink info from ground of AWACS. Other equippments include big air computer? and advanced digital processing signal and such. The electronic system stores everything, all the bugs and such. It can use computer to process this. Reduces ground maintenance.
It uses western standard MIL-STD-1760 to allow for integration of western weapons and can also get hooked on with Russian weapons. It will probably uses PL-9C, SD-10, PL-11, AIM-9L/M and AIM-7F. It also good use LGBs and possible A2G missile integration.
Credits to Farooq Hafeez, and the credits he mentiond in his post.
phrozenflameThis I’d consider a BREAKING NEWS.
FC-20…that name is kind of logical as explained in Post #290.
I want to hear Chinese reaction…official, unofficial.
J-10s and JF-17s will add synergy as well…and F-16s too… this is wonderfull news, Finally PAF is getting its act together.
I hope they dont shutdown F-6 rebuild factory lol, I might get a chance to visit it within 6 months times.
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