Bruce- I think your post sums things up quite nicely.
As I have said before there is nothing wrong with “dataplate” rebuilds as long as everyone continues to be honest about the provenance of the airframe.
It is probably fair to say that a “dataplate” rebuild is less expensive than buying an airworthy Spitfire with a known and continuous history which has not been constructed from mostly new parts – I am thinking of aircraft like MH434 and AR213 which have been around in preservation, usually in airworthy condition, for a long time and are likely to be regarded as some of the most valuable Spitfires out there.
From an owners point of view all Spitfires (regardless of provenance) must be a joy to own and fly provided you have the income to support it. From an enthusiasts point of view all Spitfires make a great sight in the air and to me ( and I suspect many others) that is the most important thing.
Great pictures that brought back some memories. Hope you don’t mind if I add a couple more.
Firstly a slightly out of focus shot from Biggin Hill which must have been taken about 1966/7. No idea who took the photo but I have owned the print for over 40 years having bought it from our aircraft spotters club at school.
and one from Southend in about 1982 – not too long before the museum closed. The top turret was hired or loaned for a TV or film production and was never returned. Apparently when the museum made enquiries in an attempt to recover it no one had any recollection of what happened to it.
9089Z has also acquired a proper nose for this picture. When N7614C (now at Duxford) was in the UK to film a BOAC Boeing 747 promotional film it suffered from a problem with the nosewheel leg and the owners managed to borrow 9089Z’s noseleg for a while to complete the filming leaving 9089Z propped up on oil drums for a while. I think the new nose was sent as payment for the use of the noseleg.
After the BOAC filming was completed N7614C was effectively abandoned at Luton and was eventually passed on to Duxford for preservation.
9089Z was repainted a second time as HD368 before the Southend museum opened. During the repaint a fair bit of the underwing skin was replaced after removal of masses of birds nests and much of the airframe was stripped to bare metal (again) – a long and laborious task with comparatively few people using Ardrox and decorating paint scrapers and wire brushes.
I note how carefully he masked the denmarcation lines between the different colours and refered to the manual to make sure that he had the right camouflage pattern for the particular aircraft type! – just like most modellers do on their plastic kits when using an airbrush.
It rings a bell from years ago that there were parts of another Hafner machine in store with the R2 either at Shuttleworth or before Shuttleworth acquired it but I have checked back through Veteran and Vintage aircraft and anything else I can think of and haven’t been able to find the reference. I am sure it wasn’t the rotary parachute so it is possible it was parts of R3.
Ring a bell with anyone else?
Great pictures and terrific video. This an event I have meant to attend but never quite got there partly because I wasn’t quite sure what to expect from the day. Having seen your video I will make an extra effort to make time for a visit next year.
Only info I can find on the web is that the registration was cancelled in 1946 and that the last flight was allegedly in 1941 at RAE. There is also mention of it being re engined at RAE following a landing accident
I also found a report of the R2 that still survives being brought out of storage by Hafner post war and, as the R3 was far more successful than the R2 it would seem reasonable to assume that he would have stored the R3 as well assuming that he got it back from Farnborough.
You have found another obscure one to solve AA. Makes the mysteries of Biafran Ansons that never actually got to Biafra seem comparatively easy to solve!
Thanks for the link to the photos at Weston. It looks as if she may have been parked there for some time and the open door suggests someone has had a poke around inside. It also looks like the Biafra Save The Children logo above the cheat line has been scrubbed out.
Done a bit more digging in the museum newsletters which report that during the Summer of 1971 G-AVVO received the outer wings, rudder, tailplane and port engine from G-AVHU. I remember that VHU had no tailplane when I cut the fabric piece from it. I helped dismantle VVO for the trip to Newark probably during the 1972 school Summer holidays.
GPG was donated to the museum around April 1972 shortly before the museum opened in May 1972 and VHU had been gone for some time by then. I suspect the fuselage and inner wings which were still stood on the undercarriage were removed from the end of 33/15 at the same time as the remains of Viking G-AIKN and most of the Bristol Freighter sections from the main dump area. I am sure these were all gone by the time the museum opened as I spent part of the open day display guarding the dump which at that time consisted of little except some Air Canada Vanguard sections.
I don’t know what happened to the original outer wings and tailplane for VVO but it is likely they were dumped with the remains of VHU and were swapped because those from VHU were in better condition.
It would appear any report of the survival of VHU is greatly exaggerated!
Anson G-AVHU was owned by Historic Aircraft Museum(Southend) Ltd who at one point had three Ansons. Following the donation of G-AGPG by Ekco the museum decided to retain GPG which potentially could be kept airworthy but unfortunately this didn’t happen. G-AVVO/VL348 was sent to Newark Air Museum where it still survives.
The last I saw of G-AVHU/TX211 it was sitting with other scrap aircraft at the far end of Runway 33/15 near the compass circle with quite a lot of the fabric stripped off the rear fuselage by the weather. I have a small piece of fabric which I cut from the fuselage around the tailplane area a while before it left the museum compound but as far as I am aware my fabric piece is all that survives of G_AVHU.
Bearing in mind that G-AGPG has had a rather nomadic existence since leaving Southend it is possible that somone has got confused or didn’t realise that the Southend museum had more than one Anson.
I don’t think G-AWML ever left the UK. I always understood it went to Weston Super Mare for the fitting of long range tanks and was scrapped there allegedly after customs investigated flights made outside of airfield opening hours although I have never been able to confirm this. You can see the BHAM logo superimposed on the fin flash in the photo I posted.
Although I never met Tony Osborne I was involved with the later Historic Aircraft Museum together with several volunteers from the original BHAM including Stan and David Brett and Bill Gent and I heard many stories. The incident involving the Meteors is fairly well documented and a web search will even throw up reports of the court case and other court cases as well so there is no doubt that he was a colourful character. Several of the museum aircraft were registered to his wife Lesley Anne Osborne described to me by one person as being very pretty and having money. He also said that she bought some of the aircraft for the museum so that would make sense.
My museum newsletters say that the original BHAM never progressed because the aircraft were held by the council in lieu of unpaid rent and some of the original volunteers were close to a deal with the council for a museum site when the business consortium came along that finally built the museum.
I also read that Proctor G-ANZJ was used as a hack by Tippers Air Transport. It was impounded at Southend along with Anson G-AVVO for non payment of landing and/or parking fees. Ironically both aircraft landed up with the Historic Aircraft Museum (Southend) Ltd. I believe both were donated by the airport authorities most likely because they were unsaleable and had little scrap value.
There is no doubt that he did save several aircraft for preservation but, as you say some have sadly been lost in the intervening years.
Mike that is great news. It is good to see Proctors being saved after so many years of being the next candidate for Guy Fawkes bonfires.
Will we be seeing a Proctor formation team in a few years time?
Seriously though if Keith is moving this one and you need a hand (or a photographer) for the day then get Keith to let me know and I will be happy to come along again if at all possible.
That is really good news and I look forward to the next update on progress.
The Beverley is definitely XB259. Court Line never got it flying because they ran into huge problems getting a C of A for civilian ops as the Beverley had never previously beeen certified and it would have been a very costly exercise to obtain certification. The only previous civil registered Beverley had been a temporary registration of an RAF aircraft which I think was for a sales tour or something similar which did not require full civil certification.
The Wings and Wheels theme does have the advantage of possibly appealing to two markets but I believe that many enthusiasts have overlapping interests anyway and many of those that would go to a mixed event would also be likely to go to a good individual air show or car event anyway.
I think it would be extremely difficult to arrange a combined car event with a car racing element unless it was held at a licenced race circuit simply because a race event would have to have a MSA licence and it would be difficult and expensive to acheive the safety standards needed to get a licence for a temporary circuit and you would also need trained race marshalls for flagging and to deal with any accidents. The rental costs to take over a licnced circuit for a weekend would make that option a complete non starter as well. A mixed event with high speed car demonstration runs make more sense from the costs angle but I doubt it would have the same attraction for many potential punters as an event featuring racing.
It is also worth bearing in mind that when I had a shop at Brands Hatch about 20 years ago the circuit discontinued their annual mixed racing and airshow weekend due to poor attendance. They also had to make South Bank a no go area to the public for the weekend to meet CAA rules on display aircraft overflying the crowd line which restricted the crowd numbers that the circuit was able to accommodate.
Events like Flying Legends are unique and attract people from all over the world. I doubt most would attend a second warbird show in the UK and the ordinary public generally expect more than “just a load of old fighters”.
Any modern airshow (with the exception of special places like Old Warden) needs a mix of modern and vintage types to attract the ordinary public. The public generally have a short attention span and huge expectations of the organisers ability to entertain them and even the best airshow will not hold their attention for an entire afternoon so you need other ground attractions to keep them amused/entertained hence the X factor celebrity appearance at RIAT.
At a time when money is short and petrol prices high I would not even contemplate trying to put on a new airshow but I take my hat off to anyone who manages to make one a success.
According to my ancient 9th Edition of Wrecks and Relics Henlow had 2 Lightning P1As on the Officer Cadet Training Unit parade ground.
WG760 went to Binbrook by road on 29/7/82 and WG763 to Manchester by road on 17/8/82 but no mention of a Lightnoing at Swinderby at that time.