WJ244My understanding was that RF342 had so many mods that a return to a standard Lincoln just wasn’t possible. Certainly at the time we had here at Southend there was absolutely no chance of getting a nose and bomb doors to return her to standard. In the past 35 or so years it does seem that many parts have surfaced, often from some pretty unlikey places, and the parts may now be available. She has had a pretty sad life but certainly at the museum it wasn’t always her owners who were entirely to blame as they were often misled by particular members of their senior staff. One in particular wa allegedly an aircraft engineer and yet he managed to ensure that everything in his charge at Southend deteriorated to the point where some aircraft were beyond saving. All in all it was a very sad outcome for what had been an ambitious project to launch the first commercial avaition museum in the UK.
Taking on RF342 in her current state was a brave move and it would be great to see her back together again in any form. Hopefully happier times are ahead.
Old Fart
I have got these two posters and also a full set of Historic Aircraft Society newsletters. It may be possible to photocopy or scan the newsletters if you would like copies but I think they run to around 40 pages altogether. Please send me a PM if you want copies. The posters are fairly big and a scan would need a map scanner.
The posters were given to me by Bill Gent about 15 years ago. I know he had a good few posters and copies of the programme for the opening dinner but I don’t know what happened to them after he died. Maybe they are still around with another militaria dealer.
Can’t find the dinner programme at present but it is A4 size so could be photocopied or scanned.
My other half is less than impressed by my collection of papers and is even less fond of the musty fabric pieces I cut from some of the museum aircraft which never made it to opening day (Anson G-AVHU/TX211, Hawk Trainer G-AIDF, Argus G-AJOZ, Proctor NP339/G-AOBW etc) but they are from a part of my life which left many good memories. I just regret that I didn’t continue to pursue a career in aviation.
WJ244Came across this in my old papers over the bank holiday. God knows how it has survived all these years. I also have one of the large museum posters and a programme for the opening ceremony which Bill Gent gave me about 15 years ago. They are in better condition than my much treasured pass.
[ATTACH]162115[/ATTACH]
It was very difficult to fix to my windscreen as I only had a pushbike at the time!
WJ244Did a quick web search but couldn’t track down your model builder. If you take a look at the website in this link
http://www.modelflyermagazine.com/
The mag has always had good coverage of vintage aeromodelling so it could be worth an email to see if they can help track down Mr Emmerson. If he displayed the models as widely as claimed then he would have been a well known figure in the R/C world.
WJ244Others to add to the tally are Sea Fury G-Fury nosed over at Stapleford in the 80’s.
There was a mid air collision away from the airfield during a Kings Cup Air Race at Rochester in the 80’s. I was there but was unaware of the accident until I read about it in the paper the following day.
There was also the loss of Owl Racer G-AYMS which crashed into the Thames at Greenwich when the engine parted company from the airframe on the way home from it’s debut race during a display at North Weald around 1970 and the accident that all but destroyed Le Vier Cosmic Wind G-ARUL which stalled turning the first pylon during an air race at Halfpeny Green in 1966. There are some pictures of the wreckage on the web and it is unbelievable that after many years of patient rebuilding the aircraft was resurrected as Ballerina II.
WJ244From experience of working in model shops I would say that the main problem for kit makers is that there is no longer any tradition of handing down kit building skills. Many of the current younger generation have dads who never got to see the contents of an Airfix kit during their youth so they don’t know how to make kits and can’t pass knowledge on to their sons.
When I last worked in a shop I noticed that most youngsters who came in for kits were accompanied by grandad and there was usually a bond between the younger and older person probably created by the shared interest and sharing of knowledge. The kit choice was nearly always a joint decision and this involved discussion and communication – also a fairly alien concept to many modern youths.
I do think that kit building helped promote creativity in all of us and also stimulated our interest in avaition, cars etc and led us all to find fulfilling interests – certainly interests which were far more useful than seeing how many people you can bludgeon to death in a computer game. Don’t get me wrong I am not totally against computer gaming but I am against games which help instil violence and a lack of respect for others and their property in our young and I believe there are many games out there which – inadvertently or otherwise – do manage to do just that.
Maybe a comparatively cheap way to promote model making would be for Hornby to look at some kind of road show which went to schools to promote the hobby during craft lessons or visited youth centres during school holidays. With a couple of competent Hornby staff in attendance to help put the models together it may sow the seeds for a few new kit builders. Both Hornby and Corgi already have road show vehicles promotuing their ranges so this would just be a different and possibly even more productive way to promote their brands.
Having worked with the Corgi Road Show on 3 occassions I got the impression there were two kinds of visitor. Many were already customers and a vast majority of the rest were gawpers who dismissed the whole thing as expensive toys which cost far too much money and there was usually a further comment to their young son of “anway yopu smash all your toys within five minutes (that lack of respect thing again!). Incidentally many of this group would happily shell out around a fiver for a lovingly crafted packet of fags but Corgi models were way too expensive for “just a toy.”
Maybe promoting the hobby (particularly kit building) to the young is the way to go.
WJ244Having been involved in the model trade since 1982 including 7 years in th late 80’s/early 90’s when I ran my own shop I can honestly say that it is very difficult now to make a living from a model shop selling at full retail price let alone discount prices. The truth is that the turnover is comparatively small and the profit margins are poor compared to other “hobby/luxury goods.
Sports shops, jewellers and most gift shop items give a profit margin which is anything from twice to four times the margins available to model retailers.
I worked out that to pay rent rates and electric a back street model shop would need to turnover at least £100,000 a year and that is a tall order when you are in a back street. Don’t forget the above turnover is to pay the basic overheads from the profits and doesn’t include paying the owner any wages costs for employing staff or costs of extra stock to expand the business.
Modelzone are in a different situation as they are owned by a major importer who is able to finance stores in major shopping malls. The big malls have more visitors than the back streets so by being able to afford a prominently positioned shop they are able to attract more of the passing trade. You could argue that everyone else has the same opportunity but the financial risk and initial outlay involved to establish a shop in a modern shopping mall (including fitting out) costs is likely to be at least £100,000 to £150,000 and then you have to have more money to keep it stocked and pay the rent and rates until the cash flow picks up.
Unfortunately many small shop owners seem to forget that a smile and friendly advice goes a long way to helping ensure customers return but it seems to be the ones who offer poor service who survive.
Corgi have lurched in and out of trouble for a long time now. Modelzone have been buying Corgi overproduction at silly prices for a long time (by that I mean for years rather than months). Modelzone can afford to buy large qualtities if the price is right and Corgi have often chosen to sell them stock cheaply rather than continue to rent warehouse space to store the unsold stock so the arrangement has worked OK for both parties but there is only so long that a manufacturer can overproduce and then sell off the excess for peanuts before the whatsit hits the fan.
The problem is that there has been so much cheap Corgi around that it made it hard to sell new releases at full price because many collectors decided that it was better to wait as the model they wanted was likely to be available at a clearance price within months.
I suspect Hornby have the market knowledge to get Corgi back on track and the massive dumping of over produced stock should become a thing of the past. Stable prices for new releases should also mean that you can buy with confidence and not have to worry about your full price purchase being devalued by dumped stock a few months later.
Hopefully the Hornby buy out will prove to be a positive move. One thing is for sure and that is that Hornby have rescued Corgi from the abyss – they have definitely not bought Corgi to prop up Airfix.
From a retailers point of view the move to get youngsters interested in Airfix by making Dr Who kits (something which should appeal to the young and many older people) was a good thing. I know from running a shop that building kits is a lost art amongst the younger generation and the Dr who strategy just might get some building kits who will then move on to the aircraft ranges ensuring a good future customer base for Airfix and helping secure the future of Airfix for future aircraft kit enthusiasts.
WJ244The Historic Aircraft Museum at Southend did try to rescue the B2 from Dixons scrapyard but in the 70’s the owner refused to part with it for less than £250 which was quite a lot of money then particularly for a battered fuselage that would have to be recovered from a tree.
I remember seeing a picture of it published in Flypast at the time it was finally rescued. What puzzles me is that I remember the picture showed the fuselage with the wings propped up on oil drums to make a fairly complete but battered airframe. IT appears that only the fuselage survives now (and even that is in a very delicate state) so what happened to the wings that were in the photo suppossedly taken at around the time that the airframe was rescued. Surely the wings can’t have disappeared during the last 20 years or so.
Can anyone shed any light on this please.
If it helps the photo and rescue rport were sent in by Simon Murdoch – a name familiar to most Southend enthusiasts from the 60’s and 70’s.
WJ244A lot of the smaller items at Southend were on loan. I remember one Historic Aircraft Society meeting where Bill Gent and Dave Hammond were enthusing over a superb model of the DH108. I believe it was metal probably about 1/24 scale and I think it had retractable undercarriage which was all spring loaded. The details are a bit sketchy as it was a long time ago but I do remember that it was superbly engineered.
I also remember that it was on a sort of permanent loan but I don’t remember ever seeing it in the showcases once we opened and I don’t think I ever saw it again. I assume that at some point the owner decided that they wanted it back. It is likely that the Canberra was also a loan item and went back to the owner.
WJ244Newark’s first Anson largely went up in smoke in 1971, only the wings & engines were saved.
Newark’s first Anson was the original Ekco testbed from Southend G-ALIH. The radar nose was removed at Southend and swapped with the original nose from its successor G-AGPG before the transfer to Newark where some kind soul torched it one night.
Not exactly a major fire but the paint store and workers hut at the Southend Museum burnt to the ground when I was a volunteer there. I arrived one day to find a scorched wooden floor where the building had stood a couple of days before. The fire damaged Dragonfly WG725 which had been stored in pieces beside the hut ever since arrival from Blackbushe. I think the Dragonfly eventually landed up as scrap as in those days the fire damage meant it was regarded as past restoration. Fortunately the fire didn’t reach our spare Sea Fury WJ244 which was lying dismantled next to the Dragonfly. The cause was traced to it being a very hot day and the paint store had poor ventilation. It was believed that the fumes from the paint and thinners eventually ignited causing the fire.
The Gemini at Southend was dismantled after an attack by vandals and the deterioration of Anson G-AGPG also started after it the fuselage fabric was slashed by vandals. I know that the cockpit of Beverley XB261 was also damaged. All 3 of these incidents actually took place during museum opening hours but the manager at the time had cut back on staff so the scum were never caught.
WJ244Sorry not able to get on line so often thanks to a new (and very boring) job.
I doubt very much that the model listed as lot 68 in the auction catalogue is a Canberra. I remember a Historic Aircraft Society meeting in the museum cafe where Bill Gent reported that an elderly man up north had offered a model he had built himself. It was a freelance based on ideas from the 1930’s/40’s (which ties up with the auction catalogue description) but wasn’t intended to represent any particular type. The man was worried that it would get destroyed when he died so offered it to Bill. Bill tried to get him to give it to the Historic Aircraft Society rather than to the museum simply because he thought it would get sold if the museum ever closed (a wll founded concern as it turned out) and he felt the society had more chance of ensuring the long term future of the model. I assume it was given to the museum as it turned up in the auction catalogue.
It was sad that Lincoln RF342 landed up in her current state. There was a discussion at Southend soon after she was moved to the museum site in Aviation Way about how she should be restored. By that time she had a Lancaster nose, heavily modified bomb bay doors and I believe the bomb bay had been shortened. It was always acknowledged that there was no chance of returning her to standard spec and that the best option was to restore her as a Napier testbed. We had several wing sections to attach to the top of the fuselage but none ever got fitted although she was painted in Napier colours. I believe she has now lost the Lancaster cockpit making the situation even worse but realistically restoration in napier test bed form is almost certainly the way to go with any future restoration. It is just a pity that she got so badly treated after she left Southend.
Incidentally Tony Osborne used to run the engines when she was first delivered to Southend in 67. Stan and David Brett told me that there was a mishap one day which resulterd in the reduction box being wrecked on one engine and she never ran again. Be interesting to know if she still has an engine with damaged reduction gears.
WJ244I have also got a set of these cards which belonged to my grandparents. I can’t remember what the caption said but my understanding was that they were photos (which wwere then hand coloured) of the first Zeppelin shot down over England.
I don’t know how much you paid for the set but I have seen the individual cards for quite high prices at postcard fairs.
WJ244Just had another trawl around the web.
There is very little info about OO-BAD which was reallocated later to a hot air balloon.
OO-BAC was first registered 7 June 1933 and is shown as crashed 10 June 1935. The C/N was supposedly 290 which doesn’t appear to fit in with the constructors numbers for the UK registered examples.
OO-BAE was registered 24 April 1934 and was supposedly C/N 305 which again doesn’t fit with UK registered examples. I can’t find any details of the fate of this aircraft.
Both the above were registered to Section Gantoise De Vol Sans Moteur ASBL.
WJ244Don’t know if this helps but my 1984 copy of Wrecks and Relics has an entry for Benson in Oxfordshire which says :-
“Phil Dunnington bought the ex Thetford BAC Drone “fleet” here to continue their rebuild into one flyable aircraft. Bits of G-AEKU are also held.
G-ADPJ Ex Thetford crashed 3/4/55
G-AEJR Ex Thetford, Elmdon, Honiley
This appears to tie up with G-AEJH being the Drone that fell into the ditch whilst on tow. It also seems to seperate these airframes (t least at that time) from the rebuild of G-AEDB which at that time was listed as airworthy at Duxford.
Also came across this info for OO-BAC which is shown as a BAC Drone
http://www.baha.be/Webpages/Navigator/Photos/CivilPics/civil_airports/knokke_het_zoute_airfield.htm#BAC%20Drone%20OO-BAC
WJ244I think this is probably the boat you remember – Thank god for Google!
[URL=”http://www.solarnavigator.net/white_hawk_frank_hanning_lee.htm“[/URL]
WJ244Not exactly a warbird but this could be of interest to someone
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=320230609562&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=011
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