Don Chan*OFF-TOPIC ALERT*
Well, the next time a Chinese person, who dislikes you, gives you a clock as a present, just smile and say thank you. 8)
] On second thought, did the PLA have a J-4 or Z-4? And will they have a J-14?
I meant: In Chinese, “four” sounds like “death”. Although the serial numbers on PLA aircraft, ships, and vehicles evidently contain the number 4, will the PLA use this number in the designation of an aircraft, ship, or vehicle, such as J-4, Z-4, J-14, or Z-24?
Or, will the PLA skip this number, just as NASA is rumoured to not use the number 13 in rocket and shuttle mission numbers?
Don ChanIn the Chinese (China) news site china.com, an article dated 2005.05.25 at
http://military.china.com/zh_cn/bbs/11018441/20050525/12342296.html
has a list of PLA/PLAAF/PLAN accidents and crashes, in 1980 to 2004, in China.
Disclaimer: I don’t know how real/unreal these are, or whether these are more science phantasy by China bashers, but I translate them for future comparison/verification anyway.
9 November 2004:
In Yun Nan Province, near Meng Zi, two J-7B collided.
44 Division, PLAAF.
Lead pilot martyred. Wingman pilot ejected.
[This was reported by major news agencies, and very probably real.]
30 June 2004:
About 80 km from Wu Han City, a J-7B flew into a thunder storm, had problem, and crashed, while returning to base.
On the ground, one civilian killed, one civilian wounded. Two houses burnt.
Pilot ejected.
[This was reported by major news agencies, and very probably real.]
2004:
In Liao Ning Province, a JJ-5 crashed.
[The article writer noted this as “unconfirmed”.]
2004:
Near Yan Ji, a J-7E crashed.
[The article writer noted this as “unconfirmed”.]
2004:
Near Chang Sha, A Su-30MKK crashed.
[The article writer noted this as “unconfirmed”.]
2004:
Near Zun Hua, a J-8 crashed.
2004:
Near He Fei, a Su-30MK2 crashed.
Pilot(s) ejected.
18 October 2002:
A Z-9 violated disciplines, flew beyond the training area at very low altitude, flew into power lines, and crashed.
Four crew martyred.
12 July 2002:
A JJ-6 had engine problem and crashed.
Pilot(s) ejected.
27 May 2002:
A Su-30MKK crashed.
Two crew ejected.
March 2002:
At high altitude and high speed, a J-8B pilot had G-LOC. The aircraft oversped and disintegrated.
Pilot martyred.
27 September 2001:
At 10:45, in Cheng Du military district, Fu Shun County, Wan Shou Town, near Guang Rong Village, a CJ-6, number 61723, crashed into a mountain.
Cheng Du military district air force, PLAAF.
Pilot martyred, body located at 22:30.
August 2001:
A Su-30MKK had landing gear problem. To attempt to save the aircraft, pilots didn’t eject. Crashed and exploded while landing.
3rd Division, PLAAF.
Two crew martyred.
July 2001:
In Inner Mongolia, desert region, a J-7B crashed.
7th Division, PLAAF.
2 June 2001:
A JJ-7 had bird strike and crashed.
Pilot(s) martyred.
12 April 2001:
A J-7M had bird strike and crashed, while taking off.
3rd Test Flight Wing, PLAAF, based at Cheng Du.
Pilot martyred.
11 April 2001:
A Q-5 stalled and crashed.
28th Division, PLAAF.
1 April 2001:
A J-8B, number 81097, and an USN EP-3E collided, and the J-8B crashed.
9th Division, PLAN, based at Ling Shui AB, Hai Nan Province.
Major WANG Wei martyred.
[This was reported by major news agencies, and very real.]
1 April 2001:
A J-7B, number 30901, had bird strike and crashed, while taking off.
19th Division, PLAAF, based at Nan Yang AB, He Nan Province.
Pilot, a wing deputy commander, martyred.
31 March 2001:
A J-7E crashed, because engine turbine blade flew out.
2 February 2001:
A Su-27 had lubricant ventilator cracked, lubricant steam leaked, and caught fire. Aircraft crashed while landing.
19th Division, PLAAF, based at Ji Nan AB, Shan Dong Province.
Pilot martyred.
4 January 2001:
In He Nan Province, at Zheng Zhou AB, two Y-8, number 31242 and 31243, crashed while landing, because of icing on tail wings.
13th Division, PLAAF.
12 crew martyred.
One aircraft crashed into civilian house(s), killed six more and wounded two more.
19 September 2000:
A Y-7, number 3418, crashed while landing.
All crew martyred.
August 2000:
In Chong Qing, a Su-27UBK had fuel pipe cracked and exploded in mid-air.
33rd Division, PLAAF.
Pilot WU Xin and instructor pilot LIN Ling martyred.
28 March 2000:
In Jiang Xi Province, a J-7E had mechanical problem, lost control, and crashed.
14th Division, PLAAF, based at Zhang Shu AB, Jiang Xi Province.
Pilot martyred.
November 1999:
In Cheng Du military district, during an exercise, three J-7E launched missiles and shot down each other.
Pilots martyred.
[IMO, this is too strange to be true.]
1 April 1999:
A JJ-6 had mechanical problem and crashed.
Pilot ejected.
30 March 1999:
A Q-5C had secondary wings connections left-right reversed. During take-off, it slanted off the runway to the left and inverted.
Pilot martyred.
[I think “secondary wings” means “ailerons”?]
19 February 1999:
A H-6, while landing, hopped and crashed.
All crew martyred. A H-6 usually has six crew.
18 November 1998:
A J-7 had engine compressor cracked and crashed.
Pilot ejected.
22 October 1998:
A JJ-7, while practising take-off and landing, couldn’t lower its left landing gear.
Pilot(s) ejected.
October 1998:
A J-7L trainer crashed into a mountain.
Pilot martyred.
15 September 1998:
In Tian Jin, near Yang Cun, a Ba Yi J-7EB, number 10, was looping at low altitude, stalled, and crashed.
The Ba Yi is the PLAAF air demo team.
Pilot YANG Sheng Li martyred.
25 August 1998:
A JJ-6 was test-running on the ground, engine caught fire, and burnt out.
21 July 1998:
A J-6 had engine problem and crashed while taking off.
Pilot martyred.
May 1998:
A Su-27SK, number 13, disintegrated in mid-air, because of careless ground checks and pilot’s manoeuvring.
Based at Wu Hu AB, An Hui Province.
Pilot CHEN Li Ming martyred.
27 April 1998:
Two J-7D collided and crashed, during night training mission.
29th Division, PLAAF, based at Qu Zhou AB, Zhe Jiang Province.
Lead (number 25106) pilot ejected. Wingman (25007) pilot martyred.
27 February 1998:
A Z-11 flew onto the ground because of pilot error, during low altitude test flight.
Crew not wounded.
17 February 1998:
A JJ-6 took off, engine caught fire, and crashed.
Two crew martyred.
12 November 1997:
At Sui Xi AB, two SU-27SK took off, collided, and crashed.
6 November 1997:
A Su-27 engine flamed out and crashed.
10 October 1997:
A JJ-6 flew into power lines and crashed.
Two crew martyred.
23 August 1997:
A JJ-7 had bird strike, while taking off for night traning sortie.
Pilot(s) ejected.
August 1997:
In Chong Qing, a 33rd Division, PLAAF, J-8B and a Y-6 collided while landing.
J-8B pilot ejected.
Y-6 four crew martyred. Y-6 was carrying 20 air-launched bombs.
14 July 1997:
Two J-7 crashed while landing in poor weather.
Two pilots martyed.
May 1997:
A Su-27SMK [sic] crashed into a mountain, because novice pilot unfamiliar with night training.
Based at Sui Xi AB.
Pilot LIN Zhi martyred.
January 1997:
In Gui Lin control area, a J-7 crashed.
2nd Division, PLAAF.
November 1996:
Two J-8B, number 81295 and 81186, crashed.
PLAN, based at Ling Shui AB, Hai Nan Province.
Pilots WANG Fang and LI Ming martyred.
27 November 1996:
In Si Chuan Province, two Su-27UBK collided while flying close formation, after lead aircraft engine flamed out.
13 October 1996:
A J-6 had both engines sputtered and crashed.
Pilot martyred.
11 June 1996:
A J-6 flew into a spiral and crashed.
Pilot martyred.
April 1996:
In Hu Bei Province, at Yi Chang AB, a Su-27SK crashed while landing.
24 June 1994:
A flight of two JJ-6 flew into a thunder storm, attempted and failed emergency landings.
10 June 1994:
A H-5 had compass malfunction, got lost, bingo fuel, and failed emergency landing.
Crew martyred.
23 April 1992:
A J-6 crashed, because of pilot error.
Pilot ejected.
22 July 1988:
A J-6 crashed.
Pilot martyred.
21 July 1987:
A J-6 had engine flame-out and crashed.
Pilot martyred.
16 September 1984:
A J-6 crashed, because of pilot error.
Pilot martyred.
29 March 1980:
A J-6 crashed into a mountain while landing.
Pilot martyred.
Don Chan*OFF-TOPIC ALERT*
] It was this clock mounted on a stand, to which a metal model of an Su-27 was attached.
BTW, amongst some Chinese, to give a clock as a gift to a Chinese person is a faux pas, because song4 zhong1, meaning “to give a clock (as a present, for free)”, sounds the same as song4 zhong1, meaning “(to be present and) to see off (a person as his/her life) ends (such as at his/her death bed)”.
http://www.mandarintools.com/chardict.html
To exchange the clock for, say, a meal or another gift in return, may not work, because the Chinese person is still receiving the clock for free. One ad hoc way to get around this phonetic superstition is to tell a friend to buy the clock for, say, $10, then you buy the clock from the friend for $1. 8^D
On second thought, did the PLA have a J-4 or Z-4? And will they have a J-14?
And ISTR reading in a recent article about the retirement of some ROCN warships that the ROCN doesn’t use some banner numbers because of naval traditions.
(All right, I’ll crawl back into the woodwork now.)
Don ChanFYI, the US Central Command site has official investigation reports of the Patriot vs Tornado, and of the Patriot vs Hornet friendly fire incidents, at
http://www.centcom.mil/CENTCOMNews/Investigation%20Reports/Default.asp
but doesn’t seem to have a report of the F-16 vs Patriot incident.
Don ChanYou’re welcome, eh!
The US Central Command site has an official summary of that fatal foxtrot uniform, with four KIAs and eight WIAs, at
http://www.centcom.mil/centcomnews/Reports/Tarnak_Farms_Report.htm
If this URL doesn’t work, then copies and summaries of the original investigation report are available at
http://dsp-psd.pwgsc.gc.ca/Collection/D2-138-2002E.pdf
http://foi.missouri.edu/privacyact/Tarnak-Farm-BOI-Exec-sum-Eng.pdf
(http://foi.missouri.edu/terrorismfoi/tarnakfarms.html)
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/report/2002/tarmak_fr-9_e.htm
Don Chan] Do you have similar records of Chinese military crashes/incidents?
Yes, see
http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/search.php?searchid=201369
But unless reported by authoritative news sites, such as the Xin Hua News Agency, the reliability of reports of PLA/PLAAF/PLAN, as well as ROCA/ROCAF/ROCN, accidents and crashes is doubtful, because some reports and even accident photos of PLA/PLAAF/PLAN accidents and crashes might be composed or photoshopped by, for example, Taiwanese hecklers.
] a C-130 landing with one engine out isn’t a crash…or even much of an event.
A C-130 landing with one engine out isn’t a crash. It can be an emergency, off-schedule landing.
Don ChanTry:
“This is a collection of war footage. If you feel that war footage is not something you can watch, please leave. I won’t defend my stance on collecting and publicly displaying war footage because I don’t feel that I need to. With that said, enjoy the videos.”
Don ChanWRT the J-10, I just read an article in Chinese (China) at
http://www.top81.com.cn/bwl/military/airforce/j10/122.htm
that claimed:
In late 1995, the first J-10 prototype, serial 1001, with the AL-31FN engine, announced its first test flight will be in 1996.
In late 1997, the second J-10 prototype, serial 1002, crashed. Pilot martyred.
The “official” first test flight was on 28 March 1998.
In 1998, J-10 prototypes 1003 and 1004 were built.
Will someone in this forum tell us more about the details of the crash?
Cause, date, location, or pilot’s name?
BTW, WRT the J-9, an article in Chinese (China) at
http://www.zgjunshi.com/power/Article_Show.asp?ArticleID=3455
is about its development and cancellation.
Don Chan[06] Successful F-16 Emergency Landing in Limnos Air Force Cadet Lands F-16
http://www.hri.org/news/greek/eraen/2005/05-05-13_1.eraen.html
reported:
[06] Successful F-16 Emergency Landing in Limnos Air Force Cadet Lands F-16
13 May 2005 13:00:00
By Athina Saloustrou
A young F-16 pilot made a successful emergency landing in the Limnos Airoport at 11:00, and after a scramble with a Turkish F-16 in Samos, his aircraft presented a serious problem in the engine. The aircraft accompanied by a second one completed their mission and were returning to the Aghialos base in Volos. During its flight one of the aircrafts that was piloted by 26-year-old Air Force Cadet, presented a problem in the fuel system, as the relative indicator suddenly dropped. The flight plan changed and the two aircrafts approached for landing in Limnos. Ten miles before the aircrafts engine shut down, the pilot was forced to an emergency landing at very adverse conditions, which was made successfully. The second aircraft landed in the auxiliary landing strip. It is noted that the pilot of the first aircraft had only 130 flying hours with the F-16.
Translated by Eirene Nisiriou
Don ChanThat original article isn’t the Encyclopaedia Fulcrumica, you know. {wink}
Don ChanFWIW, in a Chinese (China) article, about the Russian AF MiG-29 crash in Russia on 12 May 2005, at
http://jczs.sina.com.cn/2005-05-13/1600288530.html
is a list of Russian AF aircraft accidents and crashes, from 1988 to 2003.
9 November 2004:
In Malaysia, a Malaysian AF MiG-29 crashed, after one engine caught fire in mid-air. Pilot ejected.
12 November 2003:
In Armenia, a MiG-29 crashed, into a mountain. Pilot KIA.
14 October 2003:
In Russia, Tver region, near Tver City, a MiG-31 crashed, after one engine caught fire in mid-air. Two crew ejected.
19 June 2003:
In Russia, a MiG-29 crashed. Pilot ejected.
3 March 2003:
In Russia, Tver region, near a village about 125 km from Tver City, a L-410 crashed. Amongst its two crew and 23 paratroopers, some paratroopers baled out. 14 survived, 11 KIAs.
14 March 2001:
In Peru, a Peruvian AF MiG-29 crashed. Pilot ejected.
6 August 1999:
In India, an Indian AF MiG-29 crashed, after it caught fire in mid-air. Pilot KIA.
17 December 1996:
In Russia, Tver region, near an AP, an An-12 crashed. 17 KIAs, including the then Leningrad military district commander.
22 August 1995:
In Russia, a MiG-29 crashed, when it was landing, after a training sortie. Pilot KIA.
19 January 1992:
In Russia, Tver region, near an AP near Tver City, an An-22 crashed, soon after take-off. Seven KIAs.
1988:
In France, near Paris, at an air show, a MiG-29 crashed. Pilot ejected.
Don Chan[Q] US DOD BRAC 2005
I took a brief look at the USAF BRAC at
http://www.af.mil/brac/
and the USN BRAC at
http://www.navfac.navy.mil/brc/cf-bin/aboutus/accomp.cfm
and the only affected US military bases outside the USA seem to be Guam and Puerto Rico.
Are USAF/USMC/USN air bases in, for example, Japan and South Korea unaffected?
Or will the DOD announce a different list for US military bases outside the USA?
Don ChanTo plawolf:
Thank you.
Don ChanSeriously, speaking of PLAAF aircraft cockpits, a dumb question that I’ve always wanted to ask: In PLA aircraft, are the cockpit instruments and gauges, and especially the MFDs in a glass cockpit, labelled in Chinese or English?
After all, I doubt the MFDs in the FC-1/JF-17 or J-10/F-10 have a boot-up screen that allows the pilot to choose to display the OS (possibly a Hong Qi (Red Flag) variant of Linus) in Cyrillic, English (USA), Chinese (Simplified), Hebrew, Korean, or Urdu fonts?
(I read in newspapers that Chinese astronauts, including (then) Lieutenant Colonel YANG Li Wei, had to learn some English and Russian, but this was because they were partly trained in Russia.)
Don Chan] 3. The Lavi is a failed project. We know this because we don’t see the production units of this thing flying,
Disagreed. The YF-17 Cobra could have been a failed project, but the USN resurrected it as the F/A-18 Hornet series. The American RAH-66 Comanche, British P.1154, Canadian CF-105 Arrow, FSU MiG 1.42/MiG 1.44 MFI and S-37/Su-47 Berkut might not be failed projects, if their governments didn’t cancel them. For instance, if the Brits or Canadians continue to develop and manufacture the YF-23 or X-32 Joint Strike Flounder, then IMO they wouldn’t be failed projects.
Also, the FC-1 and JH-7 can be considered failed, or at the most obsolescent, projects by 2000s Western standards, but they are mass-produced and equipping the PLAAF and PLAN anyway. So, regardless of the capabilities and technologies of the aircraft, IMO it depends more on the needs and willingness of its government to support it.
Sign In
