RE: Is Rabie giving GW speech lessons?

Rabie

Have you been giving GWB speech lessons? If so it would explain some of his occasional lapses. 🙂

I happened to catch GWB giving a speech a few weeks ago. He talked for almost 26 minutes without a single miscue, without once looking at a note and without a prompter. I enjoyed it.

The following sunday I happened to catch a speech by a American leftist university prof made to a anti-American crowd at Carlton U in Ottawa, Ontario. This character mumbled and stumbled his way through a typical anti-American rant which featured comments about GWB being stupid, inarticulate, blah, blah, blah. He read the whole piece, constantly losing his place and fliping pages. I wondered afterward if this dolt even wondered why his talk fell flat.

I also saw a segment late last year where GWB and his wife acknowledged his tendancy to slip into linguistic wonderland and her occasional reaction to it. He accepts his stumbles with good humour.

Regards

Sauron

RE: So I guess it’s just a matter of ‘when’ the US is going to war

Rabie

Have you been learning to spell or were you just sober when you typed this? I can’t spell for crap myself. 🙂

I got a laugh at your use of “you Yanks”. I have always been aware that both Americans and “you English” often behave as if you are the only ones on the planet. Everyone else is just background. 🙂

1) Why should the USA act now?

Thats easy. Better to deal with that megelomaniac before he gets the bomb rather than later. Perhaps you think SH with the bomb wouldn’t change things? Take a good look at the fruitcake in North Korea.

Maybe NK’s neighbours are wishing he didn’t have the bomb now (or be as close to it as every one seems to believe). But as usual they will be content to sit on their hands as long as Kim Ding Dong’s principle target for troublemaking in the US. (Personally I would like to see the US get out of NK and let the neighbours have his horror show all to themselves, but…)

2) There is NO link between Iraq and al quieda

NO? How do you know that Rabie? SH wouldn’t lie would he?

3) You don’t need the oil

AH! The oil! The US wants to steal all Iraq’s. They don’t want Europe or Japan or anyone to get it.

4) As you point out America could sort its oil out itself by cutting SUV usage and scrapping your 10 mpg cars !!! I know for a fact the Chrysler is at the forefront of research in alternatives and with the Daimler diesel engines you yanks will now get diesels at last (I digress…)

Well those Hollywood leftwingers would certainly be pissed without their limos and SUV’s.

Just what the US needs is advice from a guy from a country that had to sell it’s entire auto industry because everyone was on tea break most of the time. 🙂

As far as Daimler is concerned, it’s still trying to figure out how Chrysler can make 3X’s as many cars, in 1/3 the time it takes Daimler to make just one. Of course Daimler charges 3X’s as much so I guess it all works out. 🙂

5) Democracy is bad for Iraq – democracy is not the amazingly good thing we all make it out to be – in Iraq’s case you’ll get huge civil war, etc, etc and piss your allies off

Wow! Talk about chauvanistic! People of every variety and race all over the world have adopted forms of democracy, but the people of Iraq are too dim to understand it. Maybe all Arabs are not smart enough (except the ones in Israel who are). Really Rabie!

6) The problem in the Middle East is Israel – Palestine

Ah Israel! Lets make the obligatory reference to the Jews. Well all I can say is, I don’t believe SH invaded Iran or Kuwait because of Palistine. The Arabs states simply use the Palestinian cause when it suits them and don’t give a s##t about them the rest of the time. Jordan has probly killed more Palestinians than Israel. This doesn’t diminish the problem but its not an issue with Iraq.

7) This is getting a long post and I’ll have to spell check in word so you can all read it

That I can relate to.

8) Is anyone sure this is the right militarily thing to do – can we invade Iraq successfully, can we fight a Stalingrad, we will get chemed or bioed by him

I assume you missed the Gulf war in 1991. Stalingrad indeed! This is obviously a reference to Bagdad. I can’t see the population of Bagdad fighting house to house for SH’s honour. As for the army conscripts, some of them even surrended to French news crew in 1991. (I just bit my tongue). 🙂

9) What’s wrong with him having WMD’s ??? Lots of other countries have why not Iraq ??? If you believe that people acquiring WMDs is bad then go beat up North Korea

Well there are too many countries with them now. Fortunately most of them are not run by megelomaniacs. You obviously feel that its better to wait until SH gets them before we try and ‘beat him up’ Perhaps this is more compatible with your sense of fair play?

10) What’s your future for Iraq – if you can’t offer a better alternative (a McArthur is going to be impossible to do today, esp. with an Arab nation) then why say you are

I don’t get the McArthur remark beyond its obvious reference to Korea.

The people of Iraq will determine Iraq’s future. It will hard perhaps but lets give them a chance and a little credit.

11) Who appointed it up to America to sort out the worlds problem – sure this planet has innumerable problems but why America. America never liked it when the UK blocked your trade with France in the Napoleonic wars did you. Remember how that felt you would like us showing up off the Florida cost because you can’t organise an election

Good grief! Do we have to go all they way back to 1812 to find the last time the US picked on the UK? The US became democratic to get away from you lot didn’t they? 🙂

Anyway everyone including the US has problems. The English have a disfunctional Royal house. The US has a bunch of old folks in Florida who can’t distingush ‘Bush” from ‘Gore”. They do both have four letters.

Who appointed America? Well in the middle east they got the job when the British and Freanch dropped the ball and when home in 1947/48 leaving the place in a mess. If you look around you could probably find other examples. 🙂

but at the end of the day i think that war with Saddam is 90% inevitable and we’ve got to think how were going to sort out the mess once we’ve won (assuming this doesn’t turn into Vietnam mk II)

Lets hope SH is finished off before a full scale invasion starts.

Regards

Sauron

RE: So I guess it’s just a matter of ‘when’ the US is going to war

Well Nikumba I don’t want to nit pick, but as long as I seem to be the principle defender of the US (for the moment at least) let me just make a point or two.

Let me say that the US foreign policy is not always perfect, but..

This constant restatement of the US being the reason for Iraq’s development and use of chemical weapons is based on what facts? Just another bit of CIA work? Their are those here who rant about ‘facts’ all the time.

This bit about ‘its always about oil’ is getting thin – Korea, Afghanistan? As we both agree, the US is not the major user of ME oil. Perhaps it’s really more about European and Japanse oil? Hey! maybe the US plan is to steel Iraq’s oil and give it to the Koreans 🙂
.
I don’t think the Chechns consider themselves Russian nor do I believe the Russians are using chemical weapons on them. However, if the Russians are guilty of something, perhaps we should talk about it direcly and leave the US out of it. The Russians are big boys.

Finally, the US is not the sole representative of the so called ‘west’. If you have an issue with the US, my advice would be to skip the ‘West’ part. Your likey to get all the lift wingers in the rest of the ‘West’ pissed at you. They sure as hell don’t want to share in the blame for any of the worlds problems. It makes them cranky. 🙂

Regards

Sauron

RE: So I guess it’s just a matter of ‘when’ the US is going to war

Well Garry it would be a good place to start. SA hasn’t attacked its neighbours recently and dosn’t appear to be trying to get the ‘bomb’. Thats one important distinction between Iraq and SA. I think a case could be made that even by middle east standards, SH is somewhat of an aberration, while SA is more typical and therefore less abhorrent. Not a very satisfying distinction I admit and one the US isn’t very happy about either.

Very few things in this world are black and white. There have always been a host of bad guys to choose from but it usually becomes clear which ones are the most dangerous. I think SH’s track record speaks for itself and left alone, he will get the bomb an we will be dealing with another megalomaniac with the nuclear option like the ‘Great Leader’ Kim ding-dong.

SH’s removal by force or by other means, will not make the other dictatorships go away but it will be a start. I believe there is good evidence to suggest, that dealing with the worst cases pays off in the long run.

Regards

Sauron

RE: Russia asks for more US dollars to clean up nuclear mess

Some more detail of this ongoing process can be found at:
http://www.defense-aerospase.com.

Everything from bombers to subs.

The funds are obviously allocated as needed through the budget process.

Regards

Sauron

RE: So I guess it’s just a matter of ‘when’ the US is going to war

JAG

You got me.

I never mentioned the Kurds and know nothing about the CIA or any US forces training the Kurds in Iraq, Turkey or anywhere less. Sorry.

Maybe some else knows all about it.

Sauron

RE: So I guess it’s just a matter of ‘when’ the US is going to war

Google

I agree with you that the US along with the UK, France, Russia and other have meddled in ME affairs at times and you may be correct about the CIA’s involment in Iran. As far as the bio-warfare issue, I think there are more likey candidates, but who knows?

I believe US imports of ME oil currently run at about 20% of its dependancey on outside supplies. Europe and Japan are likey the biggest users. As I said elsewhere, the US is interested in supply not ownership. I agree that pre capita energy consumption in the US should be reduced. How to do it is another matter. Perhaps the Hollywood liberals could give up their SUVs.

Regards

Sauron

RE: So I guess it’s just a matter of ‘when’ the US is going to war

Mr Sauron indeed!

Guys

The Janes report is one person’s opinion. I see nothing in that piece that hasn’t been said before nor would I expect anyone here to change their opinion, one way or the other, based on what it does say.

Facts? Todays fact are often tomorrows misconceptions. I can’t prove SH hasn’t so called WMD anymore than another here can prove he hasn’t. However, I think it likely he has some and that he wants the bomb. Based on his past record, I believe it is prudent to settle the issue soon. It is a ‘fact’ that the chief weapons inspector of the UN has stated that Iraq is holding out and that its recent declaration its incomplete. Its a ‘fact that SH has ignored the UN for 12 years.

It’s a ‘fact’ that many Iraqis have fled their country. They have that in common, however their opinions on the future may differ. Do they all oppose his removal by force? Not likey.

Its a ‘fact’ that NK has the ability to produce the bomb if it hasn’t already, and thus a ‘fact’ that this diminishes the options the UN has. Do we want to replicate this situation in Iraq by waiting until he has that advantage?

It’s a ‘fact’ that SH has waged aggressive war on his nieghbours. Its a ‘fact’ that he would be in control of most of the oil in the ME if he had been successful. It a ‘fact’ that if the US and the UK hadn’t forced the issue in 1990/91 the UN would have sat on its hands and he would have certainly have the bomb bt now.

The failure to finish off SH in 1991 was a mistake. This mistake was followed closely by the mistake of (at least) not aiding the opposition forces within Iraq. For that the US must carry most of the blame because it listened to and believed the gloom and doom merchants (both within and outside the US) that said to do so would enflame the region and cause massive upheavals throughout the middle east. Looking back, this now seems very unlikely, however it is never-the-less a ‘fact’ that the no-fly zones are protecting many Iraqis who would otherwise be at SH’s mercy.

It is a ‘fact’ that Iraq’s and NK’s nieghbourhoods are vastly different which dictates different solutions. Its a ‘fact’ that the interests and influences of SK, China, Japan and Russia with respect to NK are significantly different than the relationship between Iraq and the rest of the middle east. (Where Israel is the only dependable influence in town).

It’s a ‘fact’ that the people of Iraq will continue to suffer until he goes.

It not a fact that that the governments in the middle east are what they are, due to US policy. This claim is absurd, as is the claim that the US would steal Iraq’s oil.

Regards

Sauron