Found it, spent some time pulling my hair out because I couldn’t remember where I had seen a good detailed pic of the RNZN’s OPV’s, but here they are, thanks to DEFENCE MODELS AND GRAPHICS
With this model, you can clearly see the aft area that would easily allow for a slight expansion to equip Mine Hunting equipment, hydrographic equipment or even allow for deployment of special forces RHIBs through stern doors.
While searching the web for other info, I came across some other interesting ideas that could also fit the bill here though I have no info on these and was wondering if anyone else here had some
The Seasled
A Catermaran LCU
And a Monohulled LCU
Damn looks like there is a very simple pre-made acceptable solution that the bean counters should have no problem with and if they do they need looked at. It has a hangar for a LUH not big enough for a NH-90 but the ship could be stretched to make more room for this. One thing is i dont know how well it would work as a mine hunter, it would IMHO need things worked out but as an OPV it looks great. Is there a rear launch and recovery ramp on this design? if so it would help with mine hunting etc.
No there isn’t atm mate but that could be added with the extention I mentioned
As for the LUH capability, well this would kick Air 9000 back in to gear with the Light Utility and Training Helo phase, especially since it is the light helos that deploy aboard the current survey ships- atm we are currently leasing three A-109’s
for a range of tasks including conversion from single engine helos (Squirrel)
to dual engined Seahawks
Some of the options seem a bit exotic and un-proven if im honest such as the large LCAC type hovercraft etc. Not that these would be rubbish in anyway but i can see the RAN going for something simple and cheap rather than anything that deviates from normal watercraft. The L-cat i like the design but as you have mentioned it’s far too small for what is needed. The MRV seems like a good design but it cannot land equipment onto beaches etc but it would be a better all rounder.
My choice would be the Caimen 200 as it’s plain, simple and quite boring, the only thing not proven is the active bow ramp but that i dont think holds many issues. Basically it’s close to what is in use atm but has some advantages, not exactly thinking out of the box but i think it’s ideal. (Im a Brit so im biased:D)
As much as I am a fan of odd designs, the two options I see here that are in contention are the Caimen 200 with it’s obvious simply and rugged design and the L-Cat which the French are already working on for replacement of their BATRAL fleet.
The Caimen 200 has the ability to expand with RAN needs, a cover over the rear would see to the needs of a helo deck and there is ample space to incorporate the surgery unit as I have been saying for some time.
Now the L-Cat is vastly more radical I agree, but given that the French have a huge fleet base not far from our shores (Noumea in Vanuatu) we could opt in and produce a common fleet requirement, after all we do see a lot of the smaller French units in our home waters and considering we deploy to all the small Island nations in the South Pacific along side the French, there is use here for this design. Though I can see only one draw back here, the L-Cat is rather small in it’s current form and can only hope that this design would grow before any fleet units are ordered, I mean as it stands, the current prototype unit isn’t big enough to replace any LCH let alone a bigger BATRAL- there isn’t even space for a helo deck, if you add one over the top you’re just as likely to over load it and sink it.
L-Cat on trials via Jane’s, not the pic from the well deck of the French LHD
This page has an interesting video at the bottom showing the L-Cat on trials in the harbour and also beaching, then lowering the bow doors- worth a look if only to see just how big it is. Note how it turns on it’s own length, which in some harbours would be a very neat advantage.
So you are saying that the RAN wants a new ship designed especially for it? It won’t accept an existing design? What happened to the preference for an existing design with only modest tweaks, as in the LHD & destroyer purchases?
No no no, I am saying that it doesn’t want second hand vessels that have already served a good portion of their useful lives in another navy. The idea of ordering a proven design means that a design that is already in service with a navy and of recent design incorporate latest design philosiphies.
Right there should be an image attached to this:o It’s a BVT C1 design from DSEi 2009.
What about that then? All you would really have to do is remove the Artisan radar slap the CEAFAR and CEAmount mast array on the top of it. On the bow switch out the Mk8 mod 1 gun for the 5″ gun remove the A35/A43 launchers add in the Mk 41 VLS system around 32 cells ideally. The Phalanx mounts i would put them on some sort of structure to raise them up for better arcs. Maybe extend the hangar to have 2 small side spaces for UAV’s and then put the Phalanx mounts on that.
What do people think?
Sounds like a go mate
I think I want to see more pictures of this ship, got on any pictures that show the front?
Kev old mate, your wish is my command!
I think it is safe to say that unless something better comes out, it will have everything fitted to the ANZAC’s and more. Probably not an IR SAM unless RAM is purchased to replace Phalanx though.
I don’t see RAM being fitted as the Phalanx Block 1B will be fitted to the Hobart class and thus carried over to the new frigate for fleet common standards.
I would love to see a revisit to the old Transfield design that we were looking at building in the mid 90’s with Malaysia (I hope someone has a pic of it somewhere).
Failing this, I’d love to see some of the RNZN’s Otago class serving our needs as I feel that these vessels could do the job with ease, though we’d up gun them a little.
We’d have no problem building them for our navy because they were built here and we could incorporate a slight stretch up to 100m to cover the addition of space for the change of equipment for Survey and Mine hunting equipment. Add to this the commonality factor and you can see how I am keeping the bean counters happy 😀
The current HMAS Sirius is the West coast fleet tanker.
She was bought on the second hand market and was formerly the MV Delos
She is only a temporary measure as she won’t be able to supply the LHD’s and other fleet units at the same time.
As it stands, the RAN are not interested in buying a second hand unit, nor are we looking at building the vessel in a yard in South Korea despite costs being saved! It will be built here.
The Wave class are a nice looking vessel I grant you and the Fort class has advantages of the large amount of helo capability- thus allowing a vessel of this type to be a self sustained emergency support unit, as HMAS Success has been in the past.
Allow me to spell out a few requirements that I can see the RAN will pose for this vessel:
[INDENT]
[/INDENT]
I have stated before that the Berlin Class would seem to be a good type to have as a replacement especially because of the hospital facilities already built into the design
But as pointed out to me, these vessels are a bit on the small side. Well a bit of research on this design, I have found that there is a stretched version available, so it is still in with a chance.
The other contender I feel has a chance is the Aegir class
This class comes in two forms that the RAN could look at, the 18 as above and the 18R
These vessels are tailorable to the customers needs so we could get what we want right from the outset.
As for the RNZN, She too will need a new vessel for her fleet and the Aegir 10 could fit their bill
As I stated in the other thread, a high degree of commonality with the RAN and having the ship built here as a tack on order for them would reduce costs all round and keep both countries ship building industries going.
HMNZS Endeavour,
[IMG]http://www.navy.mil.nz/nr/rdonlyres/12fc8718-2491-4b0f-9a3a-b8ed643c9c9…
recently underwent a conversion to comply with the new IMO laws pertaining to tankers needing to be double hulled. She is expected to remain in service for a further five years and a replacement is being sought in about two years.
I’ll do all the fiddly bit and add what others have said on the original thread, there are some interesting ideas there 😎
Kato added this idea:
Rolls-Royce proposal (UT-527):
http://www.meretmarine.com/article.cfm?id=102955
– 1800 tons displacement
– dimensions 92.4 x 18 meters
– high automatisation, 12 men crew
– range 20.000 nm @ 16 knots (!), max speed 20 knots
– heavy helicopter platform, no hangar
– capacity for up to 320 troops, or 120 troops with 20 vehicles including some armoured
– multi-purpose with towing and firefighting capability
Proposal is for 6 ships for the Marine Nationale, to replace the BATRALs and the southern patrol cutter Albatros, possibly also a candidate for P400 replacement. Proposed introduction 2013-2018.
CNIM proposal for BATRAL replacement (MPV):
http://www.meretmarine.com/article.cfm?id=108703
(well, somewhere in there)
– dimensions: 90 meters long, catamaran
– range 12.000 nm @ 12 knots, cruise speed 20 knots, max speed 25 knots
– crew: 25 men
– platform and hangar for medium helicopter and/or UAV
– capacity: up to 300 troops or those 120 men with 20 vehicles (160 lane meters / 500 m² 5-m-roof flex deck)
– beachable
The primary concerns for “Projet BIS” from the MN seems to be :
– massive range for worldwide autonomous use
– standardized troop capacity identical to BATRAL
– helicopter capability
The rest seems to be … negotiable.
And by me:
ONR’s concept does seem to be right out there, but is the RAN ready to move towards a hover craft design?
Here are some of the designs for the T-Craft that I came across.
I also found info on the HLCAC
And more interestingly the L-Cat which France is currently working on, now this project seems to be of interest to me!
http://defense-technologynews.blogspot.com/2008/11/france-navy-test-new-l-cat-landing.html
Back from Kato:
L-CAT is just a LCU replacement, far too small to replace LSTs. The article linked by me also gives a mid-scale CNIM system, the 60m long MPC 2.
And again from me:
The decision behind replacing the LCH’s is simple, they are old- we aren’t looking to increase the size much as these vessels have proven to be just what the doctor ordered. I can however, see a few improvements being made to the role in order to allow the RAN to better support the army in the current role, improvements would be: Helo deck (no need really to go all out and have an organic helo detachment), a small surgery- not a hospital- would go well considering where we usually send these vessels and why, and lastly capability to deploy all manner of Army equipment (The LHCs can’t take the new MBTs).
Here is another design I have just found that could fit the bill- albeit with some mods to incorporate what I mentioned above- the BMT Fast LCT: Caimen-200
And now adding one final thought that I have been an advocator of since coming across the project- the MRV project
http://www.austal.com/index.cfm?objectID=DDAD0578-65BF-EBC1-2C1EA1B423C292D9
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