I alreay knew that there is only one engine for LCA and MCA. That is Kaveri. But, Steathy Spy kept insisting they are two different things, and that GTRE asking help for MCA’s engine but not LCA’s. Then, let him clarify what he claimed.

This is obviously a fan based website free of charge for anyone to participate in, the person in question is not the mouth peace of the DRDO, he may claim what he wishes, you both can create your own thread where you can try to proove who is smarter.

Trying to read your links again and again. I don’t see there is two different engines for LCA and MCA. They both are the same engines basically. MCA’s is just a minor modification to the LCA’s. I belive MCA one is still a propose and there is no physical engine yet, they still need to certify the main Kaveri of LCA first, then will make modification for MCA.
The one cracked-down in Russia is a fact that it is Kaveri engine of LCA, and you are trying to fool, twisted, and misleading us that it is MCA’s engine and LCA’s is no problem.

If you read my post on this very page, I already answer this confusion of yours, THEY ARE THE SAME ENGINE ITS JUST THAT THE MCA KAVERI is supposed to be even more powerful, there were plans for it to be a completely different engine with thrust vectoring etc but this is very much on the drawing stages, so for now there is only one engine and the MCA will use a slightly more powerful version of it.

It “missed the bus” because it never had the technical ability to ride the bus in the first place.

This is more about India’s inability to replicate military equipment without full technical transfer and massive foreign help on the scene, not that it is more “honorable.” :rolleyes: It was certainly not very honorable in using a civilian nuclear reactor given by Canadian as aid for India’s poor to develop its nuclear program.

India has no qualms about copying things that it can copy and is the world’s largest violator of pharmaceutical copyright.

Now, the difference between China and India is that even under the worst period of isolation when China was at odds with BOTH Russia and the US in the 1960s and early 70s, the Chinese were able to develop and build equipment from small transport planes (Y-11) all the way up to nuclear submarines on their own.

The Han SSN and especially the Xia SSBN was far more complicated than anything attempted by even the Japanese never mind the Indians.

My goodness does this Chinese nationalism really make you spit so much?

Just because India obtained canadian reactors and you alledge that itused the plutonium to make nukes does not equal to India violating licence agreements with Russia, they are completely different issues genious. In fact had you bothered to read up a bit beforehead before orgasming away, you would have quickly realized that there was never any plan or desire by GRTE DRDO or anyone to design an engine until the Kaveri, nor was teir a will to build any nuclear sub until the early 1990s. Even missile development started in the 1980s when india heard rumours of your country helping the Pakistanis by giving them missile tech, it was never a question of lack of technical skill, it was a question of lack of will by the Government which was more concearned with the political emergency in the country at the time but you would not know that but yet would start blabbing away making speculative assumptions….
One can easily check that by going through archives of the Indian govt, so please stick to your Chinese products and stop BSing about something you have little knowledge about. You cannot compare India and China for such reasons.

In terms of Chinese engines, give me a break it has been a few decades now since China first tried to design engines and even it still has problems with the ws-10, surely by your own logic i would expect China to finally master something like engie design and tech after so many decades but obviously i do not think like you.

p.s Most of the plutonium for Indian weapons is rumoured to come from another reactor, not the Canadian one.

IN terms of violation of drugs, sorry mate that issue has been resolved long back, in fact come this week George Bush himself will sign an agreement with India to JOINTLY share data and develop cures for AIDES recognizing India’s contribution in terms of producing cheap drugs and research and development….

hehe these americans must really be stupid 😀 to sign an agreement with violators of “copyright” (try patent) laws.

Propulsion
(production) one GTRE GTX-35VS Kaveri turbofan
Thrust (F404) 18,100 lb (80.50 kN)
(GTX) 20,200 lb (89.86 kN)

Also taken from DRDO

I cannot confirm this as my memory is a bit hazzy on the Kaveri but I do not think that they have reached the required thrust level for the Kaveri as of yet which is the big problem in the first place.

From the DRDO website,
http://www.drdo.com/products/kaveri.htm
Four prototypes of Kaveri engine and two prototypes of Kabini engine (Kaveri core) have been assembled and are undergoing extensive ground testing. Kaveri engine is a two-spool bypass turbofan engine having three stages of transonic low pressure compressor driven by a single-stage low pressure turbine. The core engine consists of six-stage transonic compressor driven by single-stage cooled high pressure turbine. The engine is provided with a compact annular combustor with airblast atomisers. The aerothermodynamic and mechanical designs of engine components have been evolved using many in-house and commercially developed software for solid and fluid mechanics.

Kaveri three-stage transonic fan, designed for good stall margin and bird strike capability, handles an air mass flow of 78 kg/s and develops a pressure Combustion Chamber Liner ratio of 3.4. The six-stage variable capacity transonic compressor of Kaveri develops a pressure ratio of 6.4. The variable schedule of inlet guide vanes and two rows of stator is through FADEC control system to open the stator blades in a predetermined manner. High intensity low UD ratio annular combustor of Kaveri engine incorporates air blast injection of fuel for uniform outlet temperature profile and reduced
carbon emission.

Kaveri high pressure turbine is provided with an efficient cooling design incorporating augmented convection-cum-film cooling for the vanes and combination cooling for the rotor blade to handle up to 1700 K turbine entry temperature. Kabini engine comprising high pressure compressor, combustor and high pressure turbine has undergone high altitude test at facilities abroad successfully demonstrating the flat rating concept of Kaveri engine assembly and in particular the combustor high altitude ignition and stability performances.

Kaveri engine has been specifically designed for Indian environment. The engine is a variable cycle-flat-rated engine in which the thrust drop due to high ambient, forward speed is well compensated by the increased turbine entry temperature at the spool Kabini altitude test speed. This concept has been already demonstrated with high temperature and pressure condition in DRDO’s High Mach Facility. Kaveri engine is controlled by Kaveri full authority digital control unit {KADECU), which has been developed and successfully demonstrated at DRDO’s test bed

The rolling out of PV2 is definately something to look forward to – not that i’m following the LCA all that closely, but i can’t remember any serious steps forward made over the last 18 months or so.

I have to say the lack of any substantial outlook on IAF orders (“wanting to buy 20 with an option of 20 more” doesn’t sound like more than an OpEval batch) isn’t really hopeful either. As i’ve said before, i think the Tejas will be an interesting and important tech demonstrator, but i have serious doubts about it entering actual operational service.

A prototype per definition is not built to production standard. That’s what pre-production machines are for. Unfortunately, the definitions of words like “prototype”, “development aircraft” and “pre-production aircraft” has blurred tremendously over the last decades.
But yes, airforces have repeatedly placed production orders in early development stages like the LCA is in now (…still in early development, after all those years 😉 ).

The first 8 LSPs are for Opeval although even they may be pulled in to acheave certification (2000 hours). The first 40 are scheduled to enter squadron service.

Yes things have been slow over the last 18 months since PV1 took off, even it had been delayed during taxi trials as aparently there was some sort of systems failure (PLBIT?) and eventually the pilot decided to risk it. The TD-2 I believe had some hydrolics problem back in the day before it flew as well. It appears that PV-2 has been delayed for at least 5-6 months, it was supposed to take off late last year but will now take off next week. It appears that scientists had more trouble than expected in validating the FCS which itself delayed the pv-2.

But a Madarassah is just a religious school for Muslims, there is nothing wrong in it, its just that in some schools there are some people bent on fostering hate and the head of the school is either involved in hating himself or does not bother reporting this to the authorities.

In Pakistan madarassahs are the only way for the poor to get an education, the problem there is that these schools do not teach any science or economics.

Careful, Sameer…….. this is neither the time nor the place for Indo/Pak antagonism.

Thank you.

Grey Area
Moderator.

later added

errr? I simply commented on a BBC atticle that is published online?
You are absolutely right this is not about India or Pakistan and i never brought that issue up?
i paraphrased the following link

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4683073.stm
Experts like Burhanuddin Hasan, former Director of Pakistan Television, stress that the overwhelming majority of Pakistan’s madrassas are moderate and provide education to students who otherwise would not have the opportunity.

“But since they are taught neither English nor Science, they risk becoming complete misfits in modern Pakistani society,” he argues.

Mr Grey Area, I do not think that i did anything illegal, I am also simply trying to understand why such people would do this and why mdrassahs may be a problem. It has nothig to do with me being an Indian and i would appreciate it if you would not assume as much the next time.

Thi is about the 54 dead.

1. Il-102
2. F-8 Crusader
3. F-84 Thunderstreak
4. J29 Tunnan
5. A-7 Corsair II
6. F-4C Phantom
7. HAL Tejas (LCA)
8. Fiat G-91 Gina
9. EE Lightning
10. MiG-23 fighter variants
11. MiG-21MF and bis
12. Harrier GR Mk1 / AV-8A
13. Blackburn Buccaneer
14. Yak-141 Freestyle
15. Hawk 200 series

🙁 The LCA is clearly better looking that the MiG-23 come on :dev2:

http://pib.nic.in/release/release.asp?relid=9172

IAF only shows “interest” on purchasing LCA, not an order.

There are certain people bent on twisting what is goig on here.

Everyone knows that no contract has been signed for procurement of the LCA as it is still in the development stage, the IAF had stated however that it would procure x number of planes initially and this has not changed. People should remember that GE engine talks for around 40 have already concluded long ago with a green signa to India from Uncle Sam.