crobatoI am guessing that is a rangefinding radio receiver pod similar to TAS or Russian AK-9, that is used to find targets for passive ARMs. It may look from this point of view that China may have terminated their Kh-31P look alike, and decided to pack ARM functionality into the YJ-83 body. No doubt it will be slower but will pack a lot more range.This also suggests the use of pre-brief methods of acquiring targets rather than direct line of sight or target opportunity (fly the missile over the suspected area, then activate seeker to lock).
crobatoNice video. Allot cool stuff! Downloaded it already! About 19.2 MB
PS: Crobs, still can’t access CDF 🙁
PPS: xinhui, if you are anywhere around here, can you inform us with the CDF situation?
I watched the video but where do you download a copy?
As for the CDF, I have it open right now as I type this.
crobatoPretty good video, quite sharp too. Motherloads of information.
That JH-7 is certainly firing a Kh-31P, but I believe the missile is a Chinese copy of it rather than the original. It is uncertain who is testing who, by I believe based on the markings on the missile, that it is the missile itself being tested, not the plane.
Loads of J-11B pics, confirming the numbers 523 and 525. Along with a seperate picture for 524, establishes at least three of the yellow J-11B prototypes exist, not counting the finished grey plane. One of the clips showed the plane carrying bombs.
A scene of the J-10 showed a configuration that is like this: 3 tanks, one center, two in the wings, PL-8 on the two outerboard pylons, 250kg bombs on the four fuselage points, plus a rack with two 250kg bombs on the mid wing point, a total of 8 250kg bombs.
crobatoSince canards reduce the max potential lift of the main wing due to their trailing wake over it also they tend to carry more weight than the typical tailplane since the wing on a tailplane design operates at its max potential lift
This is completely wrong. A canard delta can be carefully designed to minimize wake, which by the way is over the main wing and not under it. If its over the main wing it simply does not affect lift. Period. Canards are not in the same plane as the main wing, they are above it.
Look at the Rafale, J-10, Lavi, and Gripen, and all have diehdral canards, while the main wing is either straight or anhedral. From the front view, this creates an X like profile. Because the canards are canted upwards from the tip, the wake goes to the top, while the wings are straight or canted downwards.
Turbelence only affects the yaw stabiilty of the aircraft which is why these planes have large rudders. As a matter of fact, the canards also create vortices over the main wing, and these low pressure areas add to the lift..
crobatoIs the video working? I can’t get something out of it.
CDF is now up by the way.
crobatoOff topic again.
Japanese like Korean, is related Altai-Tungusic language families that include Manchurian, Mongolian and Turkic. But Japanese differs in the way words are pronounced, since the way they pronounce things have very little in the way other Altaic and Tungusic languages are spoken. In fact, Japanese by phonetics alone is closest to the Austroasiatic languages in the Pacific (aka. Malaysian, Filipino, Polynesian) even though grammatically they’re not related. Yet, Japanese language has particles similar to Pacific languages, such as ka, na, ba.
So Japanese actually has an odd place in linguistics study. Its quite likely that early in its history, it was visited by sea farers coming from the south.
Chinese belong to a language family called Sino-Tibetan. In other words, the closest relative is Tibetan. Beyond this family, oddly, the closest would be the languages in the Caucasian mountains and Urals. There may have been more members of this family, but then time may have crushed such developments and eventually got absorbed into the main Han proper. Recently, there was a stunning discovery of a third Sino-Tibetan language related to the Xin Xia dynasty that once ruled north of Sichuan in the area of the Gansu/Shaaxi region. The Xin Xia, along with the Jin and the Song, were the three dynasties that existed during the Mongol invasion, and the Xi Xia were wiped out by the Mongols.
The discovery implies that one time, in earlier history, there may have been more Sino-Tibetan languages, not just dialects of the Han language, but true cousins of the same family, now extinct.
The Han language wasn’t unified until Qin imiplemented reforms. That means during the Warring States period, people were speaking with distinctively different dialects or even languages.
Yet another discovery is how Sino-Tibetan may have been influenced by Indo-European languages. The discovery of Tocharian scripts—an Indo-European language—right in areas regarded as the heart of ancient Chinese civlization.
BTW, the main Korean religion is Indian in origin, though obtained via China, & don’t forget that a large proportion of Koreans are Christian now.
The dominant form of Buddism in Korea is Son, which in China is Chan and in Japan, as Zen. They are all the same, Buddism is very strict and the lineage is well documented, so they know who thought who thought who and who thought who by generations and centuries. This documentation is to assure the canon of the teachings won’t be corrupted and can only come with direct lineage from the masters. We will just call it Zen Buddism for short.
Chan or D’Chan Buddism was originated by Dharma, an Indian monk, who travelled to China. He settled on a temple that would become the Shaolin Temple in Heibei. The influence of Indian martial arts to Chinese Kung Fu is also attributed to Bodhi Dharma for the same reason. Mixing Taoist concepts, Zen Buddish became the mainstream Buddist school in China, then directly transmitted to Korea and Japan—again through a strict trail of teachers and masters of teaching heritage that can only directly be traced to Bodhi Dharma himself.
But in other countries, Monastic Buddism is practiced in South East Asia, while Tibet follows an extreme form of Buddism called Apocalyptic Buddism or Vajrayana (as in Vajra = Diamond thunderbolt).
In Japan, Zen Buddism is the main school, but there are other fringe schools as well, that were indigenous or imported from China before those schools died out in the mainland. Among them are the Shingon and Nichiren (Lotus Sutra), and Buddist sects that mix Buddism with Shinto (animistic) beliefs. The Shinto-Buddist hybrids are along the same path as Tibetan Buddism which also mixed the animistic beliefs into Buddism, in the same sense they are apocalyptic, and do actually try to practice true mysticism.
crobatoPilot ineptitude or different tactics do not mean the Fulcrum is less agile, the canadians who flew in the MiG-29 said the MiG-29 is not inferior to the F-18, in fact it is more agile, the only thing they said the MiG-29 in the 1980s was inferior in avionics
How can the RMAF be inept, eh? They fly both Hornet and Fulcrum, and you bet they have far more experience with the Fulcrum than the Canadians. From the RMAF exercises, the Fulcrums don’t try to turn with Hornets in close in fights. The RMAF happens to be a very well trained and professional force, which exercises with the RAAF and other Commonwealth air forces.
crobatoLooks double life? how can looks certify double life
The engine is certified for 1500 to 2000 hours MTBO. That’s double the AL-31F.
Buying means arms length transaction.
It does not matter, they’re still buying F-16s. They are not buying MiG-29s.
Mission availability depends on spares and support and which was breakup after initially after Soviet collapse. M2K has more crashes than MIG-29 when consider the overall numbers. Any way they are upgrading MIG-29 with sign contract for engine and avionics. and they are still dithering with M2K upgrade contract.
Lol, because they have no choice. France has already disbanded the M2K production line and wants India to buy Rafales. With no choice left, India had to upgrade their MiG-29s, but that wasn’t their original and favored choice, which is to acquire more of the Mirage 2000s. Russia tried every bait to make India buy more MiG-29s other than the limited allotment of MiG-29Ks, and I guess literally tied in exchange to Pakistan’s RD-93 acquisition.
so all those Israeli/Egyptian/Turk/Sk F-16s in 80s-90s that were bought were second hand? Warsaw pact countries even dont have that much money for defence. very little is left after salaries.
These are all first hand. As for Warsaw Pact countries, they’re still buying F-16s like the Poles, and Gripens like the Czechs and Hungarians. Others are not looking at MiG-29 upgrades either.
Give me example of Buying in Warsaw pact countries. Not those offsets/Lease agreements.
I gave you the above. Now tell me which Warsaw Pact country is buying new MiG-29s?
crobatothere is big difference between 400hrs and 4000hr as compared to 4000hr and 6000hrs. u can see for real world examples when 10% reduction in thrust resulted in 400hr increase in life. Similar is F-16 case from Lockheed. Flanker/Flcrums aerodynamics are so good that 4000hrs engine is fine for them. it is the same old engine with which IAF MIG-29 beat M2K.
Must be complete nonsense. There is no 4000 hour life engien for the Flanker and Fulcrum. And in the IAF, the MiG-29 does not beat the M2K, which was the original front runner, and the plane the MRCA specification was originally concieved for.
Maybe one should ask the RMAF. In their own exercises, their Fulcrums try to stay away from a close turn in dogfight against Hornets because they know which plane can turn tighter.
crobatoless daunting task? I am sure u have now no understanding of engines. what is TWR of WS-10 and response time. It looks another cheap indigenous project.
Yet it looks like the engine has double the life of AL-31F.
which are those countries?
Pretty much much of the former Warsaw Pact.
and still they call them reliable because it represents what is stated. No breakdowns in the middle or costly mid life dates. and M2K was bomb truck and MIG-29 like MIG-21 is airdefence fighter.
Sorry, but M2KC can still be used as a fighter and MiG-29 as a bomb truck. The Indians use M2KC in air to air in exercises and MiG-29 has provisions for rocket pods and bombs. All you have to do is check the Indian records for the M2K mission availability and generation rates compared to MiG-29s.
F-16s were given to them. they didnot bought it. MIG-29 upgrade to 4+ generation will cost them there own pocket money.
Lol. The Poles bought their F-16s. Who would be stupid to give it them? These are brand new Block 52 plus.
u make me laugh. Do u think if those countries dont buy F-16/Gripen will they get EU Aid or US money? These are poor countries interms of defence budget.
You are the one who makes me LAUGH. You are so in la la land you must be living in a different dimension.
How many former Warsaw Pact countries are buying MiG-29 updates or new MiG-29s? How many of them are moving into Gripens or F-16s? How many F-16 users are moving to MiG-29?
crobatoJapan is different, they do borrow some things from China like the characters.. but they use them differently, and they often use their own way of pronouncing things. Like the word for Great in Chinese is Da or Dai. In Korean it is Dae, but in Japanese it is Oo. very different. the Japanese also can say Dai but they almost always use Oo. the
Offtopic alert.
When it comes to Sino-Japanese linguistics, do not make the often frequent mistake of comparing kanji onyomi raadings to the current Mandarin Chinese. The current Chinese language we know and often referred to as Mandarin, only became the official spoken language of the Chinese when Kublai Khan established Beijing as the capital, and the Ming later enforced it. But then for centuries before this the body of Kanji readings in the Japanese language have long been formed.
The first body of readings that entered the Japanese language is called Go-on. Go-on is basically derived from the Wu dialect still spoken in the Shanghai-Ningbo region. In ancient times, this is the seat of the Wu kingdom, where Sun Tzu lived, and the kingdom was autonomous during the Warring States and the Three Kingdoms period, where it is one of the Three Kingdoms. The Wu is noted for its navy. The readings may have arrived in Japan as early as Han Dynasty to the Three Kingdoms period.
The Wu dialect is like a dinosaur in the sense that of all the dialects, currently reflects closest to the pre-Han form of the language. “Go” is actually the gutterization of “Ngo” which is actually should be how the kingdom’s name is actually pronounced during ancient times, before denasalization of the word turns it into “Wu”. For that reason, Go-On or Wu readings is also referred to as Wa-on.
An example of Go-on is the word for man or person, which is -Nin. In mandarin, this is -Ren. Nin is also how its called in the Wu dialect.
The second form of kanji is called Kan-on or Han readings. In order to correct the corruption of Chinese readings, the Japanese emperor sent scholars to the capital of the Tang Dynasty, Chang’an, currently Xian. These scholars literally brought back readings that were in effect, the dialect of the capital of the Tang Dynasty. Tang soundings of words are still preserved in Hokkien, Hakka, and Cantonese dialects.
A good example of Kan-on, based on “man” above, would be -Jin. Somehow, Go-on was never eliminated so as a result, Go-On and Kan-On continued to exist side by side even today to bedevil your average Japanese student.
So the “n-” sounds are Go-On, “j-” sounds are kan-on. To modern Chinese, it’s now “r-“. Today, the name of Japan is pronounced like “re-pen” in modern Chinese, but in Wu, “sun’ is “ni”, and in Tang, “sun” is “ji” or “ja”. Cantonese pronounces it as Yat-bun, “J” and “Y” sounds being related since Europeans pronounce the two letters similarly (“Jawohl!”). The word “Ni-Pon” is actually a Go-On reading. Ji-pon or Ja-pon/Ya-pon would have been how the Tang called Japan. As the Tang dialects were preserved with the Southern Chinese who were sea farers, the Europeans picked this up, and ultimately led to how Japan is called.
There is a third reading that seeped into the Japanese language and this is Tou-On. But this represents a small minority of readings and reflect the post-Ming period of Chinese pronounciation.
Modern Chinese also lost what is called the -p, -t, -k endings of Ancient Chinese, which is still preserved in Japanese and southern Chinese dialects.
For example, the word for “1”.
In Ancient Chinese, this is “It”. This is still pronounced among dialects.
In modern Chinese, the “-T” is dropped, so it becomes “I”
In Japanese. “-t” endings become “-chi”, so it becomes “ichi”.
I won’t go into this any further. All this stuff I learned from someone trying to recreate Ancient Chinese by looking at what you may call as linguistic “fossils” still embeded in modern languages.
crobatoAny source for this? there is not a single aircraft flying with. or we should now start assuming lab tests.
It is in static tests. That shows the engine is not too far away, considering its a far less daunting project than the WS-10A which has gone into serial production and being used in J-11Bs.
and western counterparts have that great reputation.? U can buy two new MIGs for just upgrading price of Old M2K and F-16. u dont see that cost of long life.
And yet many countries prefer to buy more expensive F-16 and M2K, and they know it will cost them more to maintain MiG-29s in the long run.
300 to 400 for Soviet era engines. Infact the German called it extremely reliable. just look at F-16 vs MIG-29 crashes or M2K vs MIG-29 crashes.
And this has Nothing to do with what was offered in 90s. and Poles are still flying MIG-29 and those F-16s u can consider as handouts. With Russia either u buy on Cash or natural resources. There is no such thing as investment offsets.
What German called it reliable? They have to downgrade engine thrust by 10% to gain more life out of it. In Karhil, the Indians got a lot more missions out of the Mirage 2000 than they did with the MiG-29, hence why the M2000 was their original front runner on their MRCA contract. That does not sound very good. Poles are not upgrading their MiG-29s, they have already gone and bought Block 52plus F-16s. Former Warsaw Pact countries are either going Gripen or F-16, not upgrading their MiG-29s. Sorry to bust your bubble, but the truth hurts.
crobatoSouth Korea a bit alarmed. Another potential market?
Analysis: South Korea alarmed at Japan’s stealth fighter plans
By Lee Jong-Heon
UPI Correspondent
http://wpherald.com/articles/4535/1/Analysis-South-Korea-alarmed-at-Japans-stealth-fighter-plans/Would-have-worlds-second-biggest-air-force.html
SEOUL — Alarmed by Japan’s move to acquire U.S. F-22 stealth fighters, South Korea has hinted it would also seek to procure the future generation fighter jets to cope with any possible security jitters.
Japan is aggressively pushing for the purchase of 100 F-22 “Raptors,” which cost $200 million per unit, saying the fighter aircraft is necessary to combat Chinese air force expansion and North Korean missile threats.
Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe is expected to raise the arms deal issue during his summit with U.S. President George W. Bush this week, according to diplomatic sources.
U.S. law forbids the export of the F-22, nicknamed the “dream fighter jet,” to protect its technology. But Congress seems ready to change the law to lift the ban and the Bush administration already has expressed its willingness to negotiate with Tokyo over the sale of the stealth fighters.
If Japan obtains up to 100 F-22s, it will have the world’s second-biggest air force and dominate the skies over the Korean peninsula and China; their operational radius extends as far as 2,000 kilometers, South Korean defense officials and analysts say.
Considered as the most advanced air-superiority fighter in the world, the F-22, built by Lockheed Martin, is equipped with an active, electronically scanned radar for cruise missile detection and is capable of evading advanced air defenses to bomb ballistic missile launch sites.
Indicating the arms deal is near at hand, Japan and the United States conducted joint air force drills on Friday involving a squadron of F-22 stealth fighters temporally deployed at Kadena Air Base in Okinawa.
Japan’s push for the F-22 aircraft has sparked security concerns in South Korea, which has already slipped in the regional arms race amid lingering threats from nuclear-armed North Korea.
On Friday, Seoul’s Defense Minister Kim Jang-soo hinted that his country would review its plan to buy F-15 aircraft to seek to acquire more advanced F-22 models. Under a 2002 deal, South Korea is now procuring 40 F-15 jets from U.S. aerospace giant Boeing and is expected to purchase 20 more F-15 jets to replace its aging fleet of F-4 Phantom IIs.
In a press conference, Kim said South Korea would introduce the fifth generation fighter jets such as the U.S.-built F-22 and F-35.
“With a bigger budget Japan can buy these aircraft, but we can’t at this time. But I agree that we have to possess sufficient numbers of aircraft that are equivalent to it,” Kim said. “For the time being, our plan is to acquire F-15 class fighters, but we will introduce the fifth generation fighters at some point. We will make a decision after considering various factors such as the military power balance around the Korean peninsula and overall relations with the United States and North Korea.”
Asked about the aftermath of Japan’s purchase of F-22 jets, Kim said: “The U.S. Congress has yet to make a decision on whether to lift the ban. We will have to look at its decision.”
crobatofull of mixed signals.
World Updates
April 28, 2007
EXCLUSIVE – U.S. arms-sale chief discounts F-22 sale to Japan
By Jim Wolf
WASHINGTON (Reuters) – The top U.S. government arms-sale official on Friday all but dismissed prospects for supplying the United States’ premier fighter jet to Japan or Israel, even if a sale is cleared by Congress.
Designing an export version of Lockheed Martin Corp.’s radar-evading F-22 Raptor could cost more than $1 billion and be “prohibitively expensive” for any would-be foreign buyer, said Air Force Lt. Gen. Jeffrey Kohler, head of the Pentagon’s Defense Security Cooperation Agency.
“If (export) were to be considered, which it’s not, it essentially would have to be redesigned, rebuilt, retested and then go into production,” Kohler, who oversees government-to-government arms sales, told Reuters in a brief interview.
The issue matters to Lockheed and its F-22 partners — Boeing Co. and United Technologies Corp.’s Pratt & Whitney unit — because overseas sales could extend the production line beyond 2011, when the last of the 183 Raptors currently planned is due to be sent to the U.S. Air Force.
Any redesign, Kohler said, would require degrading the aircraft’s capabilities and making them tamper-proof to keep the technology exclusive — a process he said would take years.
“This airplane was built to give us an edge way into the future, and that’s why it’s not exportable.”
Japanese military officials are eyeing the F-22, the U.S. Air Force’s primary air superiority fighter, as part of their response to growing regional missile threats, among other things.
The first F-22 overseas deployment was to Kadena Air Base on Okinawa, Japan, this year. Twelve are still in the region. The aircraft goes for $136 million per copy, not including development costs.
“BECOMING COMPELLING”
“I’m aware the Japanese are interested in the F-22,” Gen. Peter Pace, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, said in an April 17 interview with Aviation Week & Space Technology magazine. “I’m also aware of our concerns about what we export and don’t export in our high-end technology.
“We’re committed to the defense of Japan, so we’ll work our way through it,” Pace said, according to an official transcript. “I think we all need to be concerned about both ballistic and cruise missile defense.”
Loren Thompson, an analyst close to the Pentagon and to military contractors, discounted Kohler’s comments as having been overtaken by senior Air Force officials’ latest thinking.
“Strategic reasons for sharing the plane are becoming compelling,” including cruise missile defense, said Thompson, of the Arlington, Virginia-based Lexington Institute, a research firm.
Another motivating factor, he said, is a belief that Japan may be willing to fund development of a new version that would be more of a bomber.
Israel is also widely reported to have shown interest in acquiring the F-22, which entered the U.S. combat fleet in December 2005, 20 years after it was conceived to battle Soviet MiG fighters over Europe.
As a prelude to exports, the U.S. Congress would have to lift a decade-old ban on overseas sales of the F-22, which features fuel-efficient supersonic speed and integrated electronic brains that could help defeat cruise missiles.
The ban was enacted to make sure the United States kept its technological edge. But the reported interest of Japan and Israel has fueled talk of reversing the law.
Dennis Wilder, senior director for East Asian Affairs on the White House National Security Council staff, told reporters this week that the Bush administration is “very positively disposed to talking to the Japanese about future-generation fighter aircraft.
“Whether it’s going to be one model or another of aircraft is an open question at this point,” he said on Wednesday, ahead of talks between President Bush and Prime Minister Shinzo Abe of Japan which may have included the issue.
Kohler told Reuters the U.S. intent was to supply Lockheed Martin’s next-generation F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, due to be available for export in about 2015.
Joseph Quimby, a spokesman for Lockheed’s F-22 program, said, “Any discussions pertaining to foreign sales of the F-22 are the province of the U.S. government.”
Copyright © 2007 Reuters
crobatoa picture of engine does not qualify it operational.
No, but it is in late testing stage.
Not good reputation based on what? 95% of more than 1000 operational MIG-29s are using the same 80s era engine while western counterparts have went through costly midlife update programs several times which costs more than the engine.
All these planes did nothing but give a bad reputation with all the countries flying it when compared to the Western aircraft they also possessed.
750 hr MTBO is pretty good for the price and i doubt Western counterpats goes more than this anyway in practice. otherwise u will not see all those contracts going to PW and GE or simply aircrafts are retired from front line service after 15 years.
750hr MTBO is horrible, and in actuality, it is the AL-31F that achieves that and the RD-33 does considerably lower (300 to 400hrs). PW and GE gets all the contracts related to the planes whose engines they supply. A lot of MiG-29s especially in the former Eastern block isn’t even being upgraded, but replaced by F-16s. Ask the Poles.
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