I think its worth noting the terrific achievement of getting the aircraft back in the air, through the time as a flying billboard for Red Bull, and up to recent ownership, and repair after the landing accident. Two individuals have been responsible for the whole endeavour, Gwyn Jones as the instigator, and Julian Jones for keeping it going. It has always been operated with a simple dignity; with no threats should funding dry up.

Lets hope it can continue. I wonder how many engines they have left!!

Bruce

Let’s not forget Paul Kingsbury (PK) who has done a magnificent job of keeping her airworthy.

Fly Navy Heritage Trust = FNHT (not RNHT). As distinct from Royal Navy Historic Flight (RNHF). Which isn’t Naval Aviation Limited (NAL). The subtle differences between these three entities should be understood – who owns and operates what – before making assumptions or posting comments that might mislead.

And it’s Sea Hawk, not Seahawk. :eagerness:

My comments; not those of others.

Just saying!

Oh not this old chestnut again!

Firstly, let me say that these are my own views, not necessarily those of anyone else.

Operating a SHAR? No. Why? Money; training burden; support infrastructure (the original Design Authorities for both the airframe and engine no longer provide support – one reason why the SHAR hasn’t been entertained by the UK CAA); and, as one ex-SHAR pilot once pithily admitted, the crew room isn’t big enough for the pilot’s ego 😀

Sea Hawk: She always did require many more maintenance man hours per flying hour. When with CU Stn Flt she was their only historic type (if you discount Sea Princes!) and back then it was a different era with lots of spare manpower. She didn’t actually fly that often once transferred to Yeovilton – largely for the aforementioned maintenance burden issue – and in fact I think she has probably flown more in the past decade than she did during the 1980s. She has had well-documented issues: jet pipe acoustic cracking (which was usual in service, too, but back then they had lots of spares) and starters over-speeding and tripping out (now sorted). But it must be remembered that with the exception of the Sea Fury and Chipmunk, these aircraft have unique engines. WV908 has the world’s only Nene 103 engine (and yes, it’s a fair bit different to a T-33) and the Fish have (currently) the only flight-worthy Pegasus in the world. And the Centaurus is a particularly fiendish engine to sort out when things do need sorting out.

But arguably the biggest stumbling block these days is the dreaded red tape. Haddon-Cave and Nimrod have had a profound effect on military aviation over the past few years (let’s not forget that these are still military-registered aircraft) and more and more time and effort is taken up in carrying out mandated safety assessments and the like. That’s not such a bad thing, of course: safety is always paramount. But jumping through – and perhaps more importantly proving that you’ve jumped through – these hoops takes time, effort and money. Why do other military-registered vintage aircraft operators not appear to have the same issues, I hear you ask? Of course they do; but arguably they have much more in the way of manpower and infrastructure thrown at them.

It’s a constantly changing state of affairs but believe me, the guys involved at the coal face are determined to see these aeroplanes fly. And they will. But the best way to support them in that quest in the meantime is to support those aeroplanes that they currently have. The Fly Navy Heritage Trust’s website has details of how to do that.

I reiterate, these are MY views and I don’t propose to add anything more which might prolong the debate unnecessarily but felt compelled to comment.

Lee

50 years ago today, 28th May 1964 the museum opened its doors for the first time, as they say the rest is history

BobT

And the cake was nice, too!:eagerness:

I managed to find a photo in the end. It’s now in the book (still available!)…

The Air Britain series on serials is restricted to RAF aircraft, but they did publish a tome by Ray Sturtivant and Mick Burrow called Fleet Air Arm Aircraft 1939-45 which gives as full a history as possible for each aircraft. It does not specifically identify the various means used for disposal. Otherwise this is definitely the one you want, but it is long out of print and will be expensive if you find one. There was talk about a revised edition but this has not been mentioned following the death of Ray Sturtivant.

Graham

Not so. Air-Britain are the only publisher to document the histories of every RNAS and RN aircraft since 1911 right through until 2011, not to mention other forms of aircraft such as UAVs/drones etc in other titles. I think you might be referring to the series of Air-Britain register books produced by Jim Halley which are much more basic listings by serial number range.

Regarding the details of the aircraft jettisoned from the carriers, the reason that the information is not necessarily included in the book is quite simple: either it doesn’t exist (i.e. the information regarding specific serials as distinct from ‘a number of Avengers’ etc wasn’t documented at the time), or if it does then the authors have not been able to trace it yet. More likely the former than the latter.

Of course, we are always willing to be proved wrong, and to that end we would be very interested to hear of any leads that might help us put the record straight.

What documentation survived the mass cull of official records from the Hayes repository in the 1980s was eventually distributed between TNA at Kew and FAAM at Yeovilton. Very little of it was wartime and many are the rumours of the logbooks of such individuals as Esmonde being amongst the piles of sacks bulging with paperwork that Ray – and others – found on one visit, only to be told that they didn’t want them rummaging through before they were sent for destruction.

We must be thankful for what survived!

Lee

Mark,

The website is currently in the process of being migrated to the Royal Navy web to integrate with the other pages there. This is due to take complete shortly and there will be an announcement on the current site to that effect once it has happened.

It’s been a very busy winter period with lots of things happening behind the scenes. Watch out for a certain magazine soon for further info!

The FB.11 progresses. As you say, it’s been over a year since those first engine runs, but there have inevitably been some shake-down engine runs needed – it was, after all, a complete engine rebuild – 2013 was an incredibly busy season what with the 70th anniversary of the BoA and the commitments of the other aircraft, and also she’s had some special mods fitted which have taken time to sort out as they’ve never been fitted to a Sea Fury before.

Keep a look out for that new website….and a ‘certain’ magazine! 😉

All the best

Lee

Hi guys

I know lee Howard often posts on the forum, but does anybody know what’s happening with the sea fury?? I see it’s only down as Static at the yeovilton air day??? It’s been nearly a year since the engine has been fitted.

Hopefully just a paperwork issue, but would be nice to see it back on the circuit.

Also, does the RNHF site not get updated any more???

Cheers

Mark

Wasp helicopters?

Fleet Air Arm Helicopters since 1943 : Air-Britain (Historians) Ltd 2011 Howard/Burrow/Myall. 😉