Though it might better suit in another topic…

Fighter Jet Deal May Be Put Off
(Source: Aftenposten; issued April 18, 2008)

Just 10 days before the bidding deadline, Norwegian finance minister Kristin Halvorsen has said maybe the country’s old planes can be upgraded, pushing the planned purchase contract into the future.

This comes after the competing companies, Lockheed Martin of the US and Saab of Sweden, have used millions of dollars in marketing their respective concepts, and prepared thousands and thousands of pages of documents to support their bids.

Lockheed Martin is vying for the contract with its Joint Strike Fighter proposal, while Saab is putting forth its JAS Gripen, which it claims it can deliver for a far lower price than Lockheed’s offer. Sweden’s bidding is thought to be hindered by the country not being a member of NATO.

The bidding process so far has been fraught with controversy. The European consortium offering its Eurofighter withdrew as a result of alleged favouritism towards the Americans.

“We need to consider the costs to upgrade the fighter jets we have, so that they can be used for some years longer, or if we should go for more investment now. If we go for new investment, we must consider the price, and the quality, of the different choices,” said Finance Minister Halvorsen.

When asked if this means a postponement of the new fighter plane project, Halvorsen answered: “It’s a real possibility.”

She added: “It depends on how much it costs to upgrade the F-16s to the standard we need, how long they will hold up in quality, and the costs of this against those of buying new airplanes.”

posted by Georg Mader JDW correspondend at airpower.at forums

TMor,

Your list of squadrons is, I think, the list assuming a full 294 aircraft buy (232 for the air force and 60 for the navy).

If you want eight 20-aircraft squadrons, you need to be able to sustain 160 aircraft available over an extended period, so you need extra aircraft to cover inevitable attrition, aircraft undergoing conversion or major maintenance, trials aircraft, aircraft bailed back to industry etc.

232 aircraft will support an eight-squadron 180 aircraft force. Nine or ten squadrons would require rather more. (The RAF based its 232 aircraft Typhoon buy on a seven-squadron, 137 aircraft force, but expect a longer service life than the AdlA assume).

You might assume that if the AdlA are prepared to list eight Rafale squadrons at this stage, then they believe they have a realistic chance of getting all 232 aircraft. That seems pretty brave, when only 120 have been ordered.

When do they need to order the next batch to avoid a production gap? Or have long lead items already been ordered?

Not want to nitpick but it’s for 234 aircraft ;). The 4th batch should be ordered later this year or early next year.

So what was the M88-3 upgrade for again? Was it a thrust uprating or something else?

M88-3 was meant to provide a 20% thrust increasment. A demonstrator has been tested for the first time in February 2005. Meanwhile Snecma is testing the M88-2ECO. This engine includes new hardwarecomeponents and can optionally deliver 20% more thrust at same life cycle or increase life time at current thrust levels. Any M88-2 can be retrofitted with the new components. In the last Rafale news thread TMor posted some more up to date info on M88-2 on the last page or so.

Don’t forget the F-18 that shot down the F-22 with the APF-79 Radar.

Lol there was no “shot down with APG-79”. There was a single situation were a Super Hornet pilot broke the rules and got a simulated gun shot, this was at very close range the radar didn’t mattered.

but the pic is not dated. and those are the Su-30K/MK Flankers, not the MKIs, and they lacked IFR. so the Su-30Ks could get to Car Nicobar without any refueling ? and were’nt the Su-30K/MKs swapped for new build MKIs ? IFR capable Jag IMs with Sea Eagles are a formidable maritime strike aircraft..zipping along 10 ft ABSL, they could easily get within striking distance of any naval vessel.

All Su-30 have the refueling probe from stock Su-30/Su-30K to Su-30MKI. BTW the IFR is on the left side;) The two examples shown on the link with the various IAF aircraft are Su-30K. The type was withdrawn from service in 2005.

We’ll be wanting those D-5s back thanks. :diablo: And nationalize BAE-US, reaward the tanker competition to Boeing. . . still want to play? 😀

Well if Europe is just buying european stuff, we can easily dismiss the few orders from the US :p

What US technology is used in the Typhoon?

Mainly the GPS and AMRAAM. MIDS is also dependent on GPS. Therefore there’re some licenses which has to be purchased from the US. Though that shouldn’t be a great problem as Saudi-Arabia already operates such systems on its F-15S for example.

Was that the ARMIGER HARM replacement?

The ARMIGER demonstrator did indeed feature dual sensors (IIR+passive radar). A pitty that the system didn’t went beyond the demonstration phase.