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Malcolm McKay

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Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 1,462 total)
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  • in reply to: Why did U.S not drop atomic bomb on Berlin? #1136765
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Emphasising the western β€˜betrayal’ in the hope that Poland would forget both of the Russian invasions and occupations you mean?

    Which is precisely not what I mean and you know it.

    The original question was why didn’t the Allies nuke Berlin, and the answer was quite rightly we didn’t have the A bomb until after the Germans had surrendered. Then for some reason the thread drifted off into the idea that we might have nuked Moscow, apparently because of the Polish question.

    Europe had been at war since September 3rd 1939 because of the invasion of Poland. It had been liberated from German control by the Russians – not the best option for the Poles given the traditional mutual enmity between the two nations, going back centuries with both about level on the mutual barbarity stakes, but liberated from German control it was and there ended the originally reason for the European War. In the process the great evil of Nazism was finished as well – on a table of 1 to 10 I put it about 10 out 10 for Europe and about 8 out of 10 for the Poles.

    To suggest that having just concluded a war that cost many many millions of lives in Europe that the Allies should have then nuked Moscow, given the fact that it was the Russian army that had been the main instrument of the destruction of Nazism, whether one likes or detests Stalin, is just plain ludicrous. Even during the deepest period of distrust in the Cold War the West blanched at that prospect. As I said if we had done so in 1945 the Russians would have wiped the floor with us given the strength and fighting ability of their armed forces – they fought at a far greater ferocious intensity than our side ever mustered.

    The Polish question is not as simple as a poor inoffensive little nation being swallowed up by greedy neighbours – it is the product of many centuries of political and military actions, and why we should risk the complete loss of Europe to the Russians because of it is quite beyond me. There was no betrayal – the losses suffered by the Allies from 1939 to 1945 give the lie to that claim. In the end it came down to the fact that we could nothing more than we had.

    in reply to: Why did U.S not drop atomic bomb on Berlin? #1135979
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    I think you should read the posts properly no one has suggesting nuking Russia to save Poland.

    Read posts 13 and 16.

    in reply to: Why did U.S not drop atomic bomb on Berlin? #1135060
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Malcolm, I think Graham is right that no one has suggested nuking Russia to save Poland, and I am positive no one has done that in posts 13 and 16. I can’t speak for CADman (post 13), but I don’t think he mentioned Poland. In my post (16) I never suggested nuking anything to save anything. I personally think it would have been silly had the Americans nuked Moscow in 1945, but I would never go on say that anybody who considered this as an opion at the time was a silly person. In post 16 I just tried to suggest that perhaps you should use less arrogant terms when referring to people who did not think what you assume they should have, especially when they were in a situation somewhat less comfortable than you are now. I then tried to explain that in more plain terms in post 23, but it seems I failed. Sorry, my fault, being a foreigner I cannot express myself properly in English.

    Well why in the context of an article regarding the nuking of Berlin did people go off at a tangent and mention nuking Moscow? The only conclusion I could draw from that was that old tired Cold War attitude towards the Russian gains in Eastern Europe, as WW2 drew to a close, coming to the fore. You might never say that someone who considered nuking Moscow was a silly person – I most certainly would not hesitate to, considering the after effects for the whole world.

    in reply to: Why did U.S not drop atomic bomb on Berlin? #1135064
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Defeated the Germans, but failed to liberate Europe, we lost the war …

    Not quite – we finally “won” in 1989, if “won” is the appropriate terminology. Russia like Britain never recovered from the economic strains imposed by their role in WW2. It just took Russia longer to finally succumb.

    in reply to: Why did U.S not drop atomic bomb on Berlin? #1134887
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Sure, John. However it wasn’t a question of getting a hearing, but whether what was being said was worth listening to. I meant Patton’s military abilities were good in the war he fought. His political and social views aren’t worth wasting time on, IMHO, before or during the war. My opinion only, of course.

    Quite agree – good general but as a person a somewhat far right nut case at times. Still being slightly nuts seems to have been of some help in the military – Monty wasn’t all that sane either πŸ˜€

    in reply to: Why did U.S not drop atomic bomb on Berlin? #1133390
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    I thought that the problem was that Russia (the Soviet Union) was spending nearly 50% of GDP on defence up until the 1980s when the NATO average was 12%.

    As I said it finally succumbed die to the economic strains imposed by WW2, however this was not helped by the colossal post-war one way street of military spending engaged in by the Soviets. People tend to ignore the fact that in reality defense spending tends to be way over comparable civilian spending in terms of value for money, and essentially wasteful given the high obsolescence rate both in equipment and time terms of the product purchased. If a government wants to throw away money at prodigious rates for little return the sad truth is throw it at the military.

    in reply to: Douglas Baders tin legs #1133227
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Don’t tell the terrorists, they know we’re already onto the exploding shoes/undercrackers ploy…

    Geez did Bader have tin whatsits as well? πŸ˜€

    in reply to: What is this? #1129386
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Did the Germans pioneer EMF propulsion or what?

    Dunno, but they did do a lot of the pioneer work on how to lose wars. πŸ˜€

    in reply to: What is this? #1128668
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Did the Germans pioneer EMF propulsion or what? There is so much crap on the net about Nazi UFO’s,

    One of you “Bright Sparks” out there must know something? UH?

    Here – knock yourself out. The wonderful wacky world of the Nazis πŸ˜€

    http://www.greyfalcon.us/

    in reply to: Why did U.S not drop atomic bomb on Berlin? #1126354
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    @ comments above that the Red Army would have wiped the floor with the Western Allies forces in 1945:

    Not factually supported (avoiding to say BS). … Anyway, sandbox games …

    The West has since 1945 consistently over-estimated its role on the destruction of the Nazis. In 1944 Allied generals like Patton and Montgomery made the mistake of equating the Germans rapid withdrawal from France after the Normandy breakout with German military collapse in the west. The unfortunate truth as we found out in late 1944 in France and in 1944 and 1945 in Italy was that the Germans were a very tough nut to crack. And that sudden withdrawal was strategic not a retreat.

    I think the consensus is that in comparison with the Russian tactics of ruthless human wave advances the Western Allies simply did not have the political will to suffer the sort of casualties those tactics would entail. Further, at most only 1/3 of the German forces were engaged against the Western Allies while the remaining 2/3 were deployed against the Russians. We received a similar lesson in how ruthless tactics work in Korea when the Chinese using human wave tactics swept up the over-confident and over-extended UN forces after they got perilously close to the Yalu river – MacArthur ignored intelligence, and like Patton had an over-enthusiastic view of his military skills.

    The Russians were not a nation where the leadership was accountable to the people – Stalin had the power to use the Russian troops in whatever way he felt. If either Churchill or Roosevelt had adopted such tactics at any stage in the final year of the war the political fall out for them would have been catastrophic. The British forces were war weary with good cause, while the US forces were taking sufficient casulties due to poor training that men were being drafted out of the USAAF to fill the gaps in infantry numbers.

    As for the putative lack of artillery – the Russian tanks would have had a field day against our tanks and the Russians also had control of the air on their front. Their aircraft and fighter skills were as good as ours so we would not have had guaranteed air superiority. Our troops were by May 1945 showing all the signs of war weariness, especially the British (a fact which the British Chiefs of Staff who were asked by Churchill to draft a plan to attack the Russians to free Poland made explicit in their draft plan which just basically said that such an attack would have been suicide), but unlike the Russian troops we didn’t have the equivalent of the NKVD to ginger them up into human wave tactics. Politically neither the US nor the UK could have resorted to that.

    The fundamental point is that it was the Russians who beat the Germans not us – just because the Germans initiated the surrender with us rather than the Russians was not because we were the strongest military force but because we were the lesser of the two evils as they saw it. Our commanders, the sane ones not the insane like Patton, were well aware that they would lose a fight with the Russians. Not only in pure military terms but also in propaganda terms because since 1941 the West had been glorifying the Russians for their defiance of the Germans – turning all that propaganda on its head in 1945 to support a losing attack on Russia would have been completely inexplicable to our citizens and to the relatives of all the casualties we would have suffered.

    in reply to: westland whirlwind fighter in black paint #1117936
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Hi All,
    Just a sudden thought…
    Anyone know when the first merlin beaufighter flew.
    cheers
    Jerry

    July 1940

    in reply to: westland whirlwind fighter in black paint #1117830
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    25 Squadron had Blenheims and as we know three Whirlwinds for a short time, but moved over to the Beaufighter…

    So they might have had both types present at one point and at that time didn’t the early Whirlys have a black underneath, on the port side anyway as they were meant to be a day & night fighter…

    The early ones in service carried standard temperate scheme of Sky unders with the undersurface of the port wing in Night and Dk Earth/Dk Green uppers with Sky codes and fuselage band, as introduced for the daylight fighter ops over France after the Battle of Britain.

    in reply to: What Is The Ugliest Plane? #1103999
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again – the Armsrong Whitworth Ape.

    in reply to: Unidentified Japanese type. #1104004
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    Came across this photo in another forum, identified as an A6M, but I don’t think so – it’s a 2 seater (at least) for starters. Anyone here got any clues?

    There was, as already pointed out, a 2 seater trainer version of the Zero. That looks like one.

    in reply to: What Is The Ugliest Plane? #1101575
    Malcolm McKay
    Participant

    I had forgotten Moggy’s differentiation between plans and ‘planes. I think you can get away with ‘planes if you are an American or Canadian speaker – or is it pedantic in any case?

    What about this little fella – one flight before crashing for ever? And another Caproni!
    [ATTACH]182161[/ATTACH]

    If you look closely, there appears to be someone hiding behind it.

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 1,462 total)