I think the point about the first Black BUck raid (as related in Vulcan 607) is that the fuelling plan barely worked and was exceptional (so it was refined each time they did it after the first raid).
its not a very reliable example to base a discussion on whether P&D is better than Boom refuelling is it?
so what i’m getting at is this: what is the relationship between the japanese in service date for this requirement and the current export standard in service date for JSF?
Last time i looked at this over a year ago, the JSF was thought not to be in the running because it wouldn’t be ready in time. That situation is only more marked now (i know i could trawl through this whole topic, but I hoped someone would be able to tell me a bit quicker:))
so you think that the F35A is going to be a better A2A asset than the advanced Typhoon?
this is slack, but can you remind me of the Timescale for this requirement please? I like the F35 but i don’t see how its more advanced (in an IOC sense) than the sort of aircraft Eurofighter will export to Japan.
that is a nice anti shipping missile. I could see that being very popular amongst F35 operators.
If Japan liked the F22 it can’t have been because of any A2G capability. They must have seen it as an effective counter against Chinese air assets, and I’m not sure that the Silent Eagle beats Typhoon T3 in this regard.
just to be clear, when i said fanbase i meant “people who are followers of the programme, and support its success”.
I realised later that “fan” for some bizarre reason is a rude word on forums like this….
anyway, i think we can assume the article published by Eurofighter which Scorpion82 posted is their official view and therefore representative of what they would tell prospective customers (an action which would be to the detriment of the programme if they couldn’t back up their assertions surely?).
having said that, the rest of the magazine is essentially press realease material, some of which is totally one sided because its designed to push their product.
I really think you guys have got to drop the whole paranoid conspiracy theory thing about Jon Lake and Jackonicko. It undermines your arguement in my view…
point taken…
out of curiosity what would it take for the Rafale fanbase to chance its view (even slightly) of what Rafale did or didn’t do in the UAE?
so the only way Eurofighter could possibly win a contest is to bribe its way to victory?
I still don’t think any of us are any clearer on what happened in Al Dahfra i think i would say that an aircraft is often measured by commercial success (which in turn is linked to its capability, unless you are a potential Typhoon customer in which case you dont care about that and only look to line your own pockets…?).
Now that we are out of the Cold war (re Mig21 and Phantom) i think we have to take commercial success seriously.
“Fortunately sales numbers are a better indicator than unofficial sources.”
cheap shot i know, but it remains an effective point until the UAE are so reassured by Rafale’s world dominance that they place an order with Dassault.
interesting but we are just back to the position of a commercial source against a government source with conflicting commercial intererests.
It is a counter arguement though and it seems facile to just poo poo it, if that is the official Eurofighter view.
They assert that their aircraft is superior in several areas, and will no-doubt have to prove such assertions to potential customers….
Otherwise, all Eurofighter have is a product which they say is fantastic but no-one would buy?
?
i’m agog!:eek:
this is beyond painful, but the Super Tucano is a fantastic aircraft…
In spanish is Malvinas, so….also in spanish is Londres not London. This looks like a teenager brawl.
well on the basis that Argentina is unable to retake the Falklands by force, the whole thing is going to resemble a teenage brawl for the foreseable future.:D
with regard to the LCA, i have always been underwhelmed by it, even if it is full of european systems… its not a real aircraft (the only two real aircraft in discussion here are the F35 and the Rafale), and the RN has committed to one of those.
I remember having a similar discussion about navalised Typhoon 4 years ago when the F35 was far far less mature, and look where we are now.
I think its one thing to have British made systems shoe-horned into an aircraft and totally another to ditch any British input in the aircraft’s build and design.
if we are talking fantasy, then a mix of British stealthy UCAV and Navalised Typhoon Tranche 4 is mine thanks!:D
Oooh i’ve come over all funny!
even for an article on an “english language” website, that is bad.
Its a rehash of old stories and bias, i wouldn’t worry too much.
There is a reason why EADS is leading the MRCA campaign and not BAE (i can think of a few but i’m not sure of the official one:D)
I do think the F16 is out of the running because its not cutting edge and is only slightly better than the F16 Pakistan is getting.
Can’t think why any rehash of a legacy design would win to be honest.
please don’t take this the wrong way, but I don’t think its the case that the F35 is being cancelled. I seem to be on my own here.
If you look at the overall reliance on the F35 that the UK Government is putting in its plans for the RAF, its a certainty that they will procure it.
Putting that to one side, how on earth can it make sense to buy a half developed indian light fighter for which BAE has no input?
i would genuinely be please for Rafale if it makes a sale, its been such a long time!
but the details of how the deal has been secured are certainly not something to worry about, it would be fantastic business for france (and a great buy for Brazil) if they end up with such a fantastic mix of advanced fighters!
This couldn’t have worked even 2 years ago. Its fate:D