And look what appeared on Ebay…

AVRO VULCAN NOSE RADOME item #5668404732 (£45)

Sadly, it is often the case that councils are ‘encouraged’ by potential developers and we’d best not delve too deeply into that worm-pot. I know of two developments on conservation sites that should never have happened – but the developers had enough ‘sway’ to get what they want. (Holiday in the sun while you consider our proposal sir?).

So, hundreds of letter have been received about GAM and it hasn’t helped. There are no guarantees but the more you can send, the more chance you have. If those enthusiasts and more had been organised, the council may have needed a larger mail room. If you never try – you’ll never know.

If the councillors are making planning decisions on anything other than planning issues they should be dismissed from the committee.

Sadly, in the real world this isn’t always the case.

The way forward is to describe the role & aims your society is to have and how best it can relate to existing bodies. Figure out how to fund it. How to spend those funds and then poll for membership everywhere you can. We all have precious spare time so keep it simple, take advantage of technologies such as the ‘net and forums such as this. And then let those voices be heard!

The BAPC is an umbrella organisation . I cannot see it needing to be a society to save every Vulcan that is about to be scrapped!

I never suggested that. However if, for example, Blackpool Council/HLF/Whoever had received letters/emails from a thousand enthusiasts asking that the nose/cockpit be preserved and that there were (are) a bunch of volunteers willing to take care of it, they can hardly ignore it.

By all means promote preservation in whatever way but the reality is that the BAPC works well for it’s members – individual members can join – if you form a group or society by all means . The BAPC is not there for individual owners who wish to restore something and then sell it on when they get bored with it – hence why the group or society membership is favoured.

The point is – there are bucketloads of individuals out there who, if organised, could make a huge difference and make the work of the BAPC et al a lot easier. I think you’ll also find that the real enthusiasts are not in this game to make money – and many in fact never truly see themselves as owners of an aircraft but merely as custodians. I work with a group on the Jetstream project – great. But I’m on my own with my Sea Hawk. How can the BAPC help me? How can I help them? I’ve made many more friends and contacts through work with the Sea Hawk, and that is all wasted.

As for the website – do not by any means consider that the BAPC is doing nothing because the website isn’t updated! The membership and ‘updaters’ are more than likely doing something connected with preservation not talking about what they have done!

I never said the BAPC isn’t doing anything either but educating the public is vital in order to obtain their support (vocal and financial) and so maybe the BAPC should be telling everyone what they are doing.

I’ve spoken to a few like-minded enthusiasts and they all see the BAPC as something of a ‘corporate’ entity. The enthusiast on the ground is a large and valuable resource that is being horribly wasted. I really think we either need a simple society for enthusiasts or suggest to the BAPC that they need to change to accommodate them.

I’ll state this once: I know we cannot preserve anything with a roundel on it, even my dog understands that. But then I also don’t agree with the attitude that one restored example of an aircraft is sufficient either. A Concorde at somewhere like the excellent Brooklands museum is of little use to people living in Scotland. An enthusiast will travel, Joe Public won’t and we need Joe Public on our side.

It is obvious that you are very pro-BAPC and I’m not knocking them. What I and other are saying is that more is available – a lot more. US.

I think XN923 sums it up nicely there. The BAPC doesn’t seem to be geared up to accommodate the individual enthusiasts (maybe it should!) and a quick look at their web site hardly shows them as being too active. (Under Construction – dated Oct 2004).

There exists a nationwide network of enthusiasts who, acting as individuals, seldom achieves more than to complain on forums like this one that another aircraft has become saucepans. This is a huge wasted resource. If we all got together we’d have the power to make a difference. Whether we do this by forming a new society or by having an existing organisation like the BAPC change to accomodate us – I don’t know. It is certainly worth exploring.

The internet has provided us with a quick and easy way to spread news, contact people and organise ourselves. I think we should be taking more advantage of it. As a widespread group of individuals without the often cumbersome mechanics of a large organisation – can move quickly. There has to be something in this.

If every enthusiast who bought an aviation mag donated a fiver per year and 4 hours labour per year that would be about £150,000 to put into the preservation fund and about 38 man years of free labour!! (based on about 30,000 readers?)

And I’m sure most of us would be happy to donate more than a fiver too.

The numbers add up to what could be a serious force. By simply joining such a group people would actually be doing something. Imagine an organised group of 5,000 enthusiasts approaching the HLF. You can bet your **** you’ll get a lot more attention than you do now.

And yes, there are many questions to be answered about how such a group should operate, but simply by existing it could make a world of difference.

I’ve saved two aircraft from the scrap man and I’ve also helped make another into a very viable educational tool which will hopefully ensure that aircraft has a much longer life than it would have had. If I can do that in what little spare time I have – how much could an organised bunch of us do ?

Strength is numbers is what we need. Who will start the ball rolling though? The most common of British weaknesses is to complain bitterly about something – and then do sod all about it!

Time to sue mr bateson for radiation poisoning… I always thought he was a public hazard 😉