well Just spend a weekend in Estonia where everything seems to explode in to their hands…and our proud and stubbourn cousins decided to Ban all alchohol sales in whole country….1st of May coming along with tens of thousands thirsty fins…a real nice move:diablo:

http://www.yle.fi/news/id58993.html

All hats of to estonians about the good handeling of the whole russian population proplem (thought knowing some old Estonians, I understand the bitternes…they actually have a reasons for it)
Expecially the whole Statue incident wonders me that it has been news all over the few years, but why now, as the tensions between the west and Russia are allready high, just as the Russia withdrew from the Coventional arms restriction pact…..and Then Estonians decides to do something that all participants knew that will provocate Russians into outbrust that can be really helpfull of those who wants to wage hate and tension between Russian and west.

…and Is it just convenietly coincidental that Bundesmarine Eletronical Survey ship A53 Oker was on Helsinki port trougth the weekend:confused:

They just can’t accept that the world has changed and eastern Europe…and Finland…are no longer their neutered lap dogs.

well as long as they have bigger army than we do, We remain at least petchy yard hounds to them…the summer of 1944 finally brougth sense to our rulers that the luxury to feel moral grunt over Russian adventures applyes to the guys that actually have iron to back them….and we are not in that party…

The fact that the Russians have had a fielded ABM system in place for decades, and know exactly what a limited BMD system looks like, makes no odds here to you Gollevainen?.

Not at all. All sort of hyppocrity of “we are so good and we have the rigth to defend the free west” should remain in where it fits best; Politicans election speaches. The real diplomacy should aknowlidge the rules and fact of real life and in real life if you make armour that the opponents lance cannot pierce, you can expect that the opponent would sharpen its lance-head even more…

So its naive and silly when west pose innocent and wonders russian actions when they exactly knew the Moscow reaction…

and If they didn’t, God help us all, last 60 years have teached us nothing
After the Europe is again filled with tactical nukes and fear shall hung upon us all, I will keep asking the rigth-wing nutters was it worth it till my eyes drop…

So you and other certain members of this forum should just accept that US is evil, Russia is Good and Finland is even better of those two:p
(and I will be away for until monday, so If you are expecting some sort of depate over my post, dont bother to spoil your time in typing

Superpowers are rivals no matter how much petty talks are there between.
In the event of the growing US greed for the areas that Russia sees as its own, a future sabre-clash is inevidable. Most alarming is the US insint of fielding the missile-defence system near the russian border to detect “Iranian” missiles:rolleyes:…There have already been flash in russian sector about denousing the anti-tacktical nuke treaties. Quite understandable move from russian part, It was USA that denounced the anti-ballistic missile treaty, so the snowball is already rolling….

….and quess who is in the front seat to withness it:(

been told by my missus that the Hungarian and Finnish languages have a similar origin, can you verify this.

Well they are…among Estonia, the sole language-cousins of us in the Europe…but where we can almoust understand Estonians(if listen carefully and spoken slow pace:D ) Hungarian is as clear to us as Russia is to English speakers…

But as for the russians,
poverty is one of the first thing that people (expecially from the rich west) come to deal when meeting up Russians.:( But as myself and my family havent been those who born with silver spoon in certain body part, It hasent been a proplem for me…:rolleyes:
Also, for an average fin, its a big bite to start to medle with Russian people, as I believe it is also so to Hungarian, Polish or Balts, but Its suprising how quickly those precautions disappear after the first or seccond zip from the bottle…

I bet he could have been a hell of character to share a bottle or 2 of vodka with.
Top bloke.

well any russian would:D Thats why I like ’em so much, really nice bunch of people when you get into “dinner” in russian kitchen

Anyway, certainly he will remain in the history, and perhaps the historians will now begin a new chapter in russian- rest of the world relations and co-extince

well as they grey one has forbidden me to venture any more to politics, I can only answer to the issues of Practical

It is as much sport as were the Gladiators in Rome empire. The thrill of it and all the reason to prefer it over normal target shooting comes from the fact that simulates combat enverioment and brings the adrealine to the game…wich is why loath it. Adrealine and guns make bad mix

Well, I first read Marx, and later bits of Althusser etc, getting on for thirty years ago – “know your enemy” is my watchword. I find it standard Marxist technique to suggest that, of course, no-one has managed to implement proper Marxism yet. The difficulty for your argument is that sensible people consider practice, not theory: experience and history, rather than idealised speculation. And in every case where Marx’s theories have been espoused by a government, tyranny has resulted, together with economic collapse. The Third Reich is extremely apt to cite in parallel with the USSR, China etc, because it was another one-party tyranny based on screwball authoritarian principles, just like your Marxist states…

everywhere Marx ideologies have inposed?? Hmm….only nation that have managed to wage independent revolution outside of Soviet hegemony and its own pan-slavic power politics is Cuba…live and still kicking, despite the fact that its economical opportunes are severly restricted by US embargo.

And like I allready explained to Jonesy, my own countrys semi-socialism and welfare-state are all victories of Marxist working class movment.

Gosh – are we supposed to be impressed by your target-shooter status? You remind me, sadly, of all too many target-shooting fans in this country, who worked so hard to distance themselves from those squalid cowboy types who owned “non-target-style” handguns that they helped to sell us down the river. Of course, they shafted themselves too…. A 9mm pistol (or anything else) can be a target weapon if you want it to. I’ve fired thousands of rounds of 9mm and .45ACP at targets, in Practical Pistol competition for example.

Practical isn’t sport, such a lame excuse to call military weapons a sport weapons. Im talking about real sports, ones attempt to the olympics and international shooting world championship games. Real Target shooting requires such ergonomics that support only one purpose, stand still and consentrated in front of the target and by mutual control of your mind, breathing and reflexes you manage the shot….No running around obstacles to simulate combat enverioments

“Wise” from your point of view maybe, but for anyone with an interest in political liberty – as opposed to the sort of collectivist tyranny represented by Marxism, Fascism or other authoritarianism – our firearms legislation is a hodge-podge of oppressive, irrational, illiberal, anti-democratic, dysfunctional garbage.
hps

All meassures of disarmament and pacifistic world are wise by the heart;)

It is very, very simple therefore to draw the conclusion that the number and type of guns in circulation in a country, legally or otherwise, is of absolutely no (as in zero, nada) consequence to the rate of crimes commited with guns in that country. I’m sorry but I dont think I can explain it any clearer than that?!.

Well Im not saying that taking away guns will take away crimes, am I? The proplem is that the crime rates have gradually grown in all western world, and banning of guns migth not lead into desired consequences becouse other elements creating crimes are rabidly exploiding out of control. Thats why I feel rather dull to take so called “proximate” way to counter my argument basing on the immidiaete effect and hectic today world enverioment. My agenda has been from start a long term plan, that effects would come fruition, only when the existing gun-base is worn out.

The UK situation doesent present a case where you want to ban arms under the goal to whipe out guns out of the world of existence completely. My plan is lot more dramatic than the one in done in UK

Ahh the mortal cry of the staunch Marxist. ‘You cant use the Soviet Union’s inequities against us as they were’nt true Marxists’. The understanding being that in their personal utopian ideal it would all just miraculously work. I wonder if an expanded capacity for self-delusion is essential for any remaining Marxists out there or its just coincidence that most seem to have it!.

The irony is that, in your denigration of the Soviet model, you provide yet another illustration of the circumstances where the presence of an armed citizenry would have prevented tyrannicism and the rise of a precession of despots.

Well I dont need to believe in miracles.
All I need to do is to go out in the streets of Finland and see it myself. The nordic welfare state is mostly product of Marxist social-democratics, and thougth it isent perfect in terms of socialism, its presents the ideas of Marxism lot better than any totalitaritan attempt.

And funny how you mention the gun owning citicens as case against the revolution, becouse it was largerly exactly that the “white guards” in both Russian and in Finland ignited, civil with considerable ammount of guns…..
….And then what happened? They felt that freedom and liberty is best presented by mass-slaughters of the unarmed working class….

And that Is the basic thing why I feel any claims of armed citicens to defend freedom a disgusting and pervert idea.