Yes. To list the peculiarities:
Mainwheels are tiny in big shoes
Lettering under the wing is too dark and shaky-looking
Tailwheel strut looks like that of a model
Wing roots show high-speed profile, while fixed faired undercarriage looks like ‘state of the art’ 10 years previous.
Undercarriage knuckles at leading edge don’t match port and starboard.
Really deep rear fuselage, almost to the point of an apparent discontinuity ‘hidden’ by an undercarriage leg
Odd lettering that appears ‘Chinese/Japanese’
Wing that is ‘Northrop’ at leading edge but ‘Seversky’ at the trailing edge
Strange linear feature under canopy.
All these are either very definite, and together unique, identification features, or elements of a made-up aircraft.
At the back of my mind is ‘Piltdown Man’
Sadly this is a made-up aeroplane – the model is a ‘what if’..
The aeroplane posted #188 is the 5D in question
Ha, yeah, fair enough, Bearoutwest. Just smarting a bit, you know? Internet rage.. never a good thing.
John, a good summary, I guess. Thanks. One note of caution – are we sure that the centre section is ‘flat’? The leading edge suggests it is, with a ‘break’ near the undercarriage, BUT what if the leading edge was raked forwards, kind of in the style of a P-51 root? With an additional thickening of the absolute root to present a better high-speed profile (think P-38 leading edge fillets), it could easily give a false impression of dihedral, or the lack of it. I can see no trace of the break in dihedral at the trailing edge. Not saying ‘this is so’, just something to bear in mind?
OK, ok, so the mystery aircraft is.. a Gamma that has been heavily modified for no apparent reason to look nothing like a Gamma. I’ll get into my modded Ferrari and go. (It looks just like a Focus, but that’ll just be the sheet metalwork).
[ATTACH=CONFIG]256830[/ATTACH]
…and life is too short for that. Is it not clear now that this is not the same aeroplane? Look, people have suggested aircraft, which is a good thing to do, this being a forum where we are trying to work something out, and all that. Someone else has come along to say why that can be ruled out, and it has been accepted with good grace. It is not necessary to take it as a personal insult.
I don’t know and wouldn’t presume to guess what your knowledge or experience of stressed-skin construction is, NII. My own experience is very short indeed, but I do grasp the principles and have seen how the Gamma was put together – putting that across to rule out this being a Gamma is not trying to insult your intelligence, which is not in doubt from me, having read some of your work.
When Northrop moved the wing to where it was on the Gamma, they changed the name, because it was a different aeroplane. The Beta was a different aeroplane from the Gamma, and so is this.
It isn’t just the join, its the whole fuselage – this is something like the amount of ‘sheet metal’ you’d need to attach to make a Gamma look like our aircraft:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]256827[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]256829[/ATTACH]
Something else that should be considered is that the image might be reversed. Happens a lot.
Also, to REALLY wind the knight who says ‘NII’ up, those letters do look a lot like [ATTACH=CONFIG]256822[/ATTACH] (‘GSZ’)
Sorry, couldn’t help that. I’m sure they don’t, it’s just that they look as much like that as ‘CC8’ or similar.
Sorry, I didn’t see the 2d / 3d linear perspective plotting. It would be interesting to see it, though, as the problem has been that there was no 3d reference for the shape.
I am aware of your work, and good stuff it is too. No-one is claiming you ‘know nothing’, please don’t throw your toys out of the pram.
It is not a question of intelligence, it’s more about seeing that you can’t change the fuselage shape with ‘consummate ease’. Or to put it another way, if in your capacity of aero engineer you did alter the shape with ease, I wouldn’t go near it, despite your assurances. It’s not an Airfix kit.
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You can ‘bolt on’ large amounts of fairing to alter its outward profile, but to change it you have ribs to replace and they are structural. Change the structure and you have a different aeroplane.
If its part of a monocoque then it’s part of the structure. That’s pretty much the definition of it.
You can create a new structure – but that’s not just ‘sheet metal work’. Fairing is, but what would be the point? Forward of the wing maybe, with a larger engine, but aft of it? – adding to surface area and weight, just to make the wing appear to sit higher? That was what I was getting at, not insulting your intelligence.
Lynx, if you look closely at the second posting of the image you can see the darker, curved line of what is presumably the starboard elevator, just a sliver, distinct from the bottom line of the slightly lighter shaded fuselage.
Someone mentioned the blob on side of the engine being a photographic blemish. I agree, and I believe there are couple more under the wing in the region of the serial, confusing the letter shapes.
It is not necessarily on the Spanish register, of course, unless I am still missing the EC part?
John, I looked at the Severskies and dismissed them one by one for various reasons, mainly the wrong wing. Which is the one sketched?
Yep. Fair reasoning.
The only thing I’d take issue with is the interpretation of the typed letters on the back. It doesn’t look like a stamp or a postmark, and similarly if it was an address it would be more likely to be where it was to, not from.
It looks more like a brief catalogue description, and I see ‘-ia’ and ‘-ero’, both very Spanish.
Call me a cynic, but by ‘secret’ most authors on the subject mean ‘didn’t actually happen’. The clue is where someone described a ‘secret’ German design (all new design ideas were secrets) as ‘decisive’..
It would be possible to put together a collection of 1945 sketches by ‘allied’ designers, fill in a few details in a 1950’s idiom and voila! Secret Wonder Weapons of the RAF.
But this isn’t as appealling to the target audience. No Nazis.
..of the wing, perhaps :apologetic:
Well, I laid it on thick about the opportunities for voluntary involvement, education and raising awareness of our heritage that such places could offer. and mentioned that the rules of use would include sustainable and environmentally friendly practice, as well as a level of ‘community engagement’. For it to work, and get funding, there would need to be access from the public if only for one day a week or something, and a level of training up of any young volunteers that might get roped in. I am suggesting four projects per unit..