WH904Very sad news indeed 🙁
WH904That wasn’t quite what Meddle was referring to. He was referring to just one of the countless comments from people who have complained about the Vulcan project for years, claiming that the money raised should have gone to some other supposedly worthy project. Of course these fools never stopped to realise that the money had been raised from people who wanted to see a Vulcan fly – not people who wanted to see a Whitley or anything else. I’m not sure that Meddle was correct to say that enthusiasts will criticise anything, but he’s right that a lot of people frowned upon the Vulcan project simply because they didn’t like Vulcans – usually because they were obsessed with WWII-vintage machines.
As for the possibility of the airport (in this case Finningley) getting too busy, it’s the opposite problem that prevails. The airport was a proverbial white elephant from the day it opened. The MoD cynically sold-off RAF Finningley after having spent millions on it, and (big surprise) a plan was put in place to build a prison. Unfortunately for the government, the plan didn’t work and local opposition killed-off the prison plan, so the airfield was left abandoned. Finally, Peel came along and created the airport (because it was cheap and helped their cynical plan to buy development land in Sheffield – which is an even darker story), but it was pretty clear from the outset that there was no commercial interest in the airport, being situated between two existing successful airports. The airport is hardly any busier than on the day it opened, and given Peel’s ruthless commercial attitude, it wouldn’t surprise anyone if the airport was suddenly closed. If that does happen, the site is pretty certain to be used for housing, as it is now sandwiched between two large housing areas, and perfect for the kind of development that the government keeps blithering about. If this does happen, XH558 probably wouldn’t be “crowded out” as it will presumably be inside the shiny “Academy” hangar, and so one would assume that housing will simply spread around it, much like the plan for Woodford. But the point is, it cannot perform taxy runs in a housing estate, and even if the airport stays open, there is no public access to the airfield to see a taxy run even if one was made. But the biggest problem is that XH558 stuck in a hangar will attract nobody. Why would it? There are other static Vulcans in far more interesting surroundings.
Personally, I find the saga very sad as I live fairly close to Finningley and it’s an airfield for which I have a lot of affection, having been frequenting it since I was a toddler. Likewise, I appreciate the opportunities to see XH558 take-off and land through each summer, so it doesn’t give me any joy to be saying that it should leave Finningley. But one has to be realistic. If it stays at Finningley it will inevitably be destroyed, the only question is just how long it will survive. If the “Academy” project works (which personally I doubt) then XH558 might stick around for a few years, even though we’ll not be able to see any high-speed ground runs unless it’s on an informal basis, peeking through a perimeter fence… and even that seems unlikely as nobody is going to donate fuel money to something they probably can’t even watch. So VTTS’ glamorous “plan” is actually pretty simple – stick XH558 in a shed and pretend that it’s of some interest to visitors or engineering students. Clearly it will not be, and even if the “Academy” survives in some form, XH558 will inevitably be an irrelevant waste of valuable space.
So, as I said before, I can only conclude that VTTS are only interested in securing their future, not XH558’s. If they really were serious about the long-term future of XH558, they would not be proposing to leave it at Finningley.
WH904It’s an interesting idea but not very likely. Based on what VTTS have said, it seems likely that the engines will still have a bit of life in them after the final flight is made – they appear to be basing the grounding decision on the lack of forward OEM support etc., rather than the very end of the engine’s life (which is slightly ironic, as it was supposedly engine life that would ultimately end the flying). Plus, it would have to be a pretty dire emergency to cause a diversion (flying on three engines was never a problem – back in the VDF days XH558 took-off on three engines at least once to my knowledge). I suppose the outcome would be even worse in any case – nobody is likely to grant free accommodation to an unwanted arrival, even one as special as XH558! Mind you, it reminds me that more than a few people have been harbouring romantic notions of what the very last flight might be like. If the Vulcan pilots no longer have any need to satisfy the CAA, I guess there’s no reason why (like the Canberra) XH558 couldn’t be really flown for the last time – it’s been a long time since a Vulcan completed a barrel roll… (well we can dream) 🙂
WH904I agree Charlie. Consultation would be a nightmare but at the same time it seems absurd that quite the opposite situation prevails. As for the other comment, it’s as I have said previously – the “Academy” sounds like a great way to keep some of the VTTS team in gainful employment but (for the reasons I’ve explained) it seems like a guaranteed way to ensure that XH558 gets scrapped sooner or later. I can only conclude therefore, that the decision is based more on their desire to keep themselves busy, rather than seriously considering the realities of XH558’s future in such a set-up. Yes, it might be cynical but on the basis of what they are proposing, it’s hard to reach any other conclusion. If VTTS was entirely serious about ensuring XH558’s long term future, then why would they propose housing it in a new hangar where it would be of no relevance to the “Academy” and would therefore become a waste of what will presumably become commercial space? Likewise (and the point is not “risible” as Plough suggests), why would they propose grounding the aircraft at a location where it cannot be seen making a taxy run? Peel will not allow public access to the airfield, so the best that any visitor could hope for is to maybe see (hear!) the engines run and nothing more. Additionally, there is the very real risk that the whole airport might close, in which case there most certainly would be no taxy runs, and probably no engine runs either, if the new hangar eventually becomes part of a housing estate.
The whole idea is bonkers, despite seeming to have a superficial plausibility about it. I accept that a lot of the proposal is down to agreements with HLF, but if VTTS are really serious about an “Academy” then fine – the idea might work even if XH558 is largely irrelevant to it, but building it at Finningley is just crazy. It would be better sited at an airfield with a more secure future. As I said before, Scampton seems like the most logical site but I’m sure there are others. The tragedy of this saga is that VTTS don’t seem to have even considered any other alternatives.
WH904I think the basic problem is that VTTS seem to be thinking more about their own futures than the aircraft’s future. Okay, a lot of the plan is down to agreements with HLF but the notion of a 1950s-vintage jet being of any relevance to aerospace students is ludicrous. If the new centre did succeed, I’m sure any sane manager would soon conclude that the available space could be better used by more useful airframes. Likewise, I’m not sure whether the idea of XH558 being used as an instructional airframe is a great prospect either. If the “academy” works then great, but it doesn’t guarantee the airport’s future, and it certainly doesn’t guarantee XH558’s future. I think the whole project is very short-sighted and I fear it is intentionally so, based more on VTTS’ desire to keep themselves busy, rather than protecting XH558’s future.
It’s ironic that it was supposedly the “people’s plane” and yet nobody was consulted about this idea and yet it’s going ahead without any obvious possibility of a better alternative. Most importantly, when XH558 stops flying it is stranded, so there’s no chance of rescuing the aircraft in the future if (or when) this becomes necessary. Despite applauding VTTS for keeping XH558 flying for so long, I think the way in which they propose to retire the aircraft is a very bad idea, and most people seem to think so. Sadly, I don’t see any means (or even any will) to persuade VTTS or HLF to think of something better before it’s too late.
WH904Plough, some points that warrant a reply there. Firstly, access to Bruntingthorpe might have been sporadic but access to the airfield was at least possible, whereas it’s never going to happen at Finningley (at least while it remains in use as an active airport). If XH558 is maintained in running condition, nobody is going to be able to see it move, unless it’s from a fair distance on the perimeter road. You then question Kirmington’s survivability. Surely, you ought to question Finningley’s survivability too then, as it seems to be far greater danger of closure than Kirmington does!
Yes, VTTS have been very clear about their plan to keep XH558 at Finningley. Personally, I think this has been a bad thing. They seem to have actively excluded the possibility of any other location until we’ve reached a stage where it’s probably too late to even consider any other site… even if VTTS wanted to consider any, which I assume they do not. I suppose the more cynical of us might imagine that this dubious “Academy” idea has more to do with potential jobs and income for former VTTS staff than it has to do with the long-term security of the Vulcan…
As for Scampton, it is still under RAF control. However it doesn’t follow that “there would be no access” to the site. Access is relatively easy even now, not only to companies based on the site but to the Heritage Centre, and of course to RAFAT itself, where groups of visitors are hosted almost every day. I believe the runway is to be resurfaced although I haven’t heard anything about this issue for some time. I see no reason why public access to XH558 would be a problem. The real question is how much of the hangar space actually still comes under MoD control and if any agreement could be made to accommodate the aircraft. But all of this doesn’t really matter as XH558’s fate seems to be sealed. I have seen no indication that VTTS plan to do anything other than stick with their Academy idea. I think the idea is flawed and will ultimately lead to XH558’s premature destruction, for all the reasons I’ve mentioned previously. I can’t believe that VTTS could be so short-sighted as not to see the potential folly of the idea, therefore I can only assume that they know the risks only too well, but think there’s some kind of advantage in it for them – if not for the aeroplane they are supposedly preserving. It sounds cynical I know, but on the basis of what is happening, I think it’s the only logical conclusion that one can make.
WH904I agree with you Paul that XM607 is undoubtedly a far more significant machine (leaving it parked next to the A15 is a disgrace in my opinion) but I suppose XH558 has two things in its favour – it was the first B.Mk.2 to enter service and the last B.Mk.2 to leave, and of course it’s in better condition than any other example because it’s still in flying condition. Even with the best will in the world, some of the preserved examples are in relatively poor condition so it surely makes sense to preserve the only example that is almost “as new”. There are only minor changes/removals to the cabin interior that differentiate XH558 from an operational machine. The only external difference is the missing intake on the ECM fairing, but I guess that could easily be replaced if there was any appetite to “restore” the aircraft to service standard 🙂
WH904Plough, some interesting points there:- Bruntingthorpe’s future isn’t in doubt – as far as I know it’s still a profitable enterprise. Not sure if the same could be said about Finningley! It struggles-on even though it is ridiculously under-utilised. More to the point, access to Bruntingthorpe really isn’t bad, unlike Finningley where there’s no access at all other than direct access to the Vulcan’s hangar (but only at specific times). It means that if the aircraft was to taxy, the airport would doubtless refuse any possibility of allowing public spectators on any part of the field. Don’t get me wrong – I don’t relish the prospect of XH558 sitting out in the elements at Bruntingthorpe but at least it would be able to make taxy runs and it would be part of a big collection of interesting aircraft. Suggesting that XH558’s future at Finningley does not rely on visitors is hardly fair. If nobody goes to look at it, who is going to justify hangarage/ground costs of any sort for it? Just as important is to ask whether Finningley’s future means that the airport might disappear. It’s not impossible that the airport will eventually close unless business picks up – it’s a commercial venture.
As for 301s fitting into a 201-series aircraft, they will fit, with some modifications. Quite a few 201-series Vulcans were modified for 301s long after manufacture. However, engines are no longer the only issue, so that issue is merely academic!
The obvious “retirement home” for XH558 ought to have been Duxford, but with a Vulcan already in situ, it’s a non-starter. Same applies to Cosford/Hendon. Elvington is certainly an option but the cost of building a hangar (dismantling and rebuilding a T2 shed wouldn’t quite hack it!) would seem to be out of reach, in which case the aircraft may as well go to Bruntingthorpe – an airfield which is certainly more “central” than Elvington. Naturally, a resting place under cover would be the best outcome, and there really doesn’t seem to be any prospect of this at any location other than Finningley. But there’s a real risk in being seduced by the prospect of a cosy home inside a hangar, if the outcome actually results in the aircraft being destroyed, either because the cost of preserving/maintaining it becomes an issue (as it surely will) or because the airport finally becomes another housing estate, just like Woodford. I wouldn’t put much faith in Peel’s position – I lived through the Sheffield Airport debacle, so we can assume that Peel will have no interest in “supporting” XH558 if/when it becomes a financial liability. Truth is, there’s no ideal resting place for XH558, but even more worrying is how plans are already being made that seem to guarantee the aircraft’s eventual demise. If we look past all the glossy claptrap about the education centre (or whatever else we care to call it), the actuality is a static Vulcan in a shed, stuck on a commercial airport that might eventually get bulldozed.
One other thought comes to mind – Scampton seems to have survived the many threats of closure. There is some hangar space there, perfectly tailored to XH558’s dimensions. Access to the site is possible and given XH558’s history, I suppose it’s not impossible that MoD space could be found for the aircraft. Would be nice to have a viewing facility for the RAFAT and somewhere for XH558 to stay indoors, and taxy as and when required. It’s also a very appropriate resting place for a former B.Mk.2(MRR). I don’t imagine it’s an easy solution but it’s certainly one that I would at least investigate. But it seems pretty clear that the Vulcan people have already decided what their plans are for XH558, even though an awful lot of us think the plans stink. Funny how “The People’s Aeroplane” is suddenly snatched out of our grasp when a vital decision about the aircraft’s eventual fate is taken.
WH904A far more attractive idea would be to secure funding for a building adjacent to the WAVE at Waddington – to accommodate XM607 (by far the most historically significant Vulcan) and XH558 (the last flying example) together. It would make a great attraction that would have a direct connection with the location. Plenty of unused space to build on too. However I don’t imagine for a minute that it will ever happen – I’m sure XM607 will be left in her current location until she rots.
As for XH558, well okay, Finningley is the logical place for the aircraft (it was the aircraft’s home base for many years), but once the aircraft stops flying, who is going to go and see it? A non-flying Vulcan is no different to any other preserved example, so why would anyone make a special trip to Finningley to see one example, when they could go to (for example) Newark and see a Vulcan in operational colours, and see a whole collection of other aircraft at the same time? I’m afraid the talk of this fancy “heritage/learning” centre at Finningley just doesn’t make sense – once XH558 stops flying it will be forgotten. The other issue is if the aircraft is maintained in taxy condition, then what happens? Will there be occasional taxy runs along Finningley’s runway? If so, nobody will be able to get access to the airfield to watch the spectacle… so why bother?
Despite having great affection for Finningley, it’s clearly no place to retire XH558. Leaving it at Finningley is pointless. It will be forgotten about within months and then we will have a Vulcan that nobody wants to bother going to see, but no longer capable of flying out to a location where people do want to see it. The result will be the arrival of a scrap merchant.
WH904I saw a few glimpses. I caught a glimpse of the ventral intake on one machine which was clearly a fake but whether the entire airframes were fake I don’t know – they looked pretty convincing 🙂
WH904No more details on the photo of RF322 I’m afraid. As you say, the code is more commonly associated with RF325. I’m constantly surprised at how few photos of RF325 seem to have survived, considering its significance.
WH904If the order was made with Key Publishing, I would advise you to contact the supplier directly as that sounds like a mistake to me – I can’t see why there would have been a delay of that length
WH904This photo shows RF322 also carrying the DH codes 🙂
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WH904If any photos do crop us, do let us all know. I’m always fascinated to see images of SMR Lancasters! 🙂
WH904Glad you liked it. The typo problem is being addressed and we’ve already improved things since the Jaguar issue. We’ve also sorted-out the print problems. Distribution still seems to be a bit mixed though, so if anyone still finds it difficult to get copies of the Icons series, do say so. The next edition in the series is out in a few days and we’re already working on the one after that – which is probably my favourite aeroplane, so I’m enjoying the research 🙂
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