The pschycological effect of F-104 was only in PAf’s mind. It was always a mediocre plane and managed to get shot down by a mystere. IAf pilots in 71 were more worried by Mirage-III which they considered a more potent threat that starfighter. The F-16 was countered ages ago with Mirage-2000 and mig-29s. Now pakistan is just begging due to logistic issues. The J-10 is a joke and its pakistan breaking their heads on how to counter MKI and MRCA. The J-10 won’t cut it.

as usual typical of superiority complex minded answer.

regarding F-104 its already answered but to comprehend it is another matter for you. actually its fear factor was at its peak in 65 but F-6 and Mirage-III took over in 71 war but still 2 HF-24 so called “indigenous” IAF fighter were destroyed in the ground and never saw any combat like Mig-21 in 65 war. 104 also managed to shoot down 1 Gnat 1 Su-7 1 canberra and 1 IN ASW aircraft.
F-16s were acquired way before Mirage-2000 or Mig-29 if thats what you are referring too? as for begging lol.. india is no where behind. after all the “18” new F-16 news is giving IAF nightmares no wonder why they have been begging US to stop F-16 orders. and what?? J-10 is a joke? dont know about that but PAF J-10 will be just as good as 4.5 gen fighter.

The F1 would’ve at least given them a BVR capability instead of having to wait for the JF-17. So in that aspect it would have been “better” than the F-16A’s that Pakistan got originally.

no but no thanks.. 😀

like i said before. PAF asked GOP for 30 mirage-2000 approval in 1990s. but back then the corruption was at the peak and former prime minister benazir bhutoo’s husband zardari aka mr-10% couldn’t resist the opportunity and forced PAF to raise the prise so he could get his 10% from the deal. the air force then just dropped it. this would have solved the BVR missile capability problem and ease the burden of f-16s.

so you are saying PAF should have opt for F1 over F-16s? and abandon the JF-17 program? oh please… this would be committing suicide for the sake of short term benefit! F-1 wouldnt have had much of difference over Mirage-III rose IV upgrade with BVR missiles.

in your opinion what errors did PAF high command make in procuring jet fighters

you are joking right?:confused:

1-supermarine attacker ! worthless straight wing plane

As long as it meet PAF ASR 50 years ago it was fine, and it did. it was a transition to more modern F-86 F-104 of that time.

2- Not buying Mirage F-1 when hopes for getting F-16 evaporated in late 80s
it not as good as 2000, but cheaper and definately a match for GCI-less mig-29 of IAF

Mirage-F1 did not really meet PAF requirements but have trained other arab air force operating F1. Though in 1990s PAF was in urgent need for Mirage-2000 and in fact requested approval of 30 planes from the Government of pakistan then “Pakistan People’s Party” which at that time was at the peek of corruption and still is. back then Benazir bhutto’s husband Zardari aka “MR.10%” was known for his 10% commission for every major business deal in pakistan. he could not prevail this opportunity so he told the Air force to raise the prise on paper from lets say “30 $million per unit” to 34, and he even went as far as convincing dassault to hike the prise. sadly the air force had to pull out of this mess…

this i think is the biggest blunder in pakistan military’s history. this would have solved PAF true BVR capability along with BVR missile which PAF still lacks..

4-Buying F-104 , instead shud have bought F-100 super sabre , a grt plane not as fast as f-104 , but better range,payload and air combat capabilities

DUDE! do you even know the significance of F-104 in PAF in 65 and 71 war!?
it was literally the savior of PAF!

5-backing the afghan bandits in the 80s which resulted in very bad relations with USSR and hence no chance of getting mig-29/su-27 in post-cold war era

? wat!
F-16 were acquired due to the fact that USSR was about to march across pakistan and as for defending pakistan US gave one of the biggest military defence package in pakistan’s history! even if pakistan never worked aganist USSR they still would have had hostile due to INDIA-Russia alliance.

now, where is that rotflmao smily when you need one ??

do you know that vympel are novator are two different companies ??

I mean think about it, even their names are different !! what is so hard ?

anyway, I do agree that

and where exactly is that my words??? i do know vympel and novator are different companies..
KS-172 program is dead now..

most posters here are of the opinion that the report itself is a bluff.

errr.. sorry to burst you out of bubble, even the company admits that the program is dead..
further discussion are useless.

Chinese had full rights to bring down that spy plane..

what is the current SU-33 status for PLAAF or PLAN. China was suppose to receive 50 Su-33 and i suppose ToT as well?