flashback to cold war 80s
the soviet navy kept the obsolete Kresta I and Kynda class cruisers with their aging SSN-3b shaddock missiles operational until the late 80s, while a lot of the older ECHO class subs had either been retired or converted the much more capable bazalt and vulkan missiles.
I’m assuming the Kynda and Kresta I were kept in service as they could be useful in a big nuclear war at sea ? as they each carried 2 TNW in their SSN-3 missiles ? apart from this role I see no benefit in using the conventional SSN-3b when much better missiles like SSN-9/7/12 are plentiful on other surface ships and subs ?
any thoughts
Let me add
Su 15 flagon to the list too
Mig 19 and lightning were basically overtaken by more advanced planes
But in lightning the big disappointment was no BVR weapons And poor load carrying capacity
Mig 19 has poor weapon carrying ability
No radar and limited ability for upgrades
In the context of big war even if of a short duration it’s better to have numbers esp if there is a ground war at the same time
Lean hard hitting small forces are more for savage wars of peace
There are examples on both sides:
M4 vs Tiger in WW2 = Numbers won but poor maint & tactics played a large role
Multiple battles in Vietnam = Tech won
ME vs Israel in multiple conflicts = Tech won
M60/M1 vs T-5x/6x/7x in Iraq = Tech won
In Vietnam US also had quantity +tech
In 1982 Israel also had quantity+ tech vs Syria
In Iraq there are other overwhelming advantages in the US side
over hyped
mig29. everyone was like, f16 killer. but it was only good at being killed. even other russian jets shot it down
atdx. all the media is like.. japanese stealth fighter. its too small and cant carry weapons
pakfa. look at the russian and pakfa threads here. it is hysterical! they go off about how its superior to f-35 and j-20 and everything. get angry when people point out its flaws like its engine and straight inlets. but then among themselves they basically say “So when will we get a new engine and new back half”
My list
F 101
BAC LIghtning
Mig 19
over hyped
mig29. everyone was like, f16 killer. but it was only good at being killed. even other russian jets shot it down
atdx. all the media is like.. japanese stealth fighter. its too small and cant carry weapons
pakfa. look at the russian and pakfa threads here. it is hysterical! they go off about how its superior to f-35 and j-20 and everything. get angry when people point out its flaws like its engine and straight inlets. but then among themselves they basically say “So when will we get a new engine and new back half”
IMHO soviet design philosophy cannot be compared to western ones nor are their doctrines mirror images of one another
Cold war era soviet fighter designers did not care how their products performed in the export market what they wanted was weapons that would fit their unique operational requirements of PVO and VVS
There have been no large scale air campaigns involving mig 29 or 25 so cannot determine their effectiveness.Even the mig 23 mostly export versions of 73 war era was up against numerically superior and advanced IDAF operating in a very favorable environment.
Makes sense , there has been no major fleet engagement involving a huge air sea battle since 70s closest we get is the Arab Israeli wars and that involved all small craft and one sided use in the Falklands.
Was this CIWS vs sea skimmers ever used for military simulation ?or is this classified
Was there more benefit against antiship missiles in using the layered system of defences as the Kara and udaloy classes did ?
How effective was the CIWS and gatling guns mounted on soviet ships against sea skimmers like Harpoon ?
Thank you for the explanation
So if that’s the case how were the pre AEGIS destroyers expected to defend themselves from cruise missile and aircraft attacks? They would ‘ve easily overwhelmed by numbers and given the soviet missiles were big even 1 hit might sink the ship.
I remember USS stark got 2 hits still remained afloat
So I’m other words at a given time these ships can target only 2 incoming threats using sea sparrows?
Thanks for correcting me
So the sea sparrow mk 29 launcher can target and guide how many missiles at a given time ?
Bump
Yes it did. It depended on the number of Mk 91 firecontrol assets. Some aircraft carriers mounted two Mk 91 for one Mk 29.
I’m more interested in its use on destroyers , did they have several mk 91 too ?