Buranso instead of a a remote Afghan cave
he was found in a Pakistani luxury mountain?good game Pakistan. biting the hand that feeds you.
Any one with a single brain cell would do the same as what Pakistan has done. They have been forced into this war by US.
One day West will cut and run like they always do. Why should Pakistan be left to pick up the pieces again? They will do the minimum possible to avoid a confrontation with the West.
The deal with Bin Laden was, we will neither hunt you down nor give you any support. You are on your own. If someone else gets you, so be it.
BuranLooking at the crashed helicopter we can the see the helicopter tail next to the compound wall, interesting thing to note is that the wall itself has not been damaged.
I am not familiar with the strength of the tail boom structure, but surely if the helicopter had crashed after hitting the wall there would be some damage to the wall?
Another thing to note is the complete destruction of the helicopter. We have seen Americans destroy critical equipment after their helicopters have gone down before, like Somalia. But the main airframe in those cases had survived.
I hope one day a video of the raid comes out like the mission in Somalia.
BuranYes, it seems from a special operations point of view, that it would be useful to have a ‘stealth’ chopper. The question is whether both Russia and China feel the need to spend on the development of such a type. I think both may well see the benefit to justify such a programme.
What sort of stealth would this helicopter have provided? Radar or Acoustic?
I doubt they would need a radar evading helicopter for missions in AF-Pak arena. It must be more of stealth in the visual /acoustic area.
Although having posted a comment on Pakdef forum that using a stealth helicopter proves that Pakistanis had no clue about the operation and the compound was an ex ISI safe house touched a raw nerve somewhere and I was banned within 10 minutes!
Buranactually I believe that many people in power will sacrifice other people’s children if they can gain from it. the Pakistani president didn’t really give me the impression of caring much for his people when his country was flooded, idem for Bush Jr.
Well as you say many people didn’t like Bush Jr’s response to Katrina. But when it comes to terrorism I do want to give benefit of doubt to someone who lost his wife to a suicide bomber.
As far as the drones go, US has a tacit approval for their use on the tribal areas. It is just politically wise to oppose them in Pakistan. When Pakistani forces conduct operations themselves in that area the collateral damage is much higher due to use of artillery.
Buraninteresting point would be that Pakistan doesn’t want this war to be over, they’re in a superb position where the US needs their help and will pay billions for it. which ofcourse Pakistan spends on fighting the Taliban, and certainly not India… 🙂
Before Pakistan was ‘forced’ into this (with us or aginst us) war, Pakistani economy was much better and they had 30,000 civilians and 5000 soldiers alive (including Generals and senior politicians). Suicide bombing was something which was only mentioned in news from Israel.
This is a Western perception that people in poor countries only want money and will even sacrifice their children for it. No one in Pakistan has gained from this deal, everyone from the president to the poor are suffering from the terrorists backlash.
I am sure they will pay you twice what US has paid them for the return of peace and security in the country.
BuranThey knew since at least August 2010. They’ve been practicing the raid (built replica compound etc) since at least April 2011.
I wonder why they didn’t go in with the Pakistani forces like the capture of the Kuwaiti dude Khalid Sheikh Muhammad. All American operation has more political milage I guess.
Much more went on than what Pakistanis are admitting, for obvious reasons to reduce reprisal attacks on them.
BuranInjured personell from the helicopter crash were rushed to the Military hospital.
Thats when the local media was reporting crash of what they thought was a Pak army helicopter.
http://www.pakistantoday.com.pk/2011/05/army-chopper-crashes-in-abbottabad/
The operation lasted 40 mins, right next to a Military academy. Enough time in my opinion to scramble the airforce, if they wanted to.
BuranTo answer part of my own question!
[Updated, 8:12 a.m. ET] The operation that led to Osama bin Laden’s death was American action, a Pakistani official told CNN. “We assisted only in terms of authorization of the helicopter flights in our airspace,” said the official, who asked not to be named because he was not authorized to speak about the issue. “In any event, we did not want anything to do with such an operation in case something went wrong,” the official said.
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/02/obama-to-make-statment-tonight-subject-unknown/
BuranPakistan Airforce again tests Ra’ad cruise missile
A statement said the air-launched missile was fired on Friday.
It said the missile, named Hatf-VIII, was developed in Pakistan and has a range of 220 miles (350 kilometres).
Video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E3vWAOpCcnQ&feature=player_embedded
BuranF/A-18 crash
2 killed in California F/A-18 crash
http://www.cnn.com/2011/US/04/06/california.military.crash/index.html?hpt=T2
BuranIm not sure how they will figure out the exact location of the carrier group or mannouver the warhead for speed and direction changes in terminal stages.
But looking at the acuracy, can Iranians now not use this warhead for surgical strikes on land targets?
BuranOk, so before I start this, I just want to let any Egyptian members realise that I do not relish the thought of any future conflicts with their nation, that said, with the current political upheaval in the country, here is a possible scenario.
Mubarrak is forced out sometime in the next few weeks, and a fledgling democracy starts to grow. Before long, an Islamic extremist party comes to power.
So what are the security implications for the West, and other nations neighboring Egypt? What if, a year from now, Egypt were to close the Suez canal in response to a wider middle east crisis?
With the Egyptian military now lavishly equipped, would they be able to guarantee Egyptian sovereignty? What would it mean for procurement in Israel and other nations?
I honestly hope that nothing like this will ever happen, but what seemed to be democratic revolutions before have turned into extreme regimes.
What are the chances of an extremist party taking over Egypt? If my memory serves me right, the last time an extremist party took over a ‘COUNTRY’ were the Nazis in Europe.
It has turned into a recurring nightmare for western governments. If there is any trouble in a Muslim country, out goes all rational thoughts and we start banging about ‘Extremists will take over’
We didn’t really see people saying fascists will take over Britain during the student demonstrations, and security implications thereof.
I’d rather discuss what we will do when aliens invade than fantasies of Mullahs taking over Egypt.
BuranOk, so before I start this, I just want to let any Egyptian members realise that I do not relish the thought of any future conflicts with their nation, that said, with the current political upheaval in the country, here is a possible scenario.
Mubarrak is forced out sometime in the next few weeks, and a fledgling democracy starts to grow. Before long, an Islamic extremist party comes to power.
So what are the security implications for the West, and other nations neighboring Egypt? What if, a year from now, Egypt were to close the Suez canal in response to a wider middle east crisis?
With the Egyptian military now lavishly equipped, would they be able to guarantee Egyptian sovereignty? What would it mean for procurement in Israel and other nations?
I honestly hope that nothing like this will ever happen, but what seemed to be democratic revolutions before have turned into extreme regimes.
What are the chances of an extremist party taking over Egypt? If my memory serves me right, the last time an extremist party took over a ‘COUNTRY’ were the Nazis in Europe.
It has turned into a recurring nightmare for western governments. If there is any trouble in a Muslim country, out goes all rational thoughts and we start banging about ‘Extremists will take over’
We didn’t really see people saying fascists will take over Britain during the student demonstrations, and security implications thereof.
I’d rather discuss what we will do when aliens invade than fantasies of Mullahs taking over Egypt.
BuranPakistan would love to get their hands on this baby, if there weren’t any political or financial constraints.
It will be very handy for them to hunt down Taliban in Waziristan, Baluchistan and along the border with Afghanistan. I’m not sure how good this system is in a mountainous terrain with thick foliage.
BuranBefore I say anything let me caveat it by saying that I am not an expert of any kind.
Just as an untrained observer, I think amongst the three 5th Gen planes now flying around J-20 holds its own in terms of its design (Not sure how good that will be for the job). I am sure rather than re-inventing the wheel the Chinese might have borrowed some features from F-22.
It is remarkable for China to come up with J-20 so soon, given the relatively short history of their aviation industry. They have taken a gamble on its design rather than use a derivative of something flying around.
T-50 on the other hand does look a bit Flankerish, if one had to come up with a stealth version of SU-30, it won’t be far off the current T-50. Maybe Russians are not reinventing the wheel in some areas?
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