BuranI have spoken with one of the JF-17 pilots today at Farnborough. According to this guy the call up for Farnborough was at the last minute, JF-17 does not have any display routine at the moment. It was very late to plan and practice a routine.
This would have been the first time JF-17 would have flown at an airshow, PAF wanted to show a proper display, rather than just a take off and landing.
Now that PAF has decided to send JF-17 at international airshows, a routine will be praticed and flown in the next airshow later this year in China.
Hopefully this will put an end to all the arguments.
BuranPlease read your own link. It says :-
In October, L15 off a new round of flight height, according to the Dubai air show air show program, completed in China in more than 20 flight drills, constantly optimize the flight parameters during the flight to ensure that each action is done precisely in place to so that flight profile can be both a very strong view of the safety requirements to meet the airshow scene. In addition, the transitions in Dubai for the mission requirements of the transition function test flight, the aircraft successfully laid a solid foundation for participating.
So it conducted rigorous flight-tests upto a confirmatory milestone to ensure safety requirements. Has JF-17 done that ? Have the PAF authorities even bothered to demonstrate its certified flight regime ?
With NATO countries salivating at new American toys, some diplomatic sweet talk, then yes its possible.
But the point remains that on airshows, the host country does NOT allow just any flying machine to do acrobatics above crowds. Just read the L-15 example right above, and its preparation for the Dubai air show.
Its clearly missing in case of the JF-17. Probably that’s why it was restricted to a static display.
Im sorry but your argument has been rubbished by many people on this forum, and for good reason. If you bother to look at youtube, you will find many videos of JF-17 display in Islamabad right on top of the crowd including all the western diplomats there.
It is not a prototype but a fully operational fighter.
Was Soviet Union demonstrating certified flight regimes of their fighters before the airshows in western countries during the of cold war?
Did Americans let someone evaluate B2 bombers before they sent them to airshows overseas?
BuranI don’t think thts the case, because since beginning the Farnborough website never showed the JF-17 under the flying category (I had posted the link here).
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Added later : Rookh, good photos of JF-17, especially the takeoff one from right beneath.
I dont know when you looked at the Farnborough website. But when I looked at it, and the reason I booked the tickets for Farnborough airshow this year was the flying display of JF-17.
BuranThe practice of kneeling and kissing the floor is standard practice in Islam. Could be a variety of reasons why the woman did it from fear of flying to time of daily prayers to personal reasons towards the city she was in.
Kissing the floor is NOT an Islamic practice, or of any main religion I know of. It could be a something personal for her.
Perhaps an asylum seeker making it to UK?
BuranA virgin post, so be gentle with me
If Israel took out the Iranian capabilities there might be a LOT of sabre rattling, but Saudia Arabia, Pakisatan, India and China would not exactly bust a gut to retaliate.
That is the main question. Can Israel take out the Iranian nuclear capability to an extent that it can not be resumed.
Also who has to loose more in a low intensity conflict, where both countries are taking out each others scientists etc?
BuranJust here because of its importance. It should ideally be in the Navy thread but then again not all go to sub forums and read the Navy threads.
Is this still a ‘breaking news’ after 4 months?
http://theindependent.mu/2010/02/17/stealthy-us-fighter-f-35-for-ally-india/
BuranRegarding bald eagles on third world air forces, there’s a rash lately, even USA’s sworn enemy Iran adopted them:
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Iran—Air/Northrop-F-5F-Tiger/1698087/L/
Laughable, man – Ha Ha! 😉
Looks more like an African Fish Eagle.
BuranCommuter on Patrol
The choice of basing Erieye on a regional airliner has obvious benefits in terms of high reliability, cost-efficiency and low maintenance requirements, but also offers significant mission benefits. The type’s hot-and-high performance is critical in the Pakistani operational environment. The aircraft has a balanced field length of 4,593 feet, allowing it to use many small airports, and it can reach 25,000 feet in 16 minutes.
Mission endurance is nine to 10 hours thanks to extra tanks in the cabin, and it can operate at up to 30,000 feet. At cruise power, the aircraft flies at about 340 knots, impressive for a turboprop. Using a 60-degree bank, the aircraft can complete a 180-degree turn at the end of a racetrack pattern in less than 30 seconds, with little interruption in track coverage.
Crew comfort is a consideration for long-endurance patrols, and through its active noise cancellation system, the Saab 2000 offers very low cabin noise levels. A 7,500-foot cabin pressure can be maintained at operational altitude. The Pakistani aircraft have a galley and rest area, with a mission display in the latter so that resting crew can stay informed of emerging situations. The flight deck is a very modern airliner-style working environment, with a six-tube Collins ProLine 4 electronic flight information system.
http://www.ainonline.com/news/single-news-page/article/saab-2000-aewc-prepares-for-duty-16661/
The choice of a turboprop rather than a jet is “a customer perception,” says Sten Soderstrom, vice president of marketing at Saab Surveillance Systems.
We have six customers and none has exactly the same radar
BuranSaab 2000 has 5 operator stations vs 3 on EMB 145.
Endurance of 9.5 hours unrefuelled. Pakistan did not have any refueller at the time of contract.
It can carry towed radar decoy.
BuranSanctions are used as first step of a military action. Like with Iraq US will use the sanctions to weaken Iran’s military, before any attack.
BuranYou answered your own question Quadbike, Isreal is in a big PR mess.
When even Turkey turns against it it makes things even harder for King Abdullah as now he has even less room to manouvre vis a vis Jordanian public opinion. In the past he could argue his air force could not defend itself or that it was in Jordanian interests, now that much of world opinion has turned against Israel and even Turkey attacks it diplomatically he will find it hard to NOT resist IDF overflights. This is where Israel (I do not even think Nentenyahu realises yet), has really lost out and shot itself in the foot.Even moderate Arabs will find it hard not to put up stern resistance in case of hostile action. Even states scared of a nuclear Iran can no longer (even implicitly) support a raid.Buran
Hamas are VERY PR savvy, Israel will be the first to admit this. Alot of what has happened recently has been Israels own bungling, and alot of it down to good PR. They are not just a bunch of brainless armed gangsters as many in IDF will tell you…
If you look at my post I never mentioned Hamas.
Its always the groups on the fringe, who are willing to take big risks. Just 2 weeks ago 4 Islamic Jihad members were killed during a naval commando raid near Gaza/Israel sea border. Israel has a lot more to loose than Iran by any attack. Iran will simply restart the whole process again, might thake them few more years but they will get the bomb.
BuranBut will the Jordanians have the balls to shoot the Israeli planes down in the first place ? Or would they just do nothing and make a strong protest the next day.
This is the big question.
Would be very counter productive for the Palestinian cause that. Israel is in a big PR mess now and any such tactic would reverse it.
Groups on the fringe like Islamic Jihad and other dont care about PR at all. They are hard core militants which Iran can exploit. They are Sunni groups mostly, so Iranians might have to use Syria as go between.
BuranRecently there were reports of Hezbollah being provided with long range rockets by Syria-Iran nexus. One can expect a barrage of rockets on Israeli cities from Lebanese side, including towards Tel Aviv.
There has not been any open armed clash between Iran and Israel. Once Israel crosses this line, who knows what Iranians would do.
Even if they flooded the Palestinian territories with simple ATGMs and shoulder launched SAMs, it will be a night mare scenario for Israel, already Cars are being smuggled into Gaza through the underground tunnels. Gaza is not sealed shut.
Iranians would not need to send fighter and tankers to refuel them, their strike packages are already all around Israel. All they need is Iranian nod and a ready supply of deadly weapons.
BuranTrue, however I think in this scenario there will be alot of people way ahead of Armenia in the “Wrath of Iran” list….
However, if Armenia is assured of Israeli/US support they may agree (and of course naturally deny they did it publicly).
It would be a way of getting around the whole “flying over Saudia Arabia” fantasy…
US ‘support’ is legendary in that part of the world. They have cut and run too many times to be offering any long term commitments. No wonder countries like Pakistan are using US as a ‘pay as you go’ partner.
Armenia would be very foolish to put themselves in the middle of this long running conflict. They can’t afford to take sides since they have a long running dispute with Azerbaijan, and the last thing they want is Iranian backing for Azeris.
BuranHow about flying from bases in Armenia. You could buy off the Armenians with a few free UAVs and other weaponry.
Half the attack fleet could fly to Armenia (via Greece, Georgia) whilst the rest could fly from Israel.
This would ease pressure on IDF’s refuelling assets whilst giving the Iranians the headache of defending an attack from two opposite directions.
I dont think any country will jump into the Israel – Iran conflict for few UAV’s.
Armenians know when everything is over they will face Tehran’s wrath. If this does happen Azerbijan can expect a lot of free Iranian weapons to use against Armenia.
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