@Rii:

1. There is no such animal right now as an opposing 5g (let alone 5g+) fighter. What is out there are years behind the F-35 in development.
2. You’re forgetting that the F-35 is a F-16 replacement, not an F-15 replacement.
3. Let’s wait till they actually fly publically (with all the avionics & weapons loaded) before we start claiming that they beat the F-35.

I think I’ll call on SpudmanWP to handle this one:

You cannot plan development & purchases today based on today’s battlefield, but on what it could or would likely be in 10/20/30/40 years.

One of the reasons why we need more F-35s is due to there only being 187 F-22s (with ~120 or so combat coded)

It has a longer combat range that what it is replacing while being more survivable.

The same would be true of a Block 60 F-16. So what? The point is that it isn’t well-suited to USAF’s long-term requirements. And neither is the short-legged F-22 for that matter. 6th gen is likely to be in the F-111 class — at least.

The Iranian maintenance facilities for the F14 are not sub-standard by any reasonable measure, they are a replication of Grumman’s manufacturing and maintenance facilities in the US. In the 70’s Iran paid America a vast sum to upgrade their local aerospace industry and install manufacturer grade maintenance facilities. It is one of reasons why Iran has been so able to keep its legacy US fleet running even with the post revolution purges.

This Grumman promotional documentary explains:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hfbz50gwsRM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVlrqv30o1k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rWffHA6A1R4&list=PLB52A0DC8D621C046
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VIz9nt8cutw&list=PLB52A0DC8D621C046

Thanks for the clips; interesting stuff!

Yes, Russia is strong and has a bright future — brighter than Japan, certainly. Lots of people underestimate Russia but going to the other extreme by comparing it to China doesn’t add credibility. Adjusted for MIC, geopolitics, etc. Russia is likely to emerge and remain as the third or fourth most important state in the global system for the forseeable future. No need to get greedy. :p

Should be a relatively conservative program for service-entry in early 2030s with more ambitious proposals (DEW, hypersonics, etc.) merged with concept formerly known as the 2037 bomber. Doubt they’ll be that smart tho.

More fears about a “death-spiral”. http://news.yahoo.com/insight-expensive-f-35-fighter-risk-budget-death-201135601.html

“It’s a house of cards,” said one senior defense official who is familiar with the F-35 program, but was not authorized to speak publicly. “We have finally started improving performance on the program and efficiency in testing, and bang, we get this budget challenge.”

What budget challenge? DoD budget is at near-Reagan levels even with full sequestration. The Pentagon wouldn’t know a budget challenge even if one came up and screamed ‘Sea Control Ship’ in its face. :rolleyes:

More accurate appraisal would suggest that there is no conceivable level of wanton fiscal profligacy that can make this program work as intended. The disconnect from reality, enshrined in the program from conception, is simply too vast to bridge.

Ultimately the failure of the F-35 program isn’t really a problem for the United States (except insofar as it reflects more systemic issues) as the nation doesn’t actually need to replace the vast majority of the aircraft F-35 was intended to replace, but until the inevitable dawn of that reality it’s fun to watch USAF et al. attempt to fit round peg into square hole.

+1

The irony of folks rejecting economic projections (and the strategic implications thereof) over the course of 30-40 years, whilst simultaneously talking of the need to procure e.g. F-35 with the challenges of the next 30-40 years in mind never ceases to amuse.

so any estimate as of now is a bit premature.

If estimating operating costs more than a decade and dozens of airframes down the line is premature, imagine how premature signing up for the program in 2001 would’ve been. :rolleyes:

Well that has to rank as one of the more bizarre posts in recent memory. Mirage F1 vs. F-22 and F-35 indeed. :rolleyes: