Semi-LobsterFirst serbian basic trainers now Czech “fighters”..they sure love them eastern european.
perhaps next they can order some PT-91 Twardys for the Army and Gayducks for the navy
It wouldn’t be so ridiculous the L-159 a ‘fighter’ if they were re-engined with the afterburning F125-GA-100 variant of the F124 the L-159 uses already. Some of these L-159 have been in storage for nearly a decade, is there any refurbishment necessary of these aircraft were to be exported?
Also is this deal for the single seat L-159 ‘combat aircraft’ or the two seat L-159T1 trainers? If its the L-159T1 I believe this is just part of the competition for a tender of advanced training aircraft for the Iraqi air force, the KAI T-50 and I believe the M-346
Semi-LobsterTejas tested with the Derby medium range missile which will be its primary air-to-air weapon
Semi-LobsterF-5E was built as a light, cheap, aircraft. Much cheaper to maintain & operate than Viggen. Kfir & Cheetah are also simpler, lighter, cheaper aircraft than Viggen. All of the above types, including F-4E benefit from spares availability from numerous sources (Kfir & Cheetah can lever off F-4 & Mirage sales).
For the secondhand buyer, Viggen had the disadvantages of the F-4 (large, complex) without the advantages of a large & widespread user base. Also, note that the Turks, Greeks, & others who have spent a lot on refurbishing & upgrading F-4s already had a large number in service, experience in operating & supporting them, & considerable investment in infrastructure, spares & training.
The availability of secondhand Mirage IIIs for cannibalizing also works in their favour. The existing global network of countries purchasing and retiring aircraft offers a steady supply of parts is key to operating older aircraft nowadays since the best way to get parts is to get it from another aircraft since the manufacturer has long since ceased production of parts. Well that definitely applies to the physical operation of the aircraft. While infrastructure and familiarity leads other countries to continue to operate existing aircraft. I also totally forgot how heavy the Viggen is! 😀
I guess this is also why New Zealand is having so much difficulty in selling their Skyhawks
Semi-LobsterIn their last years (before Eurocanards and F-22 had really got into their stride) the JA 37s were arguably the most capable interceptors around – at least in terms of functionality. AMRAAM in every mode, true multi-target capability, the best datalink in the air, active/passive radar modes, big colour screen etc etc …
… BUT …
like all aircraft of their era they had become hugely expensive to operate. Plus, their true worth could only really be realised if the necessary C2 networks were in place, and that the US allowed the export of AMRAAM etc. Any or all of these three things would rule out any ‘budget-conscious’ South American or African air arms. Sadly.
Expenses are a problem but how much more is it to operate refurbished F-5Es like Kenya has recently purchased, or the Kfirs and Cheetahs Colombia and Ecuador operate or even the F-4s the Turkish Air Force is pumping so much money into refurbishing and upgrading themselves?
Semi-LobsterFrom huzhigeng, who leaked accurate details of J-20 years ago
J-20 has EODAS
from here, #147
http://lt.cjdby.net/viewthread.php?tid=1128215
I thought the PLANAF phased out the Green radome. With the J-8F/Hs the radomes are black when they used to be green on the J-8Ds. JH-7s have a green radome while newer JH-7As have black radomes.
Semi-LobsterThere still isn’t a lot of information about the Nammer, the ‘penultimate’ Kfir variant. How different was the Nammer prototype to the Kfir C.10?
Semi-LobsterWith a race between just the Typhoon and the Rafale now what will probably tip the scale in either’s favour is probably technology transfer. Both have already mentioned rather substantial deference of technology to India and HAL but I wonder between between the Eurofighter consortium or Dassault will up the ante with even more promises to work with the Indian aviation industry?
Semi-LobsterIt won’t have any impact as the F-X2 has been cancelled and replaced by the F-X3.
Well uhh…. yah, my bad still living in the past!;) Maybe I should have referred to it just as the ‘Brazilian fighter jet tendery thinger thing competition bonanza’ 😀
Semi-LobsterI wonder how the elimination of the Gripen and Super Hornet from India’s MMRCA tender will effect the F-X2 tender for Brazil. If India ordered the Gripen it would lower the production costs of any Brazilian purchase of Rafales as well.
Semi-LobsterFirstly, as others have already pointed out, there is a huge gulf in capabilities between CAC (J10 and J20) and SAC (J8 and endless flanker re-hashes).
What more, CAC already have the J10B, JF17, J20 and numerous UAV projects ongoing. As capable as they are, with that many parallel projects running, it would be pretty amazing if they had the capacity to also work on a naval J10.
Giving SAC the naval fighter contract is also political as that gives SAC work and income to keep them going to prevent CAC from becoming a monopoly in Chinese military aviation.
With all of this in mind, it is quite possible that the PLAN might have seen the J15 as a bit of a ‘stop-gap’ measure instead of the blueprint for all future PLAN carrier fighters. If that is the case, they could have easily limited R&D funding (possibly saving it for CAC a few years down the line when they have the time and resources to start working on their naval fighter thinking they will get a better fighter for their money) to the point where a Su33 rip-off was the only viable option.
Bare in mind that SAC has been making Flanker derivatives for well over a decade now, and with the number of airframes they have pumped out, they should have a lot of experience with the type, so the J15 should be able to be made fairly quickly after the completion of the testing (which itself should also be pretty straight forward given the experience SAC has in Flankers and the fact they had a Su33 prototype to study). With the J15 being so similar to other Flanker versions operated by the PLAAF and PLANAF, they should also be able to bring down unit cost as well as enjoy a lot of saves on logistics and training.
I have a feeling that the rumored medium sized 5th gen China is planning on developing will primarily be for future PLAN carriers, since the PLAAF has the J20, and there is absolutely no need, and very likely, not enough funding for the PLA to pursue an all-stealth fighter force like the USAF.
That’s what I think to, SAC so far has no exports and no other projects other than Flankers. I believe J-8 production has ended as well (although there is still work upgrading J-8Ds to J-8H/F and converting J-8s to the surveillance models, and J-8G SEAD aircraft. IIRC the J-8T was cancelled…. or at the very least I haven’t heard anything about it in forever so we can all assume its cancelled). Therefore SAC needs a project to keep working and a carrierbourne Flanker was the best task for both SAC and for the PLANAF. IIRC there have been several articles going around saying that some PLAN higher ups are talking about two Chinese built carriers to begin construction once the Varyag is completed. Building a carrier, even with past experience is a long and laborious for any shipyard. By the time these two other carrier that are rumoured to come about are ready for service in…. god knows how long, I’m sure somebody will have a new model of carrierbourne fighter for the PLANAF.
Semi-LobsterI mean seriously, why make an aircraft that has “only a passing resemblance to su-33 and was conceptualized way back in early 80’s and is a totally different aircraft” when they have proven themselves to be capable of making complex aircrafts as J-20. Even though anyone with an anti-china bent believes that j-10 a rip-off, there are enough design differences to inspire confidence among chinese nationalists, and with J-20 i was convinced that chinese designers have come of age, hence the disappointment with j-15
The PLANAF needed a proven, cost effective and expedient aircraft for the Varyag which is rapidly reaching completion. The development of the J-15 was also fairly rapid since the maiden flight was in 2009. Pilots needed to be trained and prepared for carrier operations. Even the PLANAF’s chosen trainer for carrier operations, the JL-9H was chosen over the L-15 since it was more or less already completed, and cheapest to operate. China would rather have a fully operational carrier on day 1 rather than have a carrier with no aircraft ready to take off from it.
Semi-LobsterI know that. i just didn’t want to start a flame war :diablo:. Lets not call a spade a spade, rather call it J-15 or whatever designation is allotted to it.
I wonder if NATO will ever run out of letters for all these Flanker variants :p
Semi-LobsterAs an aviation enthusiast, I am a little disappointed with J-15. Of course we had been hearing rumors for years regarding an aircraft that has “only a passing resemblance to su-33 and was conceptualized way back in early 80’s and is a totally different aircraft” but i expected the first chinese naval fighter to be based on j-10 rather than j-11. Modifying J-10 for naval use might had made a point about their aircraft designing abilities.
This really isn’t a navalized J-11B at all. This is an Su-33 with modern avionics and electronics system for the most part. It’s based off a prototype Su-33 purchased from the Ukraine. Most Chinese aviation forums are pointing out the electronics, radar, and weapons systems though were most likely all Chinese and far newer than the circa 1980’s equipment of the Russian Su-33.
Semi-LobsterThe Gripen has been dropped.
So has the Super Viper, Super Hornet and Super Fulcrum.
Now its down to the Typhoon and the Rafale!
Semi-LobsterMica isn’t comparable to the IRIS-T, which is an IR-homing short-range missile. Mica has active radar homing (the original mode – an IR model was developed later) & a much greater range. It’s definitely closer to AMRAAM than IRIS-T.
And Meteor is in production, & will be available for all the European MRCA candidates.
Ah, you’re right, sorry about that. 😮 you of course are very much right. I made the post in a hurry, I was thinking of the IR MICA. Thanks! 😀
Sign In
