AdmarilZhengHeit go to show that even the US big people do not really have intention to consider China a enemy. we are big trading partner and the US is in debt to China because of big spending and big loaning. it is not like Russia and US when they really dont like each other and submarine showing up next to the fleet will be a big issue you see.
AdmarilZhengHeAdmarilZhengHe
another point!you said the israelis would be happy because its a fighter that has been shot down alot!?if you look at the nations that used the fulcrum in combat you would see that most of these airforces did not properly maintain their fighters nor had they the money to upgrade them nor had the money to afford flight hours for their pilots.now tell me how they were supposed to fare any better given those circumstances?they could not!if the roles were reversed and the countries flying the maintained upgraded fighters now had just their F16s that barely made it of the ground and havent had a proper overhaul since their delivery,how would they do against a trained air force with proper tactics and procedures!?
oh and the israelis actually rated the fulcrum quite highly and said it was a brilliant weapons platform if used the way it was supposed to!
maybe you answer the question you did yourself. so you say if they have money to take care of their plane, it would be better. so when other country do have money what do they do? they buy something else! 😉 most get rid of MiG-29, put it in storage, or prefer other aircraft instead like Mirage 2000, Su-30, etc.
Also GarryB do not make sense.. he say the fuel is base on the MiG-29M, but we are talking about MiG-29SMT, then he say some MiG-29SMT use MiG-29M wing, but we do not even know if the one that fly to England even use the one with MiG-29M wing but he seem to claim it is, but the picture show that it is just regular MiG-29 wing with 6 hard point on both wing. :confused:
AdmarilZhengHeGents,
I think you may be missing something very fundamental in this debate. Aircraft Carriers are every bit as useful in defence as when tasked for offense.
We’ve seen the actions of the US 7th Fleet when sabers have been rattled across the Taiwan Straits. Now the warships of TF70 would be deployed MUCH less readily if they could be facing an encirclement scenario beween the anvil of PRC landbased tactical airpower and the hammer of a PLAN Carrier Airwing somewhere behind them.
A modest PLAN carrier and group would be unlikely, on its own, to be able to face down a fully dialled-in USN CVSG with full attachments, as a component of a combined sea/landbase-air defensive strategy though it would certainly raise the cost of operations in China’s maritime sphere of interest.
thankwo for bringing it back to topic. too bad there is much anti-Chinese feeling here that lead to other things by bad members.
yes it is useful to defend Chinese islands against country who keep violating ocean boundaries of China. Since there is not many air bases in South China Sea, a carrier make things easier to patrol islands with.
it be best if there can be a carrier version of JH-7 or J-10, but we maybe have to settle for Su-33 which is now getting old and obsolete. Do anyone know if China will make improved copy?
AdmarilZhengHeWhat has this got to do with modern military aviation?
They didn’t buy from Ukraine, they bought them straight from Russia,
HAF doesn’t need a Chinese copy of the S-300, as they have the original.
they have Crotale, so no point in buying the Chinese copy HQ-7
Velos Sparrow is in the same class as China’s HQ-64
Stingers are probably better than any Chinese MANPADs out there
Add to all this the TOR M1 and Patriot 🙂 , and you’ll find out that they don’t need any SAM that China currently produces.
and why do many country by J-7 when they can buy MiG-21? because China make the same thing for cheaper duh duh duh. why do greece need to spend more for the same thing. use the brain a little bit and realize the reality :rolleyes:
AdmarilZhengHeAll Mig-29 models have a centreline pylon. The early Mig-29s had 6 wing points, while the Mig-29M introduced the 8 hardpoint wing. The Mig-29K and SMT upgraded aircraft also use the Mig-29M wing with 8 hardpoints. With the centreline point that makes 9 points.
so how much is internal fuel size of MiG-29 and MiG-29SMT? and how come you bring in MiG-29M? no one want to buy it. just want these two information thankwo.
AdmarilZhengHeit is impressive. China will release the next stealth fighter before Russia
AdmarilZhengHewhy the big deal? US send P-3 to spy on China all the time by the border..so what wrong if China do the same?
AdmarilZhengHeThe USA will cut-off nothing. Egypt is an important corner-stone of US foreign policy. The USA is not intrested in a similar fate like Iran, when it comes to Egypt.
you are right. Suez Cannal is great. That is why American, China and European cannot cut off Egypt, alot of trade go through there. You know, if Egypt have no Suez Cannal, then no one will care if Israel bomb Egypt.
Russia maybe different case.. they do not really need cannal as much because they have rail road that goes to the pacific already. that is why Egypt cannot choke Russia by the ball like they can do with other country.
AdmarilZhengHeMalaysia has a claim over the Spratleys too (they have Scorpenes), and no, the Spratleys issue is not resolved in the international court of justice yet, so China is as much an illegal occupier of the islands as any of the others. :rolleyes:
If the carrier is built to counter Vietnam and Philippines then this is pure stupidity – the PLAN doesn’t need a carrier to beat either of them. (Or are the PLAN’s new 052Cs, 052Bs and Sovremennys in your opinion so lousy that the PLAN needs an additional carrier to be useful against the fleets of Vietnam and Philippines? 😀 )
Finally, Okinawa is Japanese territory. Try invading it and see America’s response. :rolleyes: :diablo:
oh and why you bring US into it? you just keep wanting to make scenario where the Chinese have to fight everyone because you are anti China. The US and China will not fight for a long time because business is key important! even if US and China decide to fight. China do not need to use military, all they need do is call in the big debt. China own alot of US money now.
The carrier is needed to provide air cover for ships, Vietnam now have Su-27 that can reach spratley now so ships need very good protection. US ships are good, so from what you say, they do not need a carrier to go around with them then? :rolleyes: your logic do not make sense.
Also Okinawa use to be long to China. You can go on the island and see yourself the Chinese influence. Japan conquer Okinawa.
AdmarilZhengHehow India screw itself? India is the only country which has the money and can get the best defense systems from both east/west.
oh so if they can do that how come they don have F-22 or Typhoon or JSF with Su-35UB or Leopard2A6? the guy up above you say the british will not sell them Radar?
even if they will sell them it, it do not mean India will always make the right purchase. how come they are buying LCA? is it the best fighter in the market? :rolleyes:
maybe your indian pride make you blind.
AdmarilZhengHePay attention! India has been offered ex-RN Sea Harriers & rejected them. The UK wouldn’t sell the radars, India didn’t want them without radars. India is already building its own carrier, & the navy wants to build another, so that with ex-Gorshkov, they’ll have 3. All will be able to operate CTOL aircraft.
Gottit now? You’re proposing a possible future which has already been rendered out of date by events.
I see, so you saying India screw themself over by not going for it. sad story then. they could easily go to Israel for radar and then build carrier for stvol and no need to consider corkob retrofit. but maybe not so surprising, they still strong on old programs after all.
AdmarilZhengHeWASP are huge and man intensive ships. They are also STOVL carriers but are basically used as massive helicopter amphib carriers. They might be able to convert to take more than STOVL but not sure about what fighters it could take. Maybe Rafales? Catapults would have to be installed, maybe electric.
Australia concidered them, but rejected them. Too much to buy, too much to man, to much to fit with STOVL. 40,000 ton US ships aren’t cheap, crew of a 1000 or something. UK has more money to play with, but not a lot more. BDP was a better buy. For either as a regular LHD, or as a amphibious, or as a full carrier. Crew of only 270 ment it wasn’t unreasonable either was the purchase price. Australia will have two of the largest light carriers out their at over 24,000 tons each with the smallest option.
The future of the light carrier is shakey. Until the F-35B starts turning up in numbers fleets are stuck with quite old harriers which are either retired or in the process of retiring. They will be harder and harder to run.
JSF won’t be cheap in 35B form. Try 100 million a pop. So even fitting a carrier out with 10 of them would cost over a billion. So going cheap on the carrier doesn’t make sense.
show me the proof that 100 million is the price of unit by itself.. no one order it yet so there is no real price. if you do have price then show me long plan cost of it when you compare operation fees of MiG-29K over 10 year period with JSF? when you buy airplane you do not just pay one time, you pay over life time in maintenance, life cycle, rehauling etc. so please provide this information and compare it to price versus capability ratio ok?
AdmarilZhengHeI like these pictures. Greece ever think of bying Chinese SAM systems? if possible? i know they buy from Ukraine before.
our two country have alot in comonn. you guys have problem with Turkey, we have long history of fighting and conquering Tu-jue, whcih is Chinese for Turks.
cheers 🙂
AdmarilZhengHeYou’ve misunderstood:
ALL the Sea Harriers in the UK have already been retired. Those in the best condition are stored, & for sale. The remainder are being scrapped, or given to museums, etc. If no customers are found for the good ones, they’ll also be scrapped or given away to museums.
Invincible is officially in reserve, & being kept there for a few more years. She will then be offered for sale. By the time she is sold, it is very unlikely indeed that we will have any Sea Harriers for sale. They’ll all be in museums, gate guards at naval air stations, or scrapped.
Do you really think it would be sensible to buy JSF for a ship which will be 40 years old by the time India could take delivery of its first aircraft? Also, Invincible is uncomfortably small for the F-35, which weighs twice as much as the Harrier. It’s been reported she’d need deck strengthening & new lifts. Worth it? I think not.
oh so they retire already? good now they can buy them or reserve them. alot of ship is old, i dont know if you know that. how old do you think India’s current carrier is? 40 year old ship will actually be a step up!! espeshally if it is a well maintain ship! also they can use their regular Sea Harrier on it.. no need to do new pilot training like they do with MiG-29. by the time JSF can be bought, India already can produce their own carrier too. you worry for nothing. relax and realize the reality. 😎
AdmarilZhengHe. SMT Migs have flown to Farnborough from Moscow without inflight refuelling (but with ferry tanks) and landed with 1,000kgs of fuel in the tanks. The SMT is hardly the interceptor to defend the end of the runway any more.
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Farnborough to Moscow is not that far and no one ever proof that they di dnot do with out inflight refuelling, it is the thing everyone keep saying about MiG-29 but no one ever have evidence of it, just popular myth to hide MiG-29 lack of gas. the old one have bad range problem that is why it always have to carry fuel tank on middle pylon. so you show me the math that the little bit bigger fuel tank on give it much more range on the SMT ok? lets see you proof it. and even if it need all those fuel tank to fly where will you put the actual weapon? it do not have many hard point like on other fighters.
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