EF and F-16 having the same operating costs?
Clearly, Austrian AF didn’t get that memo. Rather, according to them, the cost to buy and operate F-16s for 30 years could be less than the cost to operate EFs for 30 years…

I read in the local newspaper today there’s also a new tank on the table. If so, great, let everyone do what they do best. I.e. the French take the lead in the fighter program, with ze Germans leading the tank program.
I suppose the new fighter is also a Rafale M replacement? That would be great, limits weight from the start. What’s the weight limit on CdG?

‘Heatballs’ – flares?

Obviously it’s flares. But Mr. Darabos referred to them as heatballs aka wärmekugeln.

According to this article, Austria wants to have a decision by next year, so the EFs can be replaced starting in 2020. Experts say options are JAS 39E/F or F-16.
Gripen E by 2020? I don’t think so, let alone Gripen F. Likely though the media added the E/F bit themselves while experts only mentioned Gripen.
F-16 imho are highly unlikely. Not because they’re old, as if anyone cared. They’re actually well known in the public thanks to hollywood, you know, Tom Cruise and his F-16. :sleeping: But the F-16 is made by evil Americans with their evil president and is an evil NATO bomber. While the friendly Gripen is made by the friendly and neutral Swedes with their equally friendly King. Austrians like Royals, reminds them of the good old times. Nevermind also that Gripen is fully NATO compatible.

1. Under current plans Typhoon and Saab 105 are out from 2020 onwards. So flight hours probably won’t be increased on those types.
2. More pilots and flight hours means more budget allocated for that task obviously. The future savings come from lower operating cost of Gripen or whatever it’s going to be.
3. Austria has money but chooses not to spend it on defence.

Right now they are using the saab 105 in air policing duties as a cheaper alternative to flying the typhoon for the task. Probably by keeping the typhoons the new trainer would also needed to do operational tasks like the saab 105 fleet?

No, the 10 “high efficiency trainer” aircraft would not be part of the operational fleet.

The FA-50 already have EL/M- 2032 radar and RWR, chaff/flare dispensers.

BVR AAM? ECM, MAWS? IRST/FLIR? Please accept Austria will not select the FA-50.

That statement by the Austrians is almost breathtaking! They were the ones who ran a contest that had an almost absurd list of required features for the winner. They were the ones who decided to down grade the order from Tranche 2 to 1 and then asked for all the defensive aids plus other major avionics from GPS through to radio systems to be stripped out and they have the gall to say that the aircraft has limited equipment!

Yes. Keep in mind however the government that ordered the EF was not the same that messed up the order later.

Now they are acting all shocked that a twin engine multi role air superiority fighter is expensive to run when all they needed was a supersonic WVR point defence fighter!

Apparently, operating cost wasn’t even a factor in the decision making process in 2002. Why? Because EF had not reached IOC yet so no numbers were available. So rather than making an educated guess, operating cost was ignored. So on one hand you have EF, on the other hand Gripen, which was offered only 2-6% cheaper. (can’t remember exactly) Saab were too confident… But still, would have been ok if they sticked to the original contract. Austria could affort a fleet of 15 EFs easily if they wanted to.

They certainly don’t have any particular need for a BVR missile considering they are mainly used to intercept and identify other aircraft. Pretty much every supersonic fighter available on the western market is overkill for their needs. Part of me says the KAI F-50 is spiritually the best fit matched with something like the L-59 as a SAAB-105 replacement but on balance they are probably best going for Gripen C/D as the high end choice. Farm out support and training to Sweden or the other European Gripen operators and carry over their IRIS-T. The Gripen even has the BK27 like Typhoon so they can carry over the ammunition.

They said they want all weather capability and self protection gear and whatnot. So pretty high end actually. KAI FA-50 can’t offer that.

IR missiles are not all weather weapons.

So, I’ve read the report and watched the press conference.

The task force came to the conclusion that supersonic jet fighters are required, armed trainers are not suitable.

The fighters have to be equipped with effective weapons (meaning IR and radar missiles) and self protection systems. That system needs to be able to detect missile launches and provide active and passive countermeasures.

They came up with 6 models plus the reference model. Projected life cycle costs for 2020-2049 are shown below:
[ATTACH=CONFIG]254618[/ATTACH]

The reference model is what was planned before, i.e. keep the 15 T1 EF and buy 10 advanced jet trainers.
Variant 1: update the 15 current EFs to latest standards and buy 10 advanced jet trainers.
Variant 2: update the 15 current EFs, buy 3 additional EF twin seaters, and buy 10 “high efficiency trainers”
Variant 3: buy 15 new single seat plus 3 new twin seat fighters, and buy 10 “high efficiency trainers”
Variant 4: update the 15 current EFs to latest standards
Variant 5: update the 15 current EFs, buy 3 additional EF twin seaters
Variant 6: buy 15 new single seat plus 3 new twin seat fighters

Note potential revenue from getting rid of the current T1 fleet is not included.
Obviously, the models without new trainers would require the outsourcing of more training to foreign air forces. Hence f.e. variant 5 is less expensive than variant 4 because the most expensive part of the training can be done at home.
Note 4 of the proposed models would keep the current EF fleet. And all the single fleet models i.e. without trainers are thought to be less expensive.
The task force recommends the (potentially) least expensive options 5 or 6.

Now, the defence minister decided option 6 is the way to go. Meaning 15+3 new fighters, more training to be outsourced. Not part of this study is the replacement of the PC-7 fleet btw. But the minister said those need to be replaced pretty soon also, with a fleet of “high efficiency trainers”.

But, and here’s the but, even though his decision is final, and gov to gov negotiations are beginning now if I understood correctly, that is no contract. To sign the actual purchase contract, a resolution by the council of ministers is required. And there are going to be elections in Austria October the 15th. So no one knows who’s going to be in charge later this year. The new gov could overthrow everything.

My remarks regarding the report: Aside from using Calibri, the obvious usage of Alenia Aermacchi nomenclature for the trainers makes this report look unprofessional. Also, why would they need 10 trainers in options 1,2,3 (3 is my preferred option) when those trainers would not be part of the operational force? 10 trainers for a force of 18 fighters / 36 pilots? 10 trainers is understandable if they need to cover part of the operational needs as in the reference model. So I think the cost of options 1-3 are overrated. Generally, the life cycle costs are not explained properly. What’s included? Did they remember a new jet would require a new infrastructure also? Hard to believe really a new type would be that much cheaper than to simply upgrade the T1 fleet. On the other hand, they considered that in the cost projections. The preferred option could very well be 573 Mio. more expensive than the reference model. Also, option 3 with trainers could be way cheaper than option 6. Since this is all based on non binding requests, things could get more expensive pretty quick in the future. Without trainers of their own, Austrian Air Force would be totally dependant on foreign air forces, I wonder what that does to the costs…

Funny, when asked if the 18 EFs as originally ordered by Austria would fulfill all the requirements and the re-negotiation back then was a bad deal, the minister could not give a clear answer. How could he as it was his party that’s responsible for this mess.