mig-31bmHave you ever read a transcript of many “Official Military Interviews”?…..stupidity and idiotic comments and slang use is prevalent….also, this was NOT an “Official” Statement…but one made by someone that is INVOLVED with the F35’s….NOT some brass wearing turkey lining his nest and following the Company lines…..your knowledge of the West and of North America on a whole is somewhat outdated I think, and of Americans in particular. Apparently you don;t believe that there is the “Official” line, usually a fallacy , an story for the masses….then there is the reverse, the disbelievers…somewhere in the middle is usually the guys that know….and this to me is a reporter that talked to a guy in the middle, someone that KNOWS, but isn;t tied to the Official line.
And MY feelings for the F35 aside…..it has been YOU that has been slamming BS and proposed weapons capabilities and such down as Fact…and they aren;t….you still cannot even admit my points many posts ago, where inherently right…that the SAME laws of physics and Aeronautics that saw any plane that hangs a whole bunch of stuff under it is going to go slower and handle worse….and in the case of the F35, it WILL become more radar observable…period….The F 35 is not immune to those facts….no matter how hard you try to turn it around….
1) since the article isnot an official interview , how would you know that it just someone make that interview up? like they always do, all the time?, that why i question the valid of it
2) as i have explained before : legacy fighter mostly rely on agility to survive again high level of threat, thus they also carry very little weapons if the threat is high because carry alot of weapon reduce their agility, they wouldn’t carry more weapon than F-35 when there alot of enemy fighter flying around, or alot of enemy SAM sites, when there is little threat then they can carry a lot of weapons,
F-35 rely on stealth and situation awareness to survive high level of threat, when the threat is high then you will need stealth and you have to carry weapon internally so only limited amount of weapon , when the threat is low you can carry weapon externally so can carry alot of bomb and missiles , do you understand now? , also the reason why F-35 can carry that much weapon is due to the fact that future weapon are very small, so can be carry on double rack such as BRU-57, BRU-69/A or quart rack such as BRU-61 hence 1 pylon can carry 4 weapons
iam not saying that F-35 not going slower, less maneuver with weapons externally, yes it does, every fighter does, but it will only do that when the threat is very low, the same as every other fighters will only carry their maximum load when the threat is not high and they dont need high agility!
mig-31bmyour concepts of what the F35 is “supposed” to be for and do is slanted….it’s NOT a FIGHTER, NOT an Interceptor etc…it;s supposed to be a STRIKE AIRCRAFT…therefore carrying weapons to STRIKE…a handful of little 250 lb bombs maybe wonderful for Terry Taliban driving on a flat desert in a pickup truck….sorry, NOT ENOUGH BANG to breach any defensive positions/bunkers or hardened redoubts..OK for anything but a Bunker?…do you have any idea on how explosives work?…even in WW2…250lb bombs were found to be incapable of causing enough damage…SDB, you do know that means SMALL DIAMETER BOMBS right?…not a missile?…..small and hard to intercept?…sure…still larger than a RPG 7 Round, yet those can be “Intercepted”, even from close range and at level trajectory…Systems such as TROPHY etc. will be adapted and developed to stop a SDB with in short effect I would imagine… ( see I can play FUTURE abilities too!) as for the MBDA SPEAR (Selective Precision Effects At Range )…it is a BRITISH , RAF requirement, it is NOT even developed for use by the Typhoons and / or Tornadoes yet…the F35 might get there eventually, it may . MAY be ready for initial deployment sometime after 2015….and NOT for the F35 for some time after that….
You just go on an on like all these weapons are actually fitted to the F35 and ready to go……I mean the SPEAR will in all honesty be developed and tested BY THE RAF, for THEIR F35’s long before the USAF gets around to testing it and maybe making it operational for the USAF ones.
So your F35 is going to flying alot of low and medium altitude missions?……I mean nothing like opening up the good ol’ Mark 1 eyeball for AA fire on them right?….nice that it can out turn an F15 at Low altitude, you do realize that there is far more to aerial military flying than turning right?….you say that the F35 can outclimb an F15?….out dive an F 15? what about at high altitude, you know where planes tend to play?….not down in the single and low double digits….
Funny, how there are NEVER conclusive reports from things like CAPABILITY FLYOFFS, say between an F 15 and the F35… or the F16 and the F35…never anything concrete, just a vague description by a few pilots… it’s sorta like flying a…. or almost like…..
I have no doubt that eventually the F35 will go “Operational”…there is no choice now….billions spent on it, Nations pressured and prodded into “buying ” it, everyone watching to see what happens…..it;s like a train wreck…horrible to watch, catastrophic results, but no one can look away. The USA can NEVER admit a flop, could NEVER stop the program now..not and maintain any integrity at all.
1) the idea that F-35 is only a Strike aircraft is from people who hate it, the nah sayer, F-35 is a multi role aircraft, it was supposed to replace F-16, F-18, A-10, harrier not just a Striker
2) do you understand how inaccurate bomb in WW ii compared to today? , most weapon today are designed to have low collateral damage
3) SDB I actually have really good penetration performance
4) even Sabot round can be intercept, however the idea is you can carry alot of SDB II, Spear, thus even though many can be intercept, many will slip through the defense, their low signature will also ensure they can go close before being intercepted thus can cause damage even if being shot down
5) SPEAR is designed to use by RAF f-35, it basically an SDB II with engine, that why i listed it
6) F-35 will out turn and out roll the F-15, F-15 will likely out climb and out dive it if start from altitude, but it not really matter because most fighter today have HMD and hobs missiles thus maneuver isnot that important, F-35 still more likely have advantages in dogfight due to DAS and DIRCM
7) plane dont dogfight at high altitude due to very big turn radius at high altitude ( like 30-40 km depending on speed) , also fly at high altitude mean it really hard for you to evade medium, long range SAM because the air is thin
mig-31bmWould you like to read what I wrote again?…I CLEARLY stated that while the F35 is still in testing phase, EVERY OTHER AIRCRAFT of the type, excluding the Grippen NG ( as there are NONE flying) is REGULARILY being updated, the EF is having a new AESA designed and mounted, new targeting pods are being developed fairly regularily.
And while everything ELSE seems to be moving forward to becoming BETTER, the F35 is stagnant, not even capable with what it has now….a mute fish for at least another 4 -5 years…
THAT is FAR, FAR from contradicting myself…..
Look at YOUR post for contadictory…..”Its not “obsolete” This is all based on the idea on that the EOTS won’t be able to do exactly everything that the latest pods can. However it can still do many other things that even the latest and greatest pods can’t do.”
Sorry Mig031, IF the F35 is incapable of even NOW doing what other EOTS/ pods can do…IT IS OBSOLETE….once capability moves PAST where something is, it is in catch up mode…..doesn;t matter what the EOTS on the F35 will do, eventually, right now…it is doing LESS than what is on F16’s, F/A 18 SH’s etc..RIGHT NOW blowing up ISIS bad guys.
the thing iam trying to say is, you treat the future upgraded of other aircraft as if they have them right now, while you basically said anything F-35 will have doesnt exist! how many EF-2000 have AESA radar? how many kind of air to ground weapon it can carry compared to f-16 ?
if the other pod can be upgraded why cant they upgraded f-35 EOTS?, you basically treat any other aircraft as upgradeable but denied any future upgrade related to F-35?
mig-31bmProblem is this….LM designed and built the stupid plane with the system INSIDE, there fore the size constraints on any up grade will definate, there is no further room in the plane right?…..where external pods can be redesigned, upgraded, fitted easily to any variety of planes…..
based on whatever you want it to be I guess…regardless, the SNIPER ATP – SE is now the norm, and THAT is ten years more advanced than the F35’s system….as is the LITENING SE…so you are going to dispute the fact that the F35 system is at least ten years behind these newest developments?…. and sadly the SNIPER ATP – SE is even designed and built by Lockheed-Martin….so much for proactive planning eh?…..
Moronic perhaps, yet as it is , the F35 is apparently incapable of providing the troops on the ground with video…upgraded, improved, likely but when?…….certainly not before they get what it has working…..lol…and that;s what expected in how many years?… 5 or 6 ?
and in American vernacular, the use of “dude” is far more prevalent and accepted that one may be led to believe.
Sniper-XR , ATFLIR, EOTS all consist of line replace able unit that why upgrade them is easy
secondly SNIPER ATP- SE only go in to service this year so it not the norm by any mean how many aircraft now actually have the latest pod? and no it not 10 years more advanced than the system on F-35 as i have explained before! EOTS is basically a podthat is inside F-35 rather than outside! so if there is space to improve the sniper-xr there is space to improve EOTS, simple as that
and i know that you hate the f-35 but to believe that a serious official military interview involved the word dude is quite ridiculous
mig-31bmSTOP…you can;t keep “forecasting” FUTURE developments…I mean really, the FUTURE will see X Wing Fighters too, with massive laser blasters…see, I can do it too….Until the stuff is developed tested and produced, it is SPECULATION.
Your points are also only good for the F/A 18 E/F…the Legacy F18 Hornet will be faster ARMED than the F35…….also far more maneuverable and better acceleration…range, yeh sure..F35 has a big gas tank…and they can blow up too…..LMAO
Your hardline stance fanning the F35 is seriously flawed….. from ability to weapons loads….the F35 is still YEARS from being anything more than a test bed….it can;t DO anything……yet everything else Other than the Grippen NG , IS out there right now doing the job…and being upgraded, with new targeting pods, AESA being developed and fitted etc….and all while the F35 still tries to get what it was designed with, 10 years ago, to work……..
what the hell? all these range and speed of f-35 i posted above have all been tested!
also in one sentence you say everything tested and fitted on f-35 is forecast future , and on the other you talk about system being upgraded, new targeting pod, AESA radar being fitted? stop contradicting yourself
f-18C carry less weapon than f-35, turn worse, dont have either SA, EW or stealth of F-35
mig-31bmOK, if you say so…I doubt that with 6 external hardpoints and it’s some what restrictive weapons bays the F35 is carrying such a load….and again, even if it did do so…IT IS NO BETTER than any other fighter out there….it no longer has “stealth” and it is even slower….
An F35 is better handling than an F15?…are you serious?……. sorry,it is certainly NOT more maneuverable than the F15 and again, as important as the “Stealth” may be…as soon as anything is hung EXTERNALLY it is no longer stealthy…
you seem to think that SPEAR or SDB II is some wonderful weapon system….you are talking about very small Ordnance…250 lb’s for the SDB’s…..and just how much better do you actually think the F35’s “performance” including range will be when it has external loads creating drag and slowing it down, and hampering it’s maneuverability?…
Fan on for sure my friend, and the day that an F35 is OPERATIONAL, and carries a weapons load anywhere even close to your speculative ones…well, it will be a fine day I guess…..till then, it is all rubbish and high hopes……you keep referencing METEOR, yet I didn;t think that the British Made Meteor was even capable of being F35 launched yet?….wow, I guess all the R&D and testing just flew by……thats something, I didn;t even think the RAF or the Euro Air Forces developing it where equipped with it yet….
1) ok let me explain it to you again : legacy fighter mostly rely on agility to survive again high level of threat, thus they also carry very little weapons if the threat is high because carry alot of weapon reduce their agility, they wouldn’t carry more weapon than F-35 when there alot of enemy fighter flying around, or alot of enemy SAM sites, when there is little threat then they can carry a lot of weapons,
F-35 rely on stealth and situation awareness to survive high level of threat, when the threat is high then you will need stealth and you have to carry weapon internally so only limited amount of weapon , when the threat is low you can carry weapon externally so can carry alot of bomb and missiles , do you understand now? , also the reason why F-35 can carry that much weapon is due to the fact that future weapon are very small, so can be carry on double rack such as BRU-57, BRU-69/A or quart rack suck as BRU-61 hence 1 pylon can carry 4 weapons
2) F-15 have very low wing loading + lack LERX so at low and medium altitude it will turn worse than an F-35, higher wing loading also mean F-35 have better roll rate! so yet it is more maneuver
3) SPEAR and SDB II are actually better than most weapon , they have multiple seeker so extremely
hard to jam or missed, they are small in size thus have low RCS, IR signature thus much harder to be detected or intercept, they can be carry in very large number thus allow aircraft to either attack many targets or overwhelming target defense, their range also pretty good around 100 km longer than most SAM can detect F-35, their only down side is small warhead , but unless you attack a bunker you wouldn’t really need big warhead!
4) no it not hope or anything like that! they are all been tested and develop now, it not just some make up story! you are talking like f-35 never gonna go operational
mig-31bmF-35C faster than the F-18? Not sure. More range than an F-18E with 3 tanks? not sure. More maneuvrable? The super hornet is very maneuvrable, so not sure. Cuda doesn’t exist.
The truth of the matter is that LM has ******** up the CV variant. It’s a pig in terms of speed/transsonic. That’s why now they’re searching left and right for a way to modify the airframe for the F/A-XX.
F/A-18E maximum speed at level flight in altitudes of 36,089 ft is mach 1.6 clean however it will be slower with weapon while F-35 carry weapon internally so F-35 is faster
F/A-18E combat radius: 390 nmi (449 mi, 722 km ) while F-35C combat radius is 610 nmi (1,130 km) so F-35 fly longer
F/A-18E turn tight but have bad acceleration , F-35C can turn as tight as F/A-18E but accelerate better , especially when both side carry weapon ,CUDA is being developed just like rail gun or DEW you dont have them now but will in future
mig-31bmSome negative comments for the F-35. Not sure how valid or not.
Typical yellow journalism at it’s finest. Hardly changed from the sort of stuff written about the XM1 tank, B-1 bomber, and AH-64 decades ago.
Where to begin? First of all it’s based on the Sniper XR which is still a relatively recent targeting pod with 3rd generation FLIR, hardly obsolete. The Sniper ATP-SE only entered service this year. There is no reason to believe that planned “Tech Refreshes” won’t at some point include new hardware for EOTS. In many respects EOTS is a self-contained unit, AFAIK it is officially considered a line-replaceable unit (LRU).
Both an IR laser marker and “video streaming” capability were planned for notional Block 4/5 upgrades years ago. While new documentation on plans for later Blocks isn’t public, I doubt any features have been cut. Considering that the F-35 can share video with other F-35’s via MADL the notion that it will not be improved to transmit this to ground FACs is moronic.
A lot of unnamed sources and little else. Why didn’t LM respond? Look at the date. The one unnamed source claiming there is no planning ahead, doesn’t seem in touch with reality here. EOTS looks to be quite “easily upgradable” for an internal system.
To steal a quote from SMSgt Mac, “Credible sources on acquisition programs don’t use the word ‘dude’ in discussing acquisition topics.”
http://www.f-16.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=26754&p=283287
mig-31bmReading through the last few posts, it seems to me that where the F-35 cannot be rivalled is on strike missions into defended air space with no external stores carried. However if ordnance is limited to 4000lb, how many aircraft would be need to be available to deliver the weight of ordnance required to achieve set objectives?
What about EOTS? If the current system is inadequate, how long to develop an adequate system? If it is going to need replacement, is that going to be an extra cost for buyers of the aircraft with the current EOTS?
Its not “obsolete” This is all based on the idea on that the EOTS won’t be able to do exactly everything that the latest pods can. However it can still do many other things that even the latest and greatest pods can’t do.
this is right up there with saying that if you are not driving a 2015 model car, its obsolete. EOTS will still do what a vast majority of the latest pods will do, and in many cases do it better. This is just another “its different so it sucks” story. If EOTS needed a visible laser the internet would be shouting that the visible laser wasn’t stealth. JSF to the media is always too much something and never enough at something else at all times, and no one bothers to see the contradictions. LOL oh lawd
Targeting Revolution
2012 Mark Ayton Air International F-35 Special Edition
“Mark Ayton details the F-35’s revolutionary AAQ-40 Electro-Optical Targeting System
With ample experience in building some of the world’s most advanced targeting systems, scientists and engineers working for Lockheed Martin’s Missiles and Fire Control in Orlando, Florida, were in a good position to take targeting capability even further when the requirements for the F-35 were received. The resulting AN/AAQ-40 electro-optical targeting system (EOTS) leverages on the experience gained from producing the LANTIRN targeting system (‘the genesis of night, precision weapons employment’), the AN/AAQ-33 Sniper advanced targeting pod, and the AN/AAS-42 infrared search and track (IRST) system used on the F-14D Super Tomcat. “The EOTS is the first sensor to combine a targeting FLIR and IRST. Marrying the two capabilities into one sensor was the big technical challenge in developing the system,” said Don Bolling, Lockheed Martin’s Business Development Manager for EOTS.
…“What makes the F-35 truly magic is that for the first time you have a fused sensor suite. The APG-81 radar is much more accurate in range presentation against an airborne target than an IR system can be, and the EOTS is much more accurate in azimuth down to a single pixel than radar can be. Combine the two capabilities together and you get a much smaller target location uncertainty, which means your weapons effect will be greater and if required your designation accuracy to cue somebody else to that spot will be much tighter. You are able to share the capabilities of each of the sensors and reduce uncertainty,” he [Don Bolling] said….”
Source: Air International 2012 F-35 Special Edition
mig-31bmI have not posted anything resembling a “hysterical diatribe”…that’s rather ignorant isn;t it?…because someone posts a view contrary to yours?
Again, you are trying to compare the F22 to the F35? the F22 is a Tactical air superiority fighter and is set as such…the ability it has to carry /drop at max two 1,000 lb JDAMS or eight GBU -39’s….that makes it a great CAS / Ground attack plane?…..One could even speculate that the F22 was only given those TWO a2g weapons so it could do something to show Congress it is useful and justifies the huge costs….I mean how many are actually operating and dropping ordnance on ISIS?….and why is the USAF wasting the world’s most expensive and limited number aircraft to bomb ISIS?…seriously, F16’s, F18’s , F15’s etc have all been dropping MORE bombs and in more missions with the loss of one F1? so where is the “need” for super stealth?…there is none at all…..it was simply a political move, plain and simple…
super stealth required when your enemy have good air defense ! , if you only want to drop more bomb no matter what the survival rate then F-111 ,B-1 , B-52 will do the job better than any fighter today
mig-31bmRUBBISH, the LEGACY F 18 Hornet has 9 hard points…two wingtip mounted AAM, 4 wing mounted hard points for ordnance and 3 fuselage hard points and can carry a total ordnance weight of 13, 700 lbs…THAT in it’s self exceeds the F35 by your own figures. Granted that the F 18 can only carry 10,000 lbs internal fuel, BUT it can also reduce it’s Ordnance load somewhat and incorporate a DT…as well as A2A Refueling, so the “range” may be of less consideration that the ability to carry the weapons load.
F-35 in strike mission with external stores can carry total of 24 SPEAR/SDB II + 2 Meteor/AIM-120 + 2 Aim-132/AIM-9X
F-35 in air to air mission with external stores can carry total of 12 Meteor/AIM-120 + 2 Aim-132/AIM-9X
F-35 in anti ship mission with external stores can carry total of 10 JSM +2 Meteor/AIM-120 + 2 Aim-132/AIM-9X
not to mention future missiles like CUDA will increase these number even higher
i dont think F-18 can top that 😉
The F15 E can carry up to 23,000 lbs of external stores, including the GBU-28, so really?…the F 35 is “more capable”?, not to mention that the F 15 E has a massively more extensive array of accessible / usable ordnance than the F35 ever will and is capable of substantially higher speeds and far better performance and a2a combat abilities….as the Americans like to say…the F 15 is untouchable and cannot be defeated by current aircraft. So although expensive to operate and an older design, the F 15 still outperforms the F35 in ALL regards except for “stealth”….which as has already been said is nullified by the F 35 carrying external stores. Perhaps all the Nations looking at F35’s should instead try to buy up used F 15’s from the USAF?…..it’s a better plane all round. Sadly the US Government was hoodwinked and manipulated by LM’s BS and lobbying…because the F 15 SE Silent Eagle would have by far been THE best choice all around. But Boeing just isn;t the “flavour of the month” anymore.
f-15 can carry more weapon and faster , fly further but F-35 have better SA ,EW have significant lower RCS ,and more maneuver and since stealth is very important f-35 is better
The F/A 18 Super Hornet can carry a total of 17, 750 lbs of Ordnance / fuel on 13 hard points, and has an extensive list of available ordnance as well. Granted the performance of the F/A 18 SH is not much better than the F35, it is also substantially cheaper to purchase and operate, and again is IN THE FIELD, OPERATING, not some speculative wishlist of abilities in 2020 or beyond…..
Additionally the F 18 costs substantially less to operate. It doesn;t hide behind pretenses and LM fantasy predictions. It is DOING that right now, not “supposed to do” in 2020…so WHERE is the massive advantages?…Stealth?…to be stealthy it can only carry 4,000 lbs of ordnance, and that is ridiculous…to carry more ( external mounted) eliminates the “stealth” and handicaps the speed and performance. So by all accounts it would be far cheaper to buy a cheaper Legacy or Gen 4.5 airframe that can carry more and at a cheaper operating costs, as well as being PROVEN operationally capable airframes
Operate as an F 35 “WOULD”?. this is all proposed / expected operational ability…why, because NONE, not one can or does operate…period…..they will be years before the software is completed to even allow an F 35 to “DO” anything even remotely resembling Operational tasks…
so yeh, IF “Stealth” is paramount ( see your last sentence) than the plane can ONLY carry 4,000 lbs of ordnance ( internally)…sorry any plane that needs to fly “stealthy”, at what?, $30,000 per hour to operate….better be able to drop more than 2 JDAMS on some target, then again, if supposition plays out, as has been stated by someone INVOLVED in the program, the EOTS will be so reduced in capability and outdated the F 35 isn;t going to possess any advantage over current planes, and perhaps less ability as others are being updated constantly nor do exceptionally well dropping A to G Ordnance anyway…..so it will all be a chronic waste of time and money.
Bottom line, all the arguments about external loads effecting other fighter types, is JUST as applicable to the F 35, it is NOT immune to the same principles.
pretty picture by the way…..those great big JDAMS hanging there on external hardpoints sure turn the “Stealth” off on that plane now doesn’t it, as well as reduce it’s speed and performance…..where is the big “pay off” dividends to paying $130 million plus for the plane and $30,000 per hour to operate?……it becomes just a very expensive, slightly lower RCS plane of unexceptional abilities.
F-35 is faster, fly further,have better SA ,EW have significant lower RCS ,and more maneuver than F-18E/F it can carry equal amount of weapon , and even in stealth configuration F-35 can still carry 8 SPEAR/SDB II +4 cuda
mig-31bmyour trying to justify the F35’s horrid weapons ability by comparing to the F22?…you do know that the F22 is strictly and air superiority fighter right?…the F 35 is “supposed” to be a multi role plane?….if you consider having your super expensive, super stealthy F35 being USEFUL as a 1st strike aircraft and it can only carry 4,000 lb’s of bombs?…seriously?…you do realize that a WW2 De Havilland Mosquito could carry 4,000 lbs of bombs right?…and it was also “stealthy” being made of wood.
instead of seeing it as lbs you should see it as number of weapon
F-35 can carry 8 SPEAR + 2 Meteor internally
or 8 SDB II + 4 CUDA internally
that is quite a significant amount of targets it can attack .,
and while De Havilland Mosquito can carry 4,000 lbs of bombs ,it’s bomb cant flight 100 km or attack with very high accuracy like f-35 weapon . And no De Havilland Mosquito isnot stealth in anyway to any kind of radar available today
Did you read the article posted above?….it clearly stated FROM a serving member of the USAF and involved in the F 35 , that the F 35 is already and will be at least two generations BEHIND in it’s EOTS…so what bombs is it dropping?….bottom line, the F 35 has a pathetic capability in ordnance, limited in types and numbers without giving away speed and stealth…the SAME argument used to slam EVERY other type of fighter….
we dont know how valid the article yet , it may just one of these made up article to bash f-35
IF an F 35 slings external stores, and it MUST to be any use in a modern conflict, IT WILL, in NO uncertain terms suffer in a reduction in it;s speed as well as in it’s “Stealth” period…external stores will create drag and slow the plane…same as for the Super Hornet or the Rafale or any other type…and when the stores are exposed on hard points, well, the RCS increases substantially, therefore loosing it’s Stealth….how can that be argued?…because the plethora of fanboys have just argued the exact same thing above for a whole page only regarding other types…yet the same, only WORSE ( loss of “stealth”) occurs with the F 35.
no it dont have to slings external stores to be useful , it can however !
By the way, flying the world’s most expensive “Per Hour cost to fly” aircraft and only carry 4,000 lbs of internal ordnance for ANY CAS, 1st strike or any other bombing mission is a catastrophic waste of financial resources and falls far short of any current types being operated to drop ordnance on ISIS targets etc, both in individual ability ( lbs. of ordnance per aircraft) AND cost to fly said missions.
1 ) internal stores is for when enemy have very good air defense and you need stealth
2) when air defense you can mounted significant amount of weapon
mig-31bmMiG – sputter all you want but just because something has been tested does not mean it has been cleared for service.
what????
it was designed to be able to reach that altitude, it have been tested to that altitude, what stop it from flying at that altitude when it going operational?????
mig-31bm9
1/ one may answer sevral things, first, tomorrow (27th december 2014) you have an interception mission and two fighters on the line, an F-35 and another fighter in service today (ok, forget also NK’s Mig15s).. say anything that flew after 1960… you order scramble, what happens?
the F-35 stays there and does nothing: IT IS NOT FINISHED, NOT CLEARED TO FIRE ANYTHING ON ANYONE
the other guy goes up and does the jobthat’s why I say that TODAY, it isn’t superior to anything operational
it just gets tiring how hopsalot and Cie always say it’s superior to this or that, even if it can’t do anything useful. what it may eventually be able to do somewhere in the future (nobody can tell exactly when, unless you take the promises for granted) is one thing, but saying “it’s the only option because it is superior” (read “now”) is nonsense (and I stay polite)
2/ airliner cruising at mach 0.84 and 30000+ft may be detected from 400-500km, but if you read my previous post, I was talking about small countries… unless you are quite big, an airliner 4-500km away, you don’t care about it because it’s outside your airspace. And, regardless of the distance, if you have to scramble to intercept it, it’s usually an emergency, for whatever reason, so you don’t have 1h or more to run after it.. you have to get there as fast as possible. and some have more problems with it than others; for example, look at the leaked trials from the swiss (not exactly a huge country by any standards), the gripen didn’t even manage to catch the airliner, simulated by an F-18, where it actually ran out ot fuel before getting there. Take off, climb and run after the liner, all that in full AB was simply too much for the small amount of fuel it carried, which is another thing one has to take into consideration… I wonder how the F-35 would manage to do such jobs, since, even if it carries a lot of fuel, it also burns enormous amounts of it as well. Anyway, considering how advanced it is in testing, I’m not sure they already tried to measure how it performs in that roles
3/ it’s a matter of compromise, achieving performance like the SR-71 or Mig-31 would be doable (actually, much easier today than 40 years ago, but at the expense of many other useful features.. it simply wouldn’t be worth it. Anybody puts the treshold where he considers it the most appropriate for the mission they want to do (and that’s probably the main problem most air forces will encounter with the F-35, as it’s developed for the US, who want a first day striker and let others do the air superiority job (F/A-18 for the Navy and F15/22 for the USAF), while most airforces will need an air to air platform most of the time… obviously, the treshold they’d look for can’t be the same as the one that USN/USAF look for… but it’s the US PoV that is the one to be aimed for
1) someone else already answer
2) fair enough, to intercept airliner then Rafael and EF-2000, Gripen, Su-35 is better, in other role such as air superiority, escort, CAS, SEAD, Strike, anti ship, recognition… etc then F-35 is better
3) as i said before if speed, altitude, super cruise is really that important for a fighter then big nation such as USA, China, Russia wouldn’t be bother to incorporate Stealth into their next gen fighter design, they would all make design similar to Mig-31 or SR-71, the fact is modern fighter have slower speed compared to old one : mig-25 can reach mach 3, f-4 can reach mach 2.5, sr-71 can reach mach 3.3 , F-14 can reach mach 2.4 while rafale, Ef-2000 is limited to mach 1.8, f-35 limited to mach 1.6
mig-31bmer, RAfale was mostly delayed not by production problems but by the French governments who either did not order (no fundings) or added requirements “on the go”… when you look at it, I dare not imagine what would happen to the F-35 program if somebody tried that stunt… they had to reduce requirements just to make the thing reach them
even the French governments dont really want to buy the Rafale, dont you think it mean the aircraft is not really good? ( either too expensive , or cheap but have bad performance
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