Flying the Ark… yes, have that one too! On the subject of Vic’s bridle catcher, I recall reading somewhere that initially it allowed bridles to be re used only four times each before being discarded, but as it was experimental that could have had something to do with it… The Boffins obviously took their own sweet time thinking about it afterwards before producing the Van Zelm system adopted for Ark Royal (and intended for Eagle and the CVAs). Of course when the Steam Catapult, Angled Deck and Mirror landing sight were invented in the early 50s, the Admiralty originally decided these innovations should only be installed on the next generation of carriers rather than retrofitted to existing ships (probably with an eye to costs in the postwar world). The rapid adoption of all three by the Americans helped them to rethink this posture,though it was by no means the only reason. This ingrained conservative thinking withing the Admiralty probably explains the reluctance to adopt the Bridle Catchers for so long. By the time Ark re entered service with them in 1970, the Septics were already switching over to the nose tow methid of catapult launch…

Thanks Obi, great pics aswel.
I take it that last shot shows her leaving Sydney with the then just recovered RNHF Firefly WB271 c.’67?.

Indeed it does. You may also note in the background both RAN carriers, HMAS Sydney and HMAS Melbourne, the former then serving as a troop transport (almost a commando carrier!)

Amazing old tub Victorious when you consider her WWII actions and how her appearance changed reflecting the evolution of carriers in general, shame about her indignant ending.

She was indeed a beautiful ship, both before and after reconstruction (a rare thing). I must confess Victorious is responsible for my interest in naval aviation, in 1979 (at the age of 9) my Dad took my older brother and myself on a day trip to Pompey dockyard, HMS Victory et al. “But Victorious was long gone by 79?” I hear you exclaim loudly! Well, yes.

After a great day out we finished off at the RN museum souvenier shop. And I zeroed in on the most beautiful thing a 9 year old boy could see there, an Airfix 1/600 scale model of HMS Victorious! (I wish they’d do models of all the RN carriers, I had to scratchbuild them in my teens;)) I bought several more a few years later when I was into wargaming and had my own ‘fantasy’ fleet! Happy days… but it all sparked off a deep curiousity about the subject which I still have today. Also, my maternal Grandfather was in the FAA during WW2.

Thanks for the build up! Just to clarify, Hermes never had any bridle catchers fitted, Victorious had a single experimental catcher fitted to her port cat which was removed after a single commision. The Bridles used by the Sea Vixens, Buccaneers, Scimitars and Gannets were basically the same and cost £5 each in late 60s prices. The Phantom required a more substantial bridle which cost £15 each. The savings to be brought about by the use of bridle catchers is obvious. And as stated above, they would all be detached from the catcher eventually and discarded (hence the numerous photos mentioned previously). Discarding the Bridle seems to have attracted the photographer’s interest more than regular launches.

The ‘plan’ in the mid 60s was to Phantomise Ark Royal between 1966 and 1970 and Eagle during her 1968 refit. This would allow the RN to deploy one Phantom capable carrier in late 68, a second in 1970 and CVA-01 in 72. Ark would be a stop gap until CVA-02 was complete around 1978 (most sources give 1974-76, but the reality of British Shipbuilding in this timeframe suggests running Ark on until 78…). Eagle was in much better material condition and her 1959-64 rebuild had effectively given her another 20 years of life. That means she is viable until at least 1984, the likely in service date for CVA-03. Even Denis Healey himself said the CVA programme was always about a minimum of three ships, as that was then (and indeed is now) the minimum number required to maintain one carrier forward deployed continuously. The current reasoning behind only two CVFs is not about continuous presence, but maintaining one carrier at readiness to deploy if not actually deployed.

Eagle’s refit went ahead but with the cancellation of the CVAs it was restricted to overhauling her systems. After the cancellation of the new carriers the RN hoped to ‘hold the line’ with Ark and Eagle through the seventies (perhaps hoping for a change of heart/Government), but then the government cancelled Eagle’s conversion. The first the RN knew of this was when the second sqns worth of F-4Ks were delivered in RAF camouflage! The only change made to Eagle was the replacement of her number three arrestor engine with a DAX II system so that she could carry out Phantom trials. As she did not have water cooled Jet Blast Deflectors (as fitted to Ark and planned for the CVAs) a large steel plate was chained flat to her flight deck behind the waist cat; it would absorb the heat from the Phantom’s afterburners and after launch (during which it would glow white hot) the plate would then be cooled by fire hoses before the next aircraft could be taxied into position on the cat. Eagle’s shorter bow cat was not used in these trials, though Ark Royal did use her forward cat operationally for Phantoms. The CVA cancellation also delayed Ark’s refit by several months, but it went ahead anyway. The completion date remained, and this meant there was insufficient time to complete the full program, so in order to get Ark to sea again on time in 1970 her four Sea Cat launchers were never installed, as this would have kept her in dockyard hands for several more months. Thus she was ‘fitted for but not with’ for the remainder of her career.

As to why the RN didn’t embrace bridle catchers earlier than they did, well that’s a bit of a head scratcher really. Victorious could have had them as early as 1958 when she emerged from her eight year rebuild, they had been widely used by the USN for a few years by then on the refitted Essex class. We gave them the Steam Catapult, Angled deck and Mirror sight, the least they could have done in return was encourage the use of bridle catchers!

Flanker Man asked: PPPS – I don’t think either side uses ‘Globemaster II’ do they ?

Probably because it’s the Globemaster III;):D

I did not know that Intruders ever operated off the Ark! How did the A-6 stack up to the Buc?

The Intruder was nowhere near as good looking! The Bucc and the A-6 had similar payloads and decent range. Remember when the Bucc first appeared at Red Flag in the 70s the septics were shocked at how good it was. They couldn’t believe anyone could fly that low and that fast to the point where it was almost impervious to their SAMs and fighter defences. But then, that’s what it had been designed for in the first place, under the radar strike missions.

Back to the original topic, if the RN had been tasked with sending a Carrier battle group to Vietnam (and assuming this means a change in the political attitude towards carrier aviation), Eagle can be ready to deploy with the first sqn of Phantoms in late 68/early 69 with Ark Royal ready to relieve her by early 70. A continuous RN presence during this period would not be possible with just one ship initially, but their deployments would be fitted in with the USN’s carriers. Because the two larger carriers would be required East of Suez continuously, the remaining carriers would therefore be devoted to Atlantic/Med taskings, and to meet this a three carrier force of Hermes, Victorious (repaired following her very minor fire during refit) and Centaur (refitted for further service with a larger angled deck and more deck parking space. She was by 1965, only ten years old and hardly decrepit) could be maintained. Unfortunately for the Crusader fanboys, I don’t see any possibility of buying the F-8 for these ships, the time had passed and the RN had already rejected it in favour of the Phantom. There would simply be no money left for a second new fighter type that would only be needed for ten years at most. The existing force of Sea Vixens would be retained throught the 70s for these ships pending the arrival of the three CVAs (-01 in 1973-4 replacing Victorious, -02 in 78-80 replacing Ark Royal and -03 in 1984 replacing Eagle as per the original plan). Hermes would remain CTOL into the 80s but would switch to a more ASW helo oriented air group by the late 70s (without rebuilding) and probably be sold abroad in the mid 80s. Centaur likewise. Albion and Bulwark would probably be retained into the 80s as replacements would have to wait until the CVA’s were completed.

With the retirement of the CVSs, they won’t have anyone with any kind of deck skills whatsoever.

Ah, but Illustrious and her deck crew aren’t going until 2014, and Ocean and her deck crew will stay until 2018, when they can transfer directly to QE as she begins her trials. The SFDO isn’t going anywhere either.

Searchwater will fit into a Gannet, the airframe is large enough. There were a number of Gannet airframes available from the early 70s (circa 30 AEW3s, which had their AN/APS-20 radars removed to put into 12 RAF Shackletons), and of course the last seven operational airframes were available from 1979 onwards following 849NAS being disbanded. Indeed one of these airframes was used between 1982 and 1984 in development work for the Sea King AEW2, though it retained it’s original radar for comparison tests.

Searchwater is less suited to the E-1 Tracer than the S-2 Tracker as the radome extends downwards, and the Tracker is already designed with a downward extending radome, albeit a smaller one. The Tracer was extensively redesigned from the original Tracker in order to carry the radome on top of the airframe, including a new tailplane, and if the radome is no longer required for the radar (in this case Searchwater) then it becomes easier to adapt the original Tracker airframe for the task. The Tracer’s Radome was fixed as well, not rotating like the Hawkeye or Sentry.