They did….until the FJCA downselect was made in favour of F-35. After that point it was clearly either STOVL or CATOBAR so STOBAR became irrelevant.
The flight deck is large enough and arranged such that it could be converted to a traditional angled-deck layout, so, STOBAR always remains an option of course. Especially as the British company McTaggart Scott, supposedly, still offers an arresting engine design based on the DAX-II gear so a conversion would be pretty much all ‘in house’. It would, clearly, take a complete and total failure of the F-35 as a motivator for a STOBAR QE by now though.
what about the F-35C on a stobar?
http://vif2ne.ru/nvk/forum/0/co/2509907.htm
(activate Google Translate Please.)
T-50-5 Ready to Flight?
T-50-6 Only Test Static
T-50-7 T-50M? (Ready to Engine 129, RCS=0,0X?Friend, confirm?
two static models?
easier solution than attack helicopters
do a shiite for sunni trade with Iran.
I just can’t resist any more (tough it’s been like 3 years since I’ve taken part of these kind of “discussions”)
To counter the orginal assumptions and assertions, has anyone given tought how well USA and it’s “allies” perform themselves in fight/conflict which they would be dragged in if fighting china despite what the performance of PLA is? I mean even if all the mentioned factors of Chinese performing poorly on the “human factor” point of view, none can claim them being so demoralized and unwilling to fight for their own country that they would simply just thrown down the sword after few days of USA aircampaign?
What happens when USA is forced to bring all it’s might into question? I mean you can’t beat up present-day PRC with force and invested capabilities which USA has done is all it’s 1900’s wars. The sheer size of China as nation and land and the sheer numbers of their military is way out of the scale even of Iraq in 1991. Remember this time there wouldn’t be no Soviet Union actually doing the job like it was in WWII. In this scenario USA would have to do the work which it hasn’t done ever. Or when has USA invaded and actually brought down a country of Chinese caliber? (With nukes it can do it, but with nukes the whole scenario or judging the chinese performance is pointless as USA has more nukes than China.)
So how would USA perform themselves if they actually would have to fight a real country with big army (despite how modern or capable the army is)? How would they perform if they realise that they can’t bomb the enemy to surrender but they would actually have to go down and engage the enemy in land? Enemy who outnumbers them in 10:1?
Thobbels did quite simplistic generalisations of the “human factor” of non-USA/west nations so if we follow that logic, look what happened in WWII. Germany had pretty much the same type of situation with the Soviets. Everyone assumed that Soviets were a papertiger, big in numbers but so paralysed with their outdated doctrines and a far greater turmoil with the office purges and atmoshphere of terror than China could be counted for today. And Germany had the balls to try out how their superior military machine worked. And it did…for a while. Then the human factore kicked in, persistent and toughness of Soviet people. And rest is history.
the US Army did an analysis of the PLA’s Human Resources not too long ago which confirmed many other civilian analysis.. basically it argued
Chinese military technology catching up with the US
Chinese command and control organization far behind.
These things take a lot of time to build in no matter how much money the PRC throws at them. The thing is fanboys are over optimistic thinking that the great leap seen in the technology side is applied everywhere and are using that as a standard of measurement for growth. But like China’s cities, while its becoming modern with many skyscrapers, mentalities can still be quite third world, which would take another generation at least to change as old habits die hard.
Apparently CPIMIEC also let the turkish (turks?) choose their own test scenarios which the other vendors didn’t, and that worked to their favour.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/03/us-turkey-china-defence-idUSBRE99205L20131003
But let’s not kid ourselves here, even if FD-2000 was significantly cheaper, allowed for ToT, and yielded other sweeteners, it never would’ve been here top of the shortlist if its performance wasn’t competitive with the others. That doesn’t say FD-2000 performed better than the other systems, but rather all four were in the same ballpark of performance, at least in the turk’s eyes.
no, you’re just trying to make them all equal as usual
what it probably means that FD-2000 met at least the minimal level of performance demanded as with the others. the gap between fd-2000 and the other missiles, we don’t know how large or small it is.
after looking at the Vik thread and the load of the mig-29k
anyone think that Bae/Thales should’ve considered a STOBAR configuration option?
Kenya is a poor country. They recently replaced their old F-5E/Fs with more second hand F-5E/Fs.
They can’t afford new fighters, let alone stealth fighters.
And why would they need stealth fighters – Somali insurgenst aren’t packing IADS or F-35s.
I think the only realistic potential export customers for J-21 are Myanmar and Pakistan (though Myanmar has been buying Russian of late (MiG-29s) instead of JF-17s).
Myanmar is switching sides and becoming pro west these days.
Pakistan needs the j-31 for its very survival. they’re dirty poor yes, but i’m sure they’ll find something to cut for the sake of acquiring more j-31s.
venezuela is another choice, maybe ecuador
the only African country that could possibly go for j-31 is Egypt (if it stabilizes), Angola. possibly Algeria
Not quite true. Apparently Israeli pilots much preferred the Mirage III as a fighter.
They had a number of less-than-complimentary things to say about the F-4, calling it the “B-4”. According to the head of the IAF, the F-4’s radar was “essentially useless”, as were the F-4’s Sparrow missiles (only 1 kill in ’73 – not even a confirmed one). The F-4 was also way too easy to spot.
Source: Comparing the Effectiveness of Air-to-Air Fighters: F-86 to F-18
http://pogoarchives.org/labyrinth/09/08.pdf
interesting document. very pro light weight fighters though. guess its because its from sprey.
worth while to bring up as a separate subject.
Su-24 is some where in the middle of Tornado and F-111. Su-24 carries much heavier loads to longer distance.
actually
Su-22M3 and M4 is eaqual to Tornado GR.1
F-111 is more capable than Tornado.
Yeah, let’s just ignore the 20380, and the 22350 (you know, actual future projects not stopgaps like 11356) which all show good RCS reduction measures.
056 doesn’t even make an attempt at mast integration.
20380 looks strange.. but I do like the Russian designs for their next destroyer.
here’s hoping they make another Kiev-class type of ship with a new vstol aircraft instead of another kuznetsov style ship.
You missed the Italians in the aesthetics premier league…right up there in the rankings for my money!. Always thought that there was a lot of Italian influence in Russian naval design funnily enough.
i think you may need to post some examples of nice Italian ships to jog my memory.
Only Cavour strikes me as visually impressive.
What people were those?
Anyway, I was curious about your remark, and turns out Rafale/J-10/F-16 aren’t that different: 15.27m/15.49m/15.06m, so whoever they were, they aren’t exactly that off…
lol a few people.
look at this guy claiming the j-10 is close to the same size as the j-7
http://forum.keypublishing.com/archive/index.php/t-2617.html
http://forum.keypublishing.com/archive/index.php/t-3820.html
rafale and f-16 are close. j-10 no, no matter how hard you try to white wash it. its only a few feet shy of the mig-29. go look at official numbers.
Model of AFC aka AMF aka J-21/31 shown at the The 15th Beijing International Aviation Exhibition.
http://www.chinesedefence.com/forums/chinese-air-force/6555-chinese-new-advance-low-cost-stealth-fighter-jet-afc-concept-unveiled.html
this thing could be an export hit!
But would there have been a Mirage 2000?
Think about it. The M2000 was a French response to the realisation that F1, while a good aircraft, struggled to t compete with F-16 in export markets, & the Super Mirage project for ACF was too expensive.
Putting the Mirage F2 into production would have changed French fighter development. It’s hard to say what would have been built.
thus an IDF with F1s and F2s may even struggle more so in doing Osirak
J-10 is not indigenous. J-10 is developed from Lavi from Israel due to close ties between China and Israel. It’s not a secret. SK is enemy of China. Everything about SK has to be related to China. :p Here’s another early model of J-10 in the early to mid 90s.
cac intended to make a lavi clone but the large size of the Russian engines led to a near total re-design.