Vulcan903Thats the only one that has ever been dismantled and rebuilt. The Hendon Vulcan is just a shell. Cut the spar and all bets are off!
Vulcan9031st and best option is to ask David Thomas, Mike Politt and Barry Masefield to start it up. Bring all 4 engines up on the brakes. Release the brakes and at about 135kts rotate.
10 MONTHS FROM TODAY THEY COULD JUST BE DOING THAT.
Vulcan903There are no suitable hard points to lift a Vulcan without stressing the air frame. You can jack one up though!
Vulcan903Hangar Rental & Update
Just to point out that the Vulcan Operating Conpany had no involvement in the Hanger Rental. This was managed by two of the Vulcan To The SKy Trustees …both sharing the same surname.
The Walton family are quite upset at the recent discussion about hangar rental. Not speaking on there behalf, but they are fully behind the project and always have been.
Given a chance I think they would like more involvement in the project but under the current structure they are standing back from it.
The “Dr” will be out of action some some time. The fundrasing Dept of VTTS is near anuf closed (they are in the south of France until September) so please pledge via the Vulcan supporters club. They have hired a PR company and they might just be able to turn it around.
Vulcan903Sorry who in the right mind thinks a Vulcan would actually increase or attract crowds like that.
If you did a poll in any average high street in the UK tomorrow, do you honestly think Mr & Mrs Average would
(a) give a monkeys about the Vulcan;
(b) actually know what one is; and
(c) it would actually sway them when it came to attending an airshow or not.What complete and utter bs.
Ahh. so the air show organizers group that Dr Pleming attends are talking BS are they?
It will be down to each air show to market the Vulcan appearance. Getting it right is like selling pixels on a web page.
You should have some faith in those who manage these events. I think they know what they are doing and talking about.
Vulcan903Whilst you maybe right r.e the attitude of some on this forum ,and doubtless one or two would love to see this project fail just to say “I told you so”. My attitude and I daresay that of many others is , that we would donate money to help this project, but are reluctant to send money to a cause teetering on the edge, with no obvious recovery plan (I say recovery as opposed to business,as the contingency plan fund ,has been used up, and no sponsors are on board, and the workforce are halfway through a months notice ,thats what it is).As in all cases,transparency is the key,I’m not aware of the need for a business plan to be kept from general consumption, in fact I seem to remember, presenting (along with fellow directors) a business plan to an AGM meeting that included guests (i.e non members) and I’m sure that being made aware of where their subscription fees were going helped to alleviate concerns that some had.
If we can recover the project, then I think you will find a new way of doing things would be forthcoming.
I agree with you, I expect a lot of folk out there would send in the £5, the £10, if they knew there will be a aircraft flying at the end of it.
At this point in time, its up to the trustee’s to make that call. Personally I expect them to close the project later this month and get one with there day jobs as normal.
There also needs to be Status Quo from the prime contractor regarding uplift costs or a deferred payment scheme to keep the project going so flight can be achieved.
Once there is flight, openness and transparency and communicating to the wider public on the proposals it might work.
As I say – Prime Contractor and Trustees, its your call?
Vulcan903If you are quoting it to back up your argument, then we have every reason to see it, or at least to know what it says, PARTICULARLY if it answers the questions that are out there! Its more smoke and mirrors Paul, and that doesnt help the cause!
All the best
Bruce
I understand – but its not for me to issue such a document, unless you are a major company and wish to discuss a possibility of a union.
While the Fundrasier in charge is on holiday until September and while Robert is in hospital, I am doing my best to recover the situation. If I fail, then I can walk away on September 1st and say I gave it my best.
To issue such a large document on this forum would be of no value.
PPruNers have the right sort of attitude, and are actively dealing with the situation.
Regards
Paul
Vulcan903All very well quoting the business plan; where do we see it?
Bruce
There is no reason for you to see it?
Vulcan903From what? :confused:
Moggy
Increased costs to operate such events. The Vulcan could attract a wider field of general public, footballers wifes and Chavs.
Vulcan903My emphasis. “Might” is not, and never will be, a business plan.
Not a plan, not even close. Too late, too amateur. After the first flight is viable? After there has been crisis after crisis on the rebuild? I wouldn’t touch it with a barge pole.
So you get to see it disappear and come back later. Talk to the crew. Great. Still doesn’t answer how it is going to be paid for.
No, it has been PROVISIONALLY booked for three displays. The aeroplane was “booked” for displays this year (one of which I am involved with) but it is not there as the money has run out and the show could not afford it anyhow. Wishful thinking.
Three displays will net, at best, enough to pay for about an hours flying time. What appearance fee? How much is that? I know what piston warbirds cost and I know what Hunters and the like cost. What is the Vulcan going to cost? I am still waiting for those answers! Let’s say the Vulcan costs four times what a Hunter costs (and it has to be way more than that). For a show like Dunsfold Wings and Wheels four more Hunters would mean cancelling about half of the show.
Exactly what I have been saying. HOW IS IT GOING TO BE FINANCED? WHAT ARE THE NUMBERS?
Thrust, both II and SSC were completely different as they were for a given result only. Once that was done the project was dead. The Vulcan is being run like that, with the first flight being the end result, with NO THOUGHT WHATSOEVER being given to what happens afterwards. There is no comparison if the Vulcan is to keep flying.
Now, instead of slapping the keyboard with another example of optimism (which is commendable) how about getting an answer for the main questions.
1 What are the operating costs for one year’s airshows
2 How is that going to be raised?
3 How is currency training going to be financed?I have been asking this for ages, No one answers other than to say “there will be sponsorship”. OK fine, but how much is required?
At the moment it still looks like a bottomless pit.
No, it has been PROVISIONALLY booked for three displays.
So yes – Provisionally booked sorry.
What appearance fee? How much is that?
Details are on page 39 of the Vulcan Business plan
I know what Hunters and the like cost. What is the Vulcan going to cost? I am still waiting for those answers! Let’s say the Vulcan costs four times what a Hunter costs.
The appearance fee is inline with the general jet aircraft such as the Hunter. Pointless charging stacks of cash when the Vulcan could help save British Airshow events.
Now, instead of slapping the keyboard with another example of optimism (which is commendable) how about getting an answer for the main questions.
1 What are the operating costs for one year’s airshows
Page 15 of the Vulcan Business Plan.
2 How is that going to be raised?
Pages 36,37 and 38 of the Vulcan Business Plan explain to potential sponsors how money would be raised
3 How is currency training going to be financed?
Part of pages 36,37 and 38 of the Vulcan Business Plan.
The point here, is that there is a business plan, and its being circulated to interested parties around the UK. ‘We’ do not need to know the in’s and out’s of how the business is run. Anyone can go to Companies House for that if they really are that keen.
It is not my place to publish company figures.
A lot of air shows could afford to book the Vulcan, but they would have to consider if they have the infrastructure in place to deal with the attendance the Vulcan would bring during the first few years of flight.
As we all know, in 16 days time the show will prob be over and I won’t have anything to lend my support to any more!
Vulcan903Better still to have had a workable plan at the beginning instead of taking money from people for a dream that has no financial basis.
I really feel for the people that have put their hands deep into their pockets on the ‘promise’ this will fly again when we see that there is NO provision for the ongoing operation. It is not the alleged mishandling of money, the rises in costs that ‘may’ have been on a fixed price or the cost of hangerage but it is the complete lack of a sustainable plan for the flying the aeroplane that is the most annoying aspect of this whole debacle.
Can anyone answer the question, if the money comes to get the Vulcan airworthy how much will it cost and how will the money be raised to ensure its operational future?
I have been asking this for ages. Still no one answers.
It was a workable plan, but no one wants to sponsor a project now, then only getting the benefit in a years time. The world can change so much in that time scale. Not forgetting this was one of the original WMD.
I have dug deep in my wallet over the years (even with my rose tinted Vulcan glassess on)
I still back the idea of this majestic aircraft in flight and my heart will sink if this project folds.
The operational costs are scary by all accounts, but lessen when company’s pay for the fuel (of which one has said they might consider). Somebody will go to these conpanys when the first flight is viable ans sell the idea.
You won’t have to park on the A15 to see this Vulcan fly, the public will be invited to see the a/c’s currency flights. The crew will walk over and talk to you. You will be made to feel part of the ‘larger’ Vulcan family. You get to see the a/c up close and personal.
The aircraft has been booked for three events already for next year. The appearance fee is not that hard to swallow for an event organizer and no way pays near the real Opex costs.
Opex costs hit this industry hard. How often do you see a Sea Vixen flying. An aircraft with sponsorship!
I know of no body going to Richard Noble, when Thrust II was going bust with all this negative chatter. Can we not give VOC a chance, just like the goodwill we gave Thrust II or do we hide away, forget about the Vulcan and wait for the Bucc to fly, and say well done?
Vulcan903Well better to have a complete aeroplane and airworthy than one in bits. If the Great British public are really not interested in our heritage, then at least 558 could fly out somewhere where she would be cared for en masse rather than the few of us trying to convince the sceptics 24/7. VOC have done well, just the fundrasing management that let them down, in which Dr Pleming openly states also. And the prime contractor being greedy of course but then what new in Bristish industry these days.
Vulcan903I hope the local council will name a road after the mighty V. Prehaps in the affordable housing area of the new estate.
Vulcan903See what happens to your sense of humour when spending just a bit to much time in CA sunshine!
Vulcan903What about a Return of the Vulcan airshow, next year, June 16 Bruntingthorpe, 17th Bruntingthorpe, tranist to Kemble then The Mall return to Bruntingthorpe?
Would this interest people on this thread? or have you all had enough?
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