Why would the Farnborough website initially advertise it in the flying display, if according to your twisted logic, it never secured these mythical ‘flight parameters’ in the first place?

Or could it be that the Farnborough authorities did not get a satisfactory response from the assurances given initially ? Given that they were organized by China’s CATIC for sales, and NOT cash-starved PAF or Kamra (though PAF planes were loaned for the purpose), lack of insurance is definitely not a plausible explanation.

Besides, the Pakistani High Commission is in a clearly embarrassing position and hasn’t even bothered to come public with the reasons for the change of plans. It definitely has answering to do.

Has the Dreamliner achieved these milestones in around 1000 hrs?

Boeing must’ve given Farnborough authorities a flight-regime that they’ll operate in at Farnborough, which has been throughly tested and proven safe. The same thing was reported for L-15 vis-a-vis Dubai airshow (please scroll up and read the news report).

You’re clinging onto this issue like a mad rabid dog biting on a bone.

You twiched your “rabid” nerve badly there, didn’t you ?

Im sorry but your argument has been rubbished by many people on this forum, and for good reason. If you bother to look at youtube, you will find many videos of JF-17 display in Islamabad right on top of the crowd including all the western diplomats there.

It is not a prototype but a fully operational fighter.

Of course, I too mentioned earlier that Tejas has flown in various Aero-India shows because the IAF’s own test-piolts are involved in flight tests. So the same holds true for JF-17 vis-a-vis Pakistan. But how do you convince Farnborough officials ? See the example of L-15’s perparation before the Dubai airshow. Its clear Farnborough did NOT get any sort of proof or certification that JF-17 can safely perform so-and-so manouevers.

Even the YF-16 example appears to be because US is a NATO kingpin and can muscle its way to airshows like Farnborough.

You do know that L-15 flew at dubai and it was still doing flight tests?
http://www.global-military.com/tag/l-15

Please read your own link. It says :-

In October, L15 off a new round of flight height, according to the Dubai air show air show program, completed in China in more than 20 flight drills, constantly optimize the flight parameters during the flight to ensure that each action is done precisely in place to so that flight profile can be both a very strong view of the safety requirements to meet the airshow scene. In addition, the transitions in Dubai for the mission requirements of the transition function test flight, the aircraft successfully laid a solid foundation for participating.

So it conducted rigorous flight-tests upto a confirmatory milestone to ensure safety requirements. Has JF-17 done that ? Have the PAF authorities even bothered to demonstrate its certified flight regime ?

I have been attending airshows in the UK for the past 30 years and more.

You are mistaken.

With NATO countries salivating at new American toys, some diplomatic sweet talk, then yes its possible.

But the point remains that on airshows, the host country does NOT allow just any flying machine to do acrobatics above crowds. Just read the L-15 example right above, and its preparation for the Dubai air show.

Its clearly missing in case of the JF-17. Probably that’s why it was restricted to a static display.

Boom, his opinion is unlikely to change.

Also, I don’t know from where the rumours of an N-Tejas Mk.2 have emerged. So far, there has been no such announcement. What’s certain is that the 6 units ordered by the navy too shall fly with the GE-F404-IN engines, since the new engine tender is for the IAF only. The air force version of Tejas too had successfully cleared the sea-trials held at Arrakkonam.

Even after the new engine is selected for the Mk.2, ADA is unlikely to start integrating it on the N-Tejas as well. They’ve already got lots of work on testing the N-Tejas on the shore-based facility at Goa in consultation with EADs, where they’ll develop its STOBAR ability. Engines, (even IF needed) will come later.

For one, the Swedish airforce did not have to be forced to purchase Gripen while IAF (you may quote the sugar about 2 IAF officers smitten by Tejas), like it or not, did NOT willingly order Tejas, no they did not.

OK. Now you’re trying to pass your self-generated falsehoods as fact. No further discussion with you, given your comment above. Like I advised matt, you too would do well by even a cursory look at wikipedia’s article on Tejas. It’ll teach you its ABC, its history (and its very well referenced by the books and articles of Air Marshall Rajkumar, who headed the project at ADA and many others from IAF and ADA).

There’s even a separate article on Tejas’ timelines. Refer that too, if you can bother. It’ll inform you a lot.

You are upset you cant explain or back up your poetry with figures on orders. Look at akash and NAG for eg. the army and IAF (ya the same bad *** IAF which is partial to Tejas) bought it in wholesale, willingly.

From 2001 to 2009, there were umpteen articles in the Indian media criticizing the Akash and Nag programs. Some even declared them “dead” projects. But in 2008 both came back with a bang, and impressed the IAF and Army enough to get avalanches of orders.

We see the same pattern with Tejas. The Times of Indias and Indian Expressess newspapers kept on berating the Tejas throughout a good part of this decade (in the name of “investigative journalism”, but actually selective journalism, and often sheer falsehoods). They even quoted some nameless “experts” and former pilots (presumably VK Thakur) saying that Tejas is “obsolete” and IAF is bound to reject it, and this and that & etc. etc.

These newspapers purposely omit the simple fact that Tejas shares most of its avionics and weapons with Su-30 MKI, which is the IAF’s most lethal frontline fighter today. So rest assured, it is not going to be “obsolete” any time soon.
Secondly the satisfaction of all its 8-10 test-pilots from IAF so far. I quoted only 4 in my previous post, i.e. Grp Captains Harish, AP Singh, Maolankar and Bhargava. Many others are there too, including Air Marshall Philip Rajkumar (not a TP though), who headed the Tejas project and wrote a book on it.

Thirdly, a flawless record of over 1,500 flight tests spanning nearly 10 years from 2001. Even Gripen had crashed twice before entering service with Swedish Air Force.
Now, the Tejas is slated to recieve IoC 6 months from now and enter IAF. I’ll consider the Mk.1 it better than the Gripen earlier models and C/D versions.

Now you decide what you’ll believe : Tejas’ documented and quoted record from the IAF, or naysayer gossip from Times of India and Indian Express.

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Yes, it is true that IAF’s current chief showed disappointment, but it was when asked about Tejas’ PROGRESS in the last 2 decades. He said it could’ve been faster, poor management, blah…blah…etc. But he didn’t say that the machine is bad.

I am not sure about why the partiality towards tejas. it could be the one of the four reasons I mentioned that they are dumb or corrupt or prejudiced. My guess is that Tejas is dangerous to fly at 28 whereas Mirage is not?

Arey Shri bones20, how many times should I tell Tejas is not even designed to fly at 28 degrees AoA — as per ADA’s publicly available technical data ?

So, you please don’t try to make a rebuttal to this, by rhetorically concluding that, “..so do you mean the pilots are lying, corrupt..etc ?”

I told you already that the correct conclusion is that Ajai Shukla must’ve misquoted the pilot. No pilot will say that.

Are you saying that Gripen C/D = Tejas MK1 in performance even after considering that Gripen C/D has lower thrust comapred to Tejas Mk1? If not what is the explanation. YOu may have probably explained this earlier over here and sorry I dont have any idea on that

Gripen C/D has only 3 kN lower thrust than Tejas Mk.1. And both have performed at Leh with flying colours. So lets see if Tejas Mk.1 has something like 3 “notches” better performance than Gripen C/D.

For starters, Gripen crashed once during testing, and Tejas hasn’t so far (and its just a few months away from its IoC).

However, I will not allege the authenticity and genuineness of your quotes. I will acknowledge it at face value.

Then don’t. Its your prerogative, entirely.

Anyway, for the (purposely) uninformed like you and Mr. Spitfire9, here are some of the quotes from PRESENT IAF test-pilots :-

Video : Group captain Harish and group capt AP Singh on Tejas.

Speaking to members of “Team Tejas” after the flight, Capt JA Maolankar who is the Chief Test pilot of the National Flight Test Centre said “For a project that has so ambitiously pushed the envelope of indigenous technology, the results have been world class in many key areas. The aircraft is a pleasure to fly and has demonstrated enviably long range legs for an aircraft so small. The induction of most of the major new technologies has been remarkably smooth and the programme boasts of an enviable safety record. Great challenges lie ahead, especially when we take this aircraft to sea in the form of the LCA (Navy)”.

From : Frontier India

The following coment is much older, but important :

Gp Capt Kapil Bhargava : Two test pilots reported that the aircraft handled better than the Mirage 2000 during close formation, flare out for landing and touchdown.

From : An update on HAL (LCA) Tejas : July 2002

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Now do you want to believe the aforementioned test pilots (with their names and ranks in public), or some unnamed, unknown “pilot” mentioned in Ajai Shukla’s blog ? Or even worse, somebody who retired from the IAF over 15 years ago a la VK Thakur ?

Like I said, its for you to decide.

“We are ready with the flight evaluation trials (FET) report of the six foreign fighters in contention. Based on it, we are right now generating the staff evaluation report. Both will be submitted to defence ministry by this month-end,” said IAF chief Air Chief Marshal P V Naik, in an exclusive interview to TOI on Thursday.

The eagerly-awaited reports, which have evaluated the fighters on as many as 643 technical attributes after the gruelling field trials, will be followed by evaluation of offset proposals, opening of commercial bids and the final complex negotiations.

…and then the Governmnt will decide on various parameters like….ahem…commissions, bribes, nuclear-deal, votes at the UN security council for us, etc. In all, 238 such additional parameters will be decided upon. These “final complex negotiatons” are not mine, thank God for that ! Phew !

“We definitely need the MMRCA, LCA, and FGFA (the fifth-generation fighter aircraft to be developed with Russia) without any delays to retain our combat edge,” said ACM Naik.

We also definitely and surely need the UCAV, ACAFA, ASFA and MASAFA, asap. Our team is toiling day and night to write the RFPs. I’ve sternly told them to write an RFP in one year flat. Our Air Force must unleash a blitzkrieg of RFPs in foreign lands far and wide.

DRDO ? What’s that ?

^^ No. They will only be statically displayed. Apparently, authorities did not want to take risks with an uncertified fighter jet.