Graham Adlambook
Bruce, what an excellent response. The spar construction’s illustrated extremely clearly in Uncle Melv’s Hurricane book
Thankyou i have ordered this book
Graham AdlamNew years resoloution
David and MarkV…I guess I did not make my point very clearly. I was referring to a small but vocal group of people who bitch and complain about a paint scheme simply because they don’t like it, not because they are concerned about how accurate the paint scheme is. The point you make MarkV is very valid. Perhaps in my analogy I should have said something like: if I had painted my walls pale green and you walked in and took one look and said “Urrrrgh, I hate that!” without even being asked what you thought of the colour, well wouldn’t that be just plain rude? Commenting on the historical accuracy of a paint scheme is fine, but those who bleat about not liking the colours or choice of markings well, that’s a different matter in my book.
How did a humerous post about news years resolutions turn into a discusion about paint???? I for one surport Ashleys post, it might be a joke to slag someone off but its no joke if its about you. If you own a Spit or anything else its your right to paint it any colour you want, its no one’s business except your own.
Graham AdlamGood advise
New Year resolutions for the historic forum:
1) Those who continue to peddle their vendettas, what ever these may be. Please stop. Enough is enough. Time to move on? Locked horns with someone? Perhaps it is time to turn the other cheek.
2) No member should be under the impression that this is just a small forum that only a few people view. Your words here are viewed here by far more people than some of you would ever give credit for or comprehend. This forum does not operate in a bubble safe from the technicalities and legalities of life. Watch what you post. Don’t make allegations about individuals or companies without the hard proof to back these allegations up.
3) When posting in anger, please think hard before posting. It is all too easy to hammer out an angry response to someone (been there done that!) but please consider your response. Reasoned arguments and hard facts are always better than abuse and garbled throw backs.
4) Do please make use of the search function. However, please be kind to new members who are perhaps not as familiar with this function. If a new member starts a thread which is similar to a previous one, feel free to post a link to the original thread/s, or introduce them nicely to the search function. We were all new here once.
5) Forum members – who are we? We come from all walks of life, with different areas of expertise and knowledge. For some aviation is their life, for others it is a hobby. It does not matter who you are, what you do, or what your level of interest/knowledge is, it is all good. Please continue to share with each other, and to learn from each other. Please be tolerant of views that are different to yours, and don’t shoot someone down just because they have a different opinion to yours.
6) One personal pet peeve of mine – the gnashing and wailing of teeth from those who dislike the paint scheme someone gives their aircraft. If you came around to my house and told me you did not like the way I had decorated the place, and then proceeded to tell me how I should have done it, then believe me, I would kick you out the front door so hard you would be wondering what hit you :diablo: So what if the paint scheme is not 100% authentic, is it your aircraft? Yes, then do something about it if you wish to. No? Try zipping it. No wonder some owners are so secretive about their aircraft given the way some people behave over a colour scheme.
Just some thoughts 🙂
This post has some very good advise aspecially point 2, having recent personal experiance of being the butt of some of the less attractive posts and the related fall out This post is well worth taking on board.
Graham Adlamtubing
Dave
do your have an email or website address for them?
Thanks
Graham
Graham AdlamHuricane
[QUOTE=Bruce;1062480]Graham,
The multi sided tubing (it isnt eight, I think its twelve) is present in the centre section spars, the fin spars and the tailplane spars.
The centre section tubes are a nested affair, with a conventional tube spar encased by two nested multi sided tubes. Hawker Restorations contracted with Aero Vintage to produce the new batch, and it is unlikely a further batch will be attempted. I dont believe the machine was destroyed (the work was done by a company in the midlands as I recall), but you may struggle to find someone who will attempt it!
Having worked on both types (multi Spitfires, and LF363 for the BBMF), I am absolutely certain I know which I prefer to work on!
The fact is that you can have a basic Huricane fuselage up pretty quickly. The fuselage is relatively simple being constructed from tubes with squared off ends, mated to machined steel fittings, and folded stainless fittings. As long as your machined fittings are relatively good, then this isnt a huge problem.
The wood is relatively straightforward, but make sure yours does actually fit, as there are a number of sets around that didnt fit the fliers, which is why they are around in the ‘static’ world. It isnt so important for a static, but it could mean that the canopy wont fit properly. Good original patterns are essential.
If you have all the widgets, brackets and other bits and pieces that populate the fuselage, then you are some way there. If not, then these could be a serious issue. In the case of Peter Vachers Hurricane, he had an EXTREMELY complete aircraft, with all the knobs and whistles still intact. He also (incidentally) contracted with the accepted experts in the field to build the aircraft, which meant that it was completed quite quickly. A healthy bank balance also helps in this regard!
Now, the tricky bit is the centre section. The main reason is the spars previously mentioned. For a static that isnt an issue. The beams that connect the spars together are fairly straightforward, but do need to be accurately jigged to ensure the fuselage will sit straight, and the landing gear will fit. Inside the centre section is a horrendously complex box, that acts as the wheel well, and blocks off the cockpit from the rest of the aircraft. Its all sheet metal, so is eminently do-able, but you need at least a good pattern, as there are no drawings! Aft of the rear spar, is a complex structure that forms the trailing edge and flap shroud.
Anyway, there is nothing impossible about the Hurricane – if you intend to build a static, then you can cut some corners, but bear in mind when replacing parts that the material costs are in many cases insignificant compared to the labour costs. In other words, where you can, use the correct material, and you will ultimately get a better aeroplane.
For a comparison, look at the excellent Maltese project to build a Hurricane. I think its been going about 10 years now, and they have a superb final product.
If you arent sure what you are missing, go and look at the restoration pages on the Hawker Restorations website, which gives an excellent insight into the complexity of the aircraft.
Best of luck!
Bruce This is excellent advise thankyou I have taken note. I have a complete centre section so I am very happy about that. Apparently rads are a big issue?
Graham AdlamSpitfire
Although the spitfire was initially difficult to produce i suppose its the same with all new technology. The Hurricane being basically byplane technology had esablished tooling and manuafacturing procedures already in place whilst the Spitfire required a period for the factories to tool up and train its workers in the new construction techiques.
Graham AdlamHuricane
Thanks Herbert
Would you forward his email, I have it somewhere but would take a while to find it. I really apreciate all the good advice being posted. I was a bit put back, the spitfire seems daunting enough having followed the restoation of a flyer but finding out that the Hurricane is in fact more complicated threw me a bit. However having taken stock it will be alot easier to build a good static than a flyer. I already have a complete centre wing section not original i am afraid but a good remanufactured piece. I have also entered into negotiation about the rebuild with a chap associated with the Maltese Hurricane and I am pleased to hear positive coments about their Huricane. I have as i said two complete pieces of the twelve sided steel and a few other bits which are very corroded. I wouldnt like to guess what new pieces would cost. I nearly had heart failiure when I found out what a new made canopy would cost. I have a couple of options in the pipeline for a canopy and was lucky enough to source a very good (static running) De Hav Hub. I really need a good original blade. If I can get one I can cloan the other blades.
Keep the posts coming i need all the help i can get.
Thanks
Graham
Graham Adlamoctaganal
Thats interesting all the tubes visable are round with square ends where does the octaginal fit? I have two pieces of this in in good condition, the only location for this i can find is two uprights on the tail plane. Where exactly is the octaginal tube fitted in the centre? Having seen the progression of a flying spitfire from scratch down in devon the hurricane appears a much easier project at least as far as the airframe is concerned. Its a much simpler construction with wood on a metal frame and then a canvas covering. Why do you think the hurricane is so much harder I dont follow? I know Peter V got his into the air in super quick time.
Graham AdlamHurricane
Bruce have been pretty lucky so far have managed to source a hub and have a MKXX Merlin with the project which is currently being restored to static running. We are currently repairing and replacing the metal framework, most of the brackets are ok but we need to source the bracing wires and attachments, i have all the originals but they are US. We have most of the wood for the rear top and sides along with alot of cockpit stuff including original column and stick, rudder pedals, floor panels ect.The tail minus the rudder are also there and away being restored. Basically we are taking it one step at a time but hope to have a basic skelaton up on its wheels within months. Currently the urgent needs are bracing wires,&fittings. The chap that makes our props is now working full time on the airframe and we have managed to get a local supplier who can make the replacement tubing. I want to try and keep it as original as possible but simply can’t resue alot of the steel work. I have some very rare spit stuff in my private collection available for trade and i have a few sourcing offers in the pipeline. Will be posting more pics as it develops. I realise its a difficult project but still alot easier and cheaper than a Spitfire. major bits we are missing is the canopy,cowlings engine bearer and rudder.
Graham AdlamHurricane
In reply to the tubing issue which are round with square ends as mentioned we have a local engineering firm that can make replacements, about 60% of the original are still ok for static taxi which is our aim.
Graham AdlamHurricane
Bruce have been pretty lucky so far have managed to source a hub and have a MKXX Merlin with the project which is currently being restored to static running. We are currently repairing and replacing the metal framework, most of the brackets are ok but we need to source the bracing wires and attachments, i have all the originals but they are US. We have most of the wood for the rear top and sides along with alot of cockpit stuff including original column and stick, rudder pedals, floor panels ect.The tail minus the rudder are also there and away being restored. Basically we are taking it one step at a time but hope to have a basic skelaton up on its wheels within months. Currently the urgent needs are bracing wires,&fittings. The chap that makes our props is now working full time on the airframe and we have managed to get a local supplier who can make the replacement tubing. I want to try and keep it as original as possible but simply can’t resue alot of the steel work. I have some very rare spit stuff in my private collection available for trade and i have a few sourcing offers in the pipeline. Will be posting more pics as it develops. I realise its a difficult project but still alot easier and cheaper than a Spitfire. major bits we are missing is the canopy,cowlings engine bearer and rudder.
Graham AdlamWebsite
This is a fantastic website and a great place for research. I have really enjoyed looking at it.
Graham AdlamHurricane
here is a link to pics of the project
http://www.spitfirespares.com/SpitfireSpares.com/Pages/Hurricane%20restoration.html
Graham Adlamanson
after listing it on ebay I was offered a swap it for a Hurricane project the deal was done and I delivered it to Peterborough where it is being restored to static running.
Graham Adlamanson
Is that the one from a Welsh museam?
Sign In
