Yes the tomcat is my all times favorite, very sexy kitty in the sky!

it can”t be designed by americans, sometime i guess!

empty equipped weight of a demonstrator? what that have to do with the C101 first C version serie produced in 2003 from the factory chain, the french MoD datas ares very accurates, of course the check the dassault work, and give 9.1t, the first B version 01 -02 ares 9.6t, and the B demostrator is just full of captor , sensors, flight analising instruments and devices throug the wings, bodies, engines, landing gears , i mean maybe the B302 is a bit heavier, but it will never be sold or will enter in service, i hope ! lol

Similar to the Typhoon the Rafale is gaining weight. You can compensate that by pushing MTOW. There is still a payload ratio of 1,5 quoted, which no longer exists. The demonstrated MTOW is 24,5 tons. That ratio in mind the empty equipped has to be 9,8 tons, when the F2 from 1999 weight-in with 10,5 tons and a MTOW of 19,5-22,5 tons. So the real payload ratio is closer to 1,15 even by taking that higher MTOW. By that the Rafale had left its optimum design point and could no longer keep its range estimates for a given payload. It can not keep its specified climb-rates and altitude capabilities any longer. The higher wing-load smooth low-level flight but Ps will suffer.
The limits programed into FBW-software are related to stability and safety reasons. It prevents you from passing it, but has nothing to do to reach that values. You will be suprised to learn to which height a fully loaden Rafale could climb. Thanks to excellent aerodynamic much better than a F-16, but this is to exspect from a next generation fighter. When looking into this thread I hope for some never datas. A Saudi order will bring the Rafale a break-through in exports. But without the M-88-3 in time, this can become critical. Dassault must find some ways to shed some weight from the Rafale too. When that surplus weight is related to stealth, please tell me and forget my critics about that.

what? why the empty weight would grow with the MTOW?

Dassault designed and incorporated the weight of all F2 systems in their initial weight about the Rafale C F2.
http://www.topfighters.com/aircraft.php?aircraft=rafale&cat=geninfo
the 2003 empty weight of the C version is 9.100t, it was weighted after the first delivery at merignac with F2 in mind, Dassault reported that weight should grow to 150kg in early 2006! due to little reajusting by operational squadrons!
the planed MTOW is 24.5 t for the F2, and 29.5t for the mk2 version with bigger engines!

Oh no, the mythomaniac is back, troll Touchdown never disapoint!

now he’s working for Dassault, and he’s close to classified Cazeaux fench tests and experimentation team!

LOL

I know the Royal Navy’s Type 45 destroyer is already quite common on the forum, but to me it still looks interesting with its big structure and ‘crow’s nest’ style radar at the top

personally i prefert reality, than british theory staying on paper!

The first F-15C/D aircraft reached IOC with RSAF units in August of 1981. I doubt that in 1981 an F 15 C was obsolete. In fact it was the best in the world in that moment and for 10-15 years after.

As for the Saudi-French exercise, if the Rafales were directed by E 2, and the F 15+Tornado package was not directed by E 3, the result is predictible: it was absolutely normal that better pilots and newer airplanes prevail.

surely not, in 1981 the russian had budget and best planes in the world!

of course the saudies can have sortie with 8 planes without E3, time to be realist!