A least we can agree on that!

By 1943 the plotters general dissatisfaction with Hitler’s conduct of the war had turned to absolute certainty that the war (or at least the war on two fronts) was lost. It was only then that more serious attempts were made on Hitler’s life; they came within a whisker of detonating a bomb on his personal aircraft in early 1943 but the bomb malfunctioned.

Only by July 1944, with the war on two fronts a reality, and not going well for Germany, did desperation drive them to carry-out an incomplete plan (to kill Hitler, but not his obvious successors) but it is my opinion that most involved within the plot still hoped for, at least, an ‘armistice’ with the Western Allies…

…in a virtual re-run of the armistice that Germany had arranged with Bolshevik Russia in the Great War.

Why have you arbitrarily selected 1943 as your cutoff/start point?
To suit your viewpoint that it was only from then that the plotters started planning as the war looked like it was being lost by that stage?
It is well known that it started well before your arbitrary selection of 1943 as a date.

Now you, guys, should make one little thing – demonstrate some facts that are proving original assumption that light helicopters like Tiger, Rooivalk, Mangusta or LCH have any significant advantage in maneuverability which will effectively increase thier survivability in the area with advanced AD.

What? The Rooivalk a light helicopter?:eek:

It has an empty weight that is the same as the Tiger’s maximum take off weight, heavier than the Mangustas max take off weight, with over twice the installed power, and heavier than the LCH’s max take off weight.

Rooivalk is heavier, more powerful, and physically bigger than the AH64-A/D Apache.
It’s in a completely different weight class to those light attack helicopters you mentioned.

This article has not really persuaded me.. The author seems to have taken the simplest approach – if the helo has burned upon impact, it did not have crash resistant tanks.. if it hasn’t burned, then it had them… the problem is when he tries to “evaluate” the Mi-28N.. it has not burned in 2009 and 2011 but it did catch fire in 2015.. now what? 🙂

Indeed. It’s a weird way of extrapolating a viewpoint.
For example, it isn’t as if the Apache hasn’t burnt to ashes before too after crashing.
This one below crashed, caught fire, and burnt to ashes just 7 months ago.
http://www.koreatimesus.com/two-dead-in-us-military-chopper-crash-in-s-korea/

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The F119 weighs 4 tonnes?
The F-22 weighs 14,4 tonnes? Jeez….add almost 50% on to that rather optimistic target figure from 2 decades ago.
Metricate already ….it’s 2016.

What does any of this have to do with the PAK-FA again?

Sorry, but i don’t care what you think about me. Just because you don’t know me, my little Interwebz psychologist. No need to expose your butthurt so obviously, really.

May be you should ask before – “did Scar ask for my advice?” It wasn’t me who started this discussion and mentioned Ukraine. So, may be you should redirect your advice to Paralay and other members who started this discussion?

After all, you are free to not participate in discussion you don’t like. As well as you’re free to use Ignore and Report buttons.

Apart from the fact that you were posting in the middle of the night last night if you were in Russia, there are other little signs above in your use of language. As i said, Paralay seems to be correct.
And being a newly joined member and insulting a long term member such as Paralay, who has contributed so much here and on other aerospace forums, while you haven’t contributed anything even remotely similar is not only extremely daft, but you’ all simply end up even more isolated than you are now.

Vnomad and others please open a separate thread in the general topic forum for personal political musings and guesswork. This is the Russian AF thread.