You do start guessing to stay polite. How about the basic knowledge about it first.
The production started with the 23-11 in 1969-1970, when just 50 were built and the production was stopped till 1972 to rework the design to the final 23-11 or MiG-23M up to the 23-18, which were merely 23-12 refitted, when returned to overhaul shops.
The export variants like the MS and MF did follow the M two years later, when the production of MiG-21s had ended in the SU.
The 23-51 double seater aside.
The 32-24 till 32-26 were attack variants only as were the MiG-27 Series.
All were named Flogger in their NATO-designation and by that you got that huge number of examples built!
The mass production of the M fighter variant did start in 1972 and did end with the ML in 1981. The first export variants from that were delivered two years later.
At many websites the creaters do not have a high opinion of their readers and do not care about the important details, maybe in the best case they do not know better.
Propaganda is communication aimed at influencing the attitude of a community toward some cause or position. As opposed to impartially providing information, propaganda in its most basic sense, presents information primarily to influence an audience. Propaganda often presents facts selectively (thus lying by omission) to encourage a particular synthesis, or uses loaded messages to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the attitude toward the subject in the target audience to further a political agenda.

I have told you facts, just in six years there were more than 1000 MiG-23ML built and the MiG-23M was built in larger numbers (more than 1300) in a similar time period without counting the MiG-23MS and MiG-23U, for you it is very hard to imaging 8 or 10 examples like tom cooper says and testpilot.ru says because it is hard to say if a few example arrived then.

In fact if you read this webpage says by the middle of 1974 the MiG-23 was already in Syria and not started its arrival, and the number it mentions is 40
http://airwar.ru/history/af/siria/siria.html

I can assure its says that because my russian friend translate it to me and you can use google translation or babel fish to have a general idea

The MiG-23ML appeared in 1976 and finished in 1983 while the MiG-23M from 1972 to 1978 so easily in less than 12 years more than 3000 fighter MiG-23 were built, tell me why a few would had been so many? this give you a minimun of 28 MiG-23s a month and only fighters and no trainers

Yes. They believed that the Exocet had struck its intended target of HMS Invincible and flew towards the smoke on the horizon. During that run in two of their flight were downed by ship based SAMs. The two surviving A-4s attacked the smoke shrouded vessel that they believed was HMS Invincible.

Think about it. HMS Invincible struck by Exocet from Super E and the bombs/cannon from two A-4s. Think about the damage that would have caused? All that damage and resulting casualties yet 801 Squadron were still able to fly off and mount CAPs. 1st June saw the downing of a C-130 by Sea Harriers flown off HMS Invincible. Quite a feat for a carrier that was meant to have been disabled by the attack.

Think of the thousands that would be involved in such a cover up to this day?

TJ

More of the pilost are blind they saw a huge ship and mistook it by an iceberg:D probably the are saying lies of course your side always tells the true Argentina are not your side therefore are lying:rolleyes: that is what i call being very open minded

http://airwar.ru/history/af/siria/siria.html

It does not claim that. It is not even a real source and full of errors.

Syria and Egypt did operate some Su-20 in Oct. 73 already.
Syria did not operate Super Frelon helicopters. The picture does show a Super Frelon in France, it is either a Libyan or Iraqi example, when the source of that pic is not quoted.

http://army.lv/ru/mig-23/istorija/502/96

Here is to read the following.

“In 1974 MiG-23Ms have appeared in Libya, a bit later they have been put the Air Forces of Algeria, Egypt, Iraq and Syria.”

Can you explain your intention to send us links, which do not bolster your claim?! I am not speaking about the filigreed tale about the delivery of MiG-23MS to Syria in October 1973 even.[/QUOTE]

I have said to you very clear as water all what it has been said, by 1974 they said the MiG-23 were seen in ME, there is no specific date to when or what months, also the MiG-23MS has and i can quote you very easily started production in 1973, i have never said what month and most webapes i have quoted are saying were already by the mid of 1974 in ME.

You of course forget testpilots ru say in october 1973 and at no moment the webpages say the begining of first arrivals just simply appeared in 1974

None of that Russian “sources” did know that, because the people there did not learn ffirsthand about the related events and circumstances! To copy claims from websites does make things not trustworthy in general. At least without critical details and sources. So far I never heard of a Russian list, be it deliveries in numbers or the time-scale of that. Just Western Journalist got some answers about that that from the related airforce.
The Russian people from Waronline are proud about the Russian weaponary, the elder ones had served in the Russian forces and do have the best connections to Russia. There are no reliable infos about that.

I do not think that is the trouble, i think you are unwilling to accept things that you do not wish to have happened.

Your position like many we do have, has some preferences.

It is obvious you are unwilling to accept a MiG-23MS shot it down.

To put it in context.
the pictures of the F-4 wreckage, are proven, the event did happen that is a fact, now the explanations are what you do not accept.

The MiG-23MS started production in 1973, contrary to today`s fighters the MiG-23 had a high rate of production, in less than 12 years the Soviets built more than 5000s calculate how many a month? a year? at least 500 a year, let us say 400, so it is a minimun of 30 a month, easily the Russians supplied 10 MiG-23MS in January 1974 however they say they recieved the first examples in Oct 1973.

That is the reason they say by mid 1974 several dozens of MiG-23MS were in operational service in arab forces.

The MiG-23 is said to have its main combat operations in 1982-83, but MiG-23MS were already in 1976 in Syria and i can prove it to you by the pages i gave you.

No MiG-23 was shot down in 1979 when the F-15s are reported to have shot down MiG-21s.

Now as i said to you everything is what your ears want to hear, you want to hear no air to air victories and i am sure you want to hear a SAM victory or a AAA victory for the 19 April 1974 F-4 loss.
You can choose to disregard the other links as you wish, but definitively testpilots.ru has given to Tom Cooper`s story reliability.

Other webpages say more F-4s were lost that day more than 4 and other give that victory to a MiG-21 pilot named Mansur.

There are several possible explanations for what did happen.

One is a single F-4E was lost that day according to Israeli sources; other account says at least 2 F-4 were lost either to a MiG-23MS or a MiG-21MF and possibly another 3 were lost.

To sift what did happen is a thing me or you can not do unless you have better sources from the Syrian Government and interviews with Al mansour or Al masry.

So to put it in simple words the truth is blur but there is a true history but at least Copper`s story of Al masry is supported by testpilots.ru and other say that day more than a single F-4 was lost

You can. That day one F-4 was shot down over Syria. See the fate of its crew.
No MiG-23MS in Syria at that time-scale.

No it is not what most russian sources claim by 1974 there were MiG-23MS in Syria
see

http://airwar.ru/history/af/siria/siria.html
http://army.lv/ru/mig-23/istorija/502/96

The claims from the Russian source about Hermon74 are correct in general at the first glance. Thank you for that finding. 🙂

I do not know the degree of accuracy of that webpage, up to what i have read we have the following sources

A) claims an F-4 was shot down in 19 April 1974
B) there are three possible ways it was shot down, one a Mig-23MS flown by Al masry, other a MiG-21 flown by Mansour and another AAA.
C) Since it is possible there were more F-4 shot down, in the case of al Masry it is claimed he shot down 2 F-4s but only one F-4 had its crew captured.
So definitively we can not say which one of the webpages is right

Yes, we know that! Did it ever cross your mind that the pilots in the heat of battle mistook what they saw?

How large do you want the conspiracy theory to be? Hundreds of crew aboard HMS Invincible and still nobody speaking about this attack and damage?

What about the other side what about those supposedly SAMs that shot down F-15s, Tornados and F-16s would not they have made the same mistake:D

Double standards yeah only when is convinient you want to use that logic

do you think this other pilot made the same mistake?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdps1bID-84&feature=related