One thing for sure is that in the future the cost of 1:st level maintnence and refueling etc. will go up in the future in sweden, due to constription was abandoned in 2010 (Sweden). So at the moment the last constripts are still doing there duty but is phased out in steps. Also the 2500USD is a SwAF figure, the 4000 USD figure is from offers (and stated sometimes >4000).

Are you saying that the cost per flight hours was computed without manhours cost because Sweden use conscription???

L O L

Nic

I had an israeli teacher who had met Yitzhak Rabin during both Israel’s wars, and I remember we had a course the day after Rabin was murdered. The teacher was in tears and he told the whole course about Rabin. A great man.

Nic

you know like me that earliest sources say 2500 USD, in the last offers its been about 4000 USD, its all over the net. Now, one politican makes a funny comment with no conditions mentioned about about future gripen, and now this is trough for all generations of gripens?
I know this would be your wet dream Nic, but please can you also be realistic?

I have always believed that the 3000$ per hour was a wet dream indeed, and I have said so in this very forum a couple times.

There is no objective reason for the Gripen to cost less than 1/3 the cost of the flight hour of a Rafale. Period.

If you’re going to tell me that it’s the case, you must tell me why it’s so cheap compared to every other fighter out there.

I’d say ~7000$ per hour vs ~10000$ could account for one more engine and a bigger airframe. But adding one engine doesn’t triple the cost, sorry.

Nic

Not true, I’m afraid.

Indentured servitude wasn’t chattel slavery: the servant was freed at the end of the indenture (up to seven years), was officially required to receive a payment on discharge (& the majority appear to have got it), could sue his or her master, etc., & the status was not inherited.

The total number of indentured servants sent to the colonies from the British Isles was far less than the number of slaves shipped from Africa.

Most indentured servants were adults, either volunteers (they got their passage paid, & guaranteed food, housing & clothing for the period of the indenture, plus the final payoff) or convicts.

There was a public scandal in England about the kidnapping of children to be sent to the colonies as indentured servants (mostly from England, BTW, not Scotland, Ireland or Wales) in the 17th century, which led to legal restrictions on sending indentured children. It didn’t stop kidnapping of children, but it certainly accounted for only a small minority of indentures, & those were completely illegal (though the victim would probably find that hard to prove once spirited away).

I was not talking about indentured servitude. I was talking about the kids who were kidnapped all over the country and sent to serve as slaves in the colonies, or even in UK manufactures. The word kidnapper even originates from this practice, so I doubt it was such low scale as you mention (kid-nappers).

Basically it wasn’t a race vs race thing, as I said previously, but some “capitalists” who took whichever manpower was easy to find, be it africans, kids… whatever they could easily nab.

Nic

Or maybe the 3000$ cost per hour was never realistic?

Nic

Not EVER going to happen. Why? The arabs dont want to live in peace with Israel. They want them gone (perferably dead). They have since 48. If you cant see that, it must be antisemitism.

The reason why israel’s neighbours don’t want peace with israel is because the US destroys any layman state in the region. Libya, Syria, Iraq… everything that looks like a layman state is subject of some form of salafist insurection disguised as peaceful protests. If you put the muslim brothers (which is a fundamentalist organisation created by the CIA) in power in every neighbour of Israel, there’s no way peace will ever happen.

Sad truth is nobody wants peace. Israel is too small and it needs a couple more wars to seize some land.

Nic

I was particularly thinking about the French Air Force having initially ordered single seat Rafales then after experiencing combat in Bosnia deciding that two seat planes were better and I suppose safer.

Situational awareness must be improved on a CAS mission with two sets of eyes in the cockpit, I would have thought?

IIRC, the Armée de l’Air decided to switch again for more single seaters after getting its first experience with the Rafale.

Nic