Can you give me the link please?

It is in here:
http://www.luftwaffe-experten.org/forums/index.php?act=idx

In the “Luftwaffe Archyology” section, and need account.

but I am on different computer, do not remember password, so no link right now, sorry.

Such obvious deception – it’s clearly part of the swiss army penknife that Ken Williams used to remove a piece of shrapnel from Churchill’s knee during a visit to the Stork.

…but if it isn’t, definitely isn’t, then he might still be interested in buying it, anyway!

Sorry Flying Pencil…..we like you really!

I should have refreshed the page before I posted.
But Robbo, I thought it was the tip of the knife Ken Williams used to stop bullets from hitting Churchill in the first place, with a piece of the brave knife causing the flesh wound on Sir Churchill.

Since is seem unlikely to be a Do17 part, then I can get a discount on it. :diablo:

How long does my post need to run for before it gets “Sticky” status 🙂

I think your thread has surpassed sticky already.

BTW, in a parallel discussion on your item, someone posted an image that not only shows the hatch in the open position, is also has the placard mounted in the correct position!
(color is still wrong. It’s all black and white.)

LW206, I hope you do not bare a grudge after my little debate here. 🙂

The RAFM team sent me a DVD of the 4 to 5 hours of survey video they took of the Goodwin Sands 17z. They told me (via the diver) that the cowling area has been reduced to fragments and looking at the video, as he held up some of the pieces, it is in really sorry shape.

Yes, I wanted to ask if you would be willing to allow the RAFM to use your panel to make copies if they plan a major restoration (not sure if they decided, working on salvage first).

That is see what Andy will show. 🙂

Your is in remarkably good condition, especially being on the bottom side of the cowling.

Speaking of color, can you check out that RLM65 over there?

(runs)

Richard….you have a lot to answer for finding this b****y thing!

You’d feel much better if you just gave it away and forgot about it. Do you have my address? You know it makes sense.

HEY! if it wasn’t for me, you would not even post! Send it my way, pls.
My address is….

(but seriously Richard, if you do want to sell, I have some space on a local museum wall…
Of course need to hide it from my wife..!)

And just when i was beginning to think it was all over :rolleyes:

Neva! 😉

Look at the bright side, we doubled your post count! :diablo:

Although i said i wouldnt…i did clean a tiny area with some water last night, and the colour beneath the grime is much lighter. I am tempted to clean the whole panel, but like the thought that the grime has been caused by the exhaust gas during several trips over the channel in 1940!! 😀

I agree with Andy (only cos i want a cheap stall at Shoreham :D) re the drawing. And an important note is just that, it’s a drawing, not a photograph! I’m sure the accuracy of such a small part of the aircraft (corner radius and data plate placement) would not have been of major importance?

Richard

Excellent!
The color was a major concern by me, but I suspected it was dirt and oil made it darker, looking green.

No need to wash it all, LW206, but I do not think it will devalue the part.
Cars and airplanes are best when clean, and a clean panel will show its original paint as made. It is not a Tiffany brass lamp, where a shiny lamp stand will stand out.

….

Brian, sorry and point taken.

I’m a bit tetchy since Flying Pencils statement “This is not a DO17z hatch” when he clearly was not sure, so should not have made such a statement 😡

I have owned, and seen quite a lot of rubbish over the years, so to be given something from such a watertight source, only for it to be debated to distruction, is somewhat frustrating!

Andy knows his stuff and has added, as well as others, some good positive information, which will compliment the parts, so i’m happy. Still be good to get a photo though.

…and to that I apologize, I was too strong with the wording.
If I knew more about you I would not have been so cautious.

You mean a photo of Andy’s panel?

Joe

I don’t know about anyone else, but the panel in the handbook illustration looks pretty much like the one in the image posted by LW206. I’d say a perfect match, in fact! The instruction/warning label seems in the right place – and it may just be my imagination but I think I can also see the smaller thin instruction plate, too? The example I found consisted of about half of the panel with rivets holes for the labels but no labels. It was also found rammed into the remnants of the Bramo Fafnir. By the way, in your image you can also clearly see the apperture for the hand cranking handle just above the panel in question.

As to paint samples….I have all the usual sources for post-war paint samples (eg Monogram, Karl Ries etc etc) although have enough samples of the real things (some hanging on my office wall!) to be quite familiar with how that colour looks.

Andy, if you look at the hinge line to the location of the placard, you will see it is 90* off. Hinge lines for panels are always toward the direction of flight (few exceptions), meaning the on the LW206 panel it would be long axis aligned to flight. The one in the scan I provided shows it mounted perpendicular. This was 1 issue, plus the suggested square vs rectangular shape of this panel set off alarm bells. Yet it was not outside the realm of minor variations on a detail.

And that hole, maybe.
Look at the 17P picture, the rod does not go though that location but elsewhere. It may be the hole for a 17z Bramo, not a 17p BMW.

Joe

I have recovered a near identical access hatch (damage prevents an absolute comparison but what I have matches EXACTLY this item) from a Dornier 17-Z wreck and cannot agree that the colour is “wrong”. Looks Hellblau to me!! The interior colour is right, too.

As the original posters says, he did not intend to open a debate about the originality of the piece….but I felt I had to comment. As to the data plate; CERTAINLY from an identifiable Dornier 17-Z.

Andy,
That is excellent you have a like panel, it will certainly verify the authenticity of item. I 100% believe you but for my research I would like to see a picture of it, compare, take notes, etc.

I am sure you understand that today the market is flooded with counterfeit items and it will help LW206 to confirm it.

I can see the possibility the paint is Hellblau, but Hellblau is about the same color as this forum while the panel is somewhat darker.

No question on the authenticity of the data plate.

Andy,

Appreciate your input…..thanks.

Joe,

You asked “So what can we do to verify it’s authenticity”…. The answer to that is “Nothing” as i don’t need to do this, and sorry, but not prepared to conduct needless experiments to prove what i already know and have not asked proof for either!!

I repeat, the authenticity of this piece is NOT in question as far as i’m concerned. This post was started in the hope i could find where on a DO17z this panel was fitted AND hopefully get a photograph to compliment it.

Thanks everyone for your positive input.

Richard

Richard, regardless of what you think, getting irrefutable proof on that panel will greatly help you.

When I first started to look into it, I thought it was from 17z, but the more I looked, the less certain I was (for example, I could not find any reference to the hatch or placards in the technical manual).
It simply had too many questions.

Andy said he personally recovered a like panel, and I highly regard his experiance and have revised my opinion of the item.

Brilliant link!

cheers
Baz

Baz, that is picture of 17P, not a 17Z. They have different engines, so take that image with a grain of salt.

Eliminate all doubt for everyone sake and leave a record for future researchers.

Sincerely,

Joe